777 down

[Don Plumley]

Originally Posted by Aragorn

This has been one of the most concise stories I have read about this from a news site on the web so far:

BBC News - Malaysia Airlines: What we know about flight MH370

Wow, actual reporting and less conjecture and hyperbole. Thanks for sharing.

[gordner]

Originally Posted by ossiblue

Here's my thoughts, given the little we really know and the amount of time that has passed.

I'm doubting a hijacking or pilot suicide because even though a human could turn off the transponder, I doubt they could disable the telemetry sent by the engines. Both these systems ended transmission at the same time.

I'm beginning to lean toward a westward change in course as indicated by military radar because the primary area has been saturated with search vessels for six days, and the Malaysian military explanations of the radar information seems logical. Still, I would feel better if it could be confirmed the blip was flight 370.

I'm also leaning toward a catastrophe in the cockpit, such as a rapidly spreading electrical fire--something that has happened to a lesser degree on three previous 777 planes. This could account for the loss of transponder voice communications and telemetry. It could allow the pilots to still fly the plane and attempt to return to Kuala Lumpur, making a west/south turn. What happened next, who knows? Set auto pilot due smoke in cockpit and plane flew on until fuel ran out? Tried to land by visuals and over shot Malaysia?

Obviously, another speculation but in spite of little if any brand new information, the slow addition of small factioids has me leaning in a new direction. I think sooner or later, bits of debris will be found--maybe washed up on a coastal beach--west of Malasia, quite possible in the Indian Ocean.

I have no idea what happened to the aircraft and do not yet subscribe to a hypothesis, but it would be a technologically simple feat to create a jammer device to disrupt all communications, voice and telemetric, from inside the aircraft. i am willing to be a device like that these days could probably be contained in a fake phone or something like that.
I do not believe this to be probable, but I think nothing right now can be eliminated based on what is known.

[dafischer]

This is interesting...the US has an "indication" that the plane went down in the Indian Ocean.

US Officials Have 'Indication' Malaysia Airline Crashed into Indian Ocean - Yahoo

[ckissick]

This is all so mysterious, I couldn't help but think of the TV show, "Lost".

[oldE]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

I especially liked OldE's explanation of radar/transponders, I'm going to steal that.

Paul,
I'm blushing!
Glad you appreciated it.
(I'm a heritage interpreter at a tidal power plant, so I'm used to trying to explain technical stuff to non-technical folks.)

Best
Les

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by dafischer

This is interesting...the US has an "indication" that the plane went down in the Indian Ocean.

US Officials Have 'Indication' Malaysia Airline Crashed into Indian Ocean - Yahoo

You have to think that there are military intelligence sources, both US and other, that have some additional information. It's just a matter of how much they want to disclose, and risk tipping their hand.

[Rinty]

This is where I go, for aviation disaster news:

Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost - PPRuNe Forums

I lost my step sister and her husband in the Tripoli crash a few years ago, and the site was very helpful in helping me to understand what happened.

As a former private pilot, I can't understand some of the terms used, but I can usually find explanations with Google.

[ossiblue]

Originally Posted by Rinty

This is where I go, for aviation disaster news:

Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost - PPRuNe Forums

I lost my step sister and her husband in the Tripoli crash a few years ago, and the site was very helpful in helping me to understand what happened.

As a former private pilot, I can't understand some of the terms used, but I can usually find explanations with Google.

Very interesting site, thanks Rinty.

From that site, some interesting tech information about the engine reporting. In short, apparently it's possible for the system on board to be trying to locate a station to relay data to Rolls ("ping", much like a cell phone searching for a tower), and not actually transmit any data. That could account of the apparent conflict in reporting that the engines continued to run for approx. four hours, but Rolls didn't receive any data since before the loss of radar contact. Possibly the U.S. was able to pick up the pings and monitor them for several hours. Add to that, the fact the U.S. had no reason to analyze or identify the pings when received in real time and the difficulty in going back and trying to find specific data amidst thousands of other electronic inputs recorded in the interim makes it plausible the plane did make it somewhere over the Indian Ocean.

