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Back in the saddle again
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Central TX west of Houston
Posts: 56,031
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Steve '08 Boxster RS60 Spyder #0099/1960 - never named a car before, but this is Charlotte. '88 targa ![]() |
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Registered
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Linn County, Oregon
Posts: 48,529
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Ya want a lighter Pony Car? Hmmm, seems it's already been done.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeVwjHzXRPI
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"Now, to put a water-cooled engine in the rear and to have a radiator in the front, that's not very intelligent." -Ferry Porsche (PANO, Oct. '73) (I, Paul D. have loved this quote since 1973. It will remain as long as I post here.) |
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Administrator
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 13,333
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The 991.1 GT3 time was 1:27.2, if I remember right. I believe the 991.2 time will be significantly faster, leaving my 1:26.8 in the dust.
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Another factor is that the chassis that can handle 650 hp has to be extremely strong/rigid, which means more weight. Quote:
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Jack Olsen 1972 911 My new video about my garage. • A video from German TV about my 911 |
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: NW Ohio
Posts: 9,733
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I sat in a new Chevy Camaro when they first came out at the Detroit Auto show, and wasn't impressed. I felt like a small child unable to see over the window sills, the plastic interior trim was chintzy at best, the seats felt way too firm with buldges in the wrong spots, and just felt really big.
I also sat in a new Mustang GT that day, and although the interior trim wasn't much better, I liked everything about it, and had no other complaints. I realize that these top of the line performance packages are absolute cutting edge with thier power, and grip levels, but unless you are abusing these cars regularly at track days, or illegally carving canyon roads at rediculous speeds, you will never use half of these car's capabilities. I also would choose the Mustang over the Camaro any day of the week for the same reasons they did in the video....it looks, sounds, and feels better than the Chevy. |
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if the new camaro didn't look like the 69 after 40 years and too many donuts and botox it might be OK. Not a good looking car...Not at all. No HP would talk me into owning one. The original 69 had better visibility as well.
rjp
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Woodlands TX
Posts: 3,946
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I was talking about the zl1 1le vs current gt3, by magazine fanboi racing analysis it is nearly as fast. It depends on how you define nearly and how much magnification you want to put the available data under, but in general it is a very fast track car given it is 100% street car. this is impressive to me considering it is a camaro and relatively inexpensive (at least compared to a gt3)
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Woodlands TX
Posts: 3,946
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visibility