Haqve we reached "peak engine"?

[island911]

Originally Posted by David

I think we're a long way from internal combustion engines going away at least not until battery technology takes a huge leap forward.

I do expect nearly all vehicles to be some form of hybrid relatively soon. There's just too much energy wasted in braking not recover as much as possible.

Here's some new technology that may better integrate ICE's with electric motors:

Is this grad student's transmission the future of hypercars? | Autoweek

Nice!

[manbridge 74]

Nope.
Nowhere close.

[flipper35]

Where do we get all those precious metals for the fuel cells to replace the millions of engines produced every year?

[rusnak]

Exactly. Huge leaps in logic. It's like a reality distortion field surrounds the whole EV myth.

[Por_sha911]

^^^
"Dreams do come true, if only we wish hard enough." - Peter Pan

[red-beard]

Oh - on land based battery systems, one point I like to make to people is that lead is the most recycled substance, more percentage than aluminum. Lithium is not recycled. It is five times more costly to recycle lithium than to buy "virgin".

Advanced Lead-Acid may not be the right battery for mobile applications, but stationary it is.

[afterburn 549]

Smoky Yunick took one to the grave
What Ever Happened To Smokey's Hot-Vapor Engine? - Hot Rod Magazine
Besides his, there are at least a 100 more designs floating around.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

Sounds great. Your example proves that EV is a specialty car like a tool you only use to time your cams. Works great but don't need it 99% of the time.
What about the other 70% if us that don't live in urban areas? Oh, never mind. We've already been down that road in other threads.

80% of the US popultion is urban

https://ask.census.gov/faq.php?id=5000&faqId=5971

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

Smoky Yunick took one to the grave
What Ever Happened To Smokey's Hot-Vapor Engine? - Hot Rod Magazine
Besides his, there are at least a 100 more designs floating around.

The thermodynamics don't sound very good. On a Gas Turbine, you compress the air, add fuel to heat it, then expand it over the turbine. One way to reduce fuel consumption is to preheat the compressed air with exhaust heat exchangers before adding fuel. This is called "regeneration".

The problem with the above article is the heating is taking place BEFORE compression. This will further increase the temp and the compression energy in the cylinder. Most times to increase power, you want to cool the air before it enters the engine. Intercoolers are used on multistage compressors to reduce temperature and compression energy in downstream stages. It is a loser for fuel efficiency, but a winner for power.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Seahawk

I agree. A friend of mine lives in Arlington, Va and works at the Pentagon. The Metro stop is a block away.

He has an EV that, in the DC metro area works perfectly well.

We met for a meeting north of Baltimore last week and he showed up in a Zipcar. The Zipcar place is a five miles away. He Ubered there then drove to the meeting. He can also park his EV at their lot for free. He uses them or Enterprise when he need long range driving.

He went from three cars (suburban home) to one car without a hitch.

The wife has an EV that has enough range to get her to school and back (barely), her studio and other errands being closer and easy. These days I mostly ride the moto to the office but now can take the metro train to main campus. I walk from the station to campus, Lyft from the station home (or walk - could do a folding bike).

We could drop down to one car (and even have it be EV) with the other options now available (rentals, zip, lyft). Only complication is gigging when I need to haul gear and if on the same night the wife needs the car. But probably a work around there as well.

Gas is overkill for most trips I see people taking - except for those that live in the outskirts and commute 2 hours into town. I don't see how that is a thing, but the "American dream" of home (and car) ownership drives some people to extreme solutions.

[rusnak]

Ok, now the EV thing is making sense. It's not for me. I am not a hamster living in Zootopia. But if you are, then for you it's fabulous because you can recycle everything from the battery to your farts, which are fuel.

I just love the gas is overkill comment. W-O-W.

[sc_rufctr]

Originally Posted by flipper35

Where do we get all those precious metals for the fuel cells to replace the millions of engines produced every year?

If (& that's a big IF) we could mine asteroids we'd have all the precious metals we'd ever need.

A futurist recently predicted that the person who worked out how to do this would be the worlds first Trillionaire.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by nostatic

80% of the US popultion is urban
https://ask.census.gov/faq.php?id=5000&faqId=5971

a) People on Long Island NY live in an urban area but would never be able to get anywhere with EVs: in traffic they still need heat and AC
b) People in urban areas are less likely to own a vehicle due to mass transit.
c) Should we just say to heck with the other 20% (more like 50%) let them walk?

[wdfifteen]

I have some of each. They all have their place. I admit my situation isn't typical, but the ICE has peaked as the primary power plant for me. It went from the only "choice" to a real choice of which vehicle/fuel system to use. Choice is good.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr

If (& that's a big IF) we could mine asteroids we'd have all the precious metals we'd ever need.

A futurist recently predicted that the person who worked out how to do this would be the worlds first Trillionaire.

Actually, most asteroids are rock.

[red-beard]

The largest M type asteroid is Psyche, it is 16th in size order and it makes up 1% of the mass of the Asteroid belt.

It is about 90% metallic and weighs 22,700,000,000,000,000 Metric Tons. The metal should be about 90% iron with the rest mostly nickle. Psyche should contain 18,387,000,000,000,000 Metric Tons.

2014 world production of Iron: 3,200,000,000

At this rate, it would be 5.7 million years of world production. It is a BIT far away. At closest approach, it is about 180 Million miles away (300 Million Kilometers)

[Flieger]

Originally Posted by flipper35

Where do we get all those precious metals for the fuel cells to replace the millions of engines produced every year?

From all the catalytic converters that will be obsolete...

Fuel cell futures no longer a dream - SAE International

"Similarly, the amount of platinum used has already been successfully reduced to nearly the benchmark level of that used in the catalytic converters for internal combustion engines. GM’s Equinox fuel cells used 80 gm (2.8 oz) of platinum and the 2011 Clarity FCV used 30 gm (1.05 oz). Catalytic converters typically use 10 gm (.35 oz), according to Pivovar."

Which should go even farther with the right lattice structure:

Novel nanocatalysts for fuel cells - SAE International

Or you can skip the Platinum all together...

Rethinking the route to lower-cost fuel cells - SAE International

"Opting for the high end of the pH range has an advantage: it enables replacement of platinum catalysts with cheaper metals like nickel or silver, Yan explained. “A basic operating environment is better," he said, "because many catalytic metals are much more stable, while everything dissolves in acid, including platinum.”"

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

a) People on Long Island NY live in an urban area but would never be able to get anywhere with EVs: in traffic they still need heat and AC
b) People in urban areas are less likely to own a vehicle due to mass transit.
c) Should we just say to heck with the other 20% (more like 50%) let them walk?

a) EVs have heat and AC
b) maybe (though not sure on those numbers) but that's even better for traffic
c) no one is trying to pry your car out of your cold dead hands

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by rusnak

Ok, now the EV thing is making sense. It's not for me. I am not a hamster living in Zootopia. But if you are, then for you it's fabulous because you can recycle everything from the battery to your farts, which are fuel.

I just love the gas is overkill comment. W-O-W.

Most vehicles are complete overkill for the tasks they are fulfilling. Of course in 'Merica we need 500hp to run to the Starbucks because...'Merica.

Buy and drive what you want.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by nostatic

EVs have heat and AC

EV's using heat or AC in stop and go traffic will be out of juice long before arrival.
Look. You want an EV? Got get yourself one. Just don't ask me to fund poor technology with my taxes.