I have no doubt the U.S. may have additional information, not yet released. I'm giving some credibility to this latest report but am waiting for a more substantial reason for the Indian Ocean search than "an indication."

[Rinty]

Originally Posted by ossiblue

I have no doubt the U.S. may have additional information, not yet released. I'm giving some credibility to this latest report but am waiting for a more substantial reason for the Indian Ocean search than "an indication."

If they do, then releasing it into the public domain may indirectly disclose a technical capability which the U.S has, and which the government would prefer other intelligence agencies not know about.

[fast_e_man]

Let's hope that's the case, I don't want a repeat of blabbing about how we got bin laden.

[HardDrive]

Originally Posted by Rinty

If they do, then releasing it into the public domain may indirectly disclose a technical capability which the U.S has, and which the government would prefer other intelligence agencies not know about.

I think this is the case.

[matt f]

Originally Posted by Rinty

This is where I go, for aviation disaster news:

Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost - PPRuNe Forums

I lost my step sister and her husband in the Tripoli crash a few years ago, and the site was very helpful in helping me to understand what happened.

As a former private pilot, I can't understand some of the terms used, but I can usually find explanations with Google.

Rinty,

I'm sorry for your loss.
Thank you for the website, good source.

Matt

[HardDrive]

Best explanation of the data the US is relying on. The on board system was not transmitting data. But the lower level device in charge of transmission continued to negotiate with the network to keep the connection open.

Missing plane sent signals to satellite for hours | National & World News | Seattle News, Weather, Sports, Breaking News | KOMO News

[Rinty]

Thanks, Matt.

[Baz]

ABC is reporting that 2 US officials told them the 2 reporting systems the pilots have control over shutdown separately. The data reporting system shut down at 1:07 and the transponder shut down at 1:21 which suggests that it wasn't a catastrophic mechanical failure.

[jyl]

Interesting if US electronic surveillance recorded and identified the pings of a commercial jet's engine telemetry system in the Gulf of Thailand, not so far from China. Would say something about how thorough US electronic surveillance and data processing in that area may be. Would also suggest a possible reason why the Malaysian govt denied the reports. Maybe the US didn't tell them. Maybe they were told but asked to keep it secret. Maybe the Malaysian military radar contact was a cover for the engine telemetry data monitoring. Lots of speculation possible. I am going to say the honest and evil truth, which is that I'm kind of enjoying this puzzle. I'm sorry hundreds of people had to die, most likely, but the story is fascinating.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Quote de ossiblue

I have no doubt the U.S. may have additional information, not yet released. I'm giving some credibility to this latest report but am waiting for a more substantial reason for the Indian Ocean search than "an indication."

If they do, then releasing it into the public domain may indirectly disclose a technical capability which the U.S has, and which the government would prefer other intelligence agencies not know about.

Exactly. I'm sure we don't want China to know the extent of our data gathering capability right in their backyard.

[rusnak]

Especially if they're so proud of their Harbor Freight satellite technology

[allaircooled]

Originally Posted by rusnak

Especially if they're so proud of their Harbor Freight satellite technology

I don't know why, but that comment made me laugh pretty hard just now.

[Baz]

Virginia-class submarine

Improved sonar systems

Virginia class submarines are equipped with a bow-mounted spherical active/passive sonar array, a wide aperture lightweight fiber optic sonar array (three flat panels mounted low along either side of the hull), as well as two high frequency active sonars mounted in the sail and keel (under the bow). The submarines are also equipped with a low frequency towed sonar array and a high frequency towed sonar array.[14] The chin-mounted (below the bow) high frequency sonar supplements the (spherical/LAB) main sonar array enabling safer operations in coastal waters as well as improving ASW performance.[15][16]

Virginia-class submarine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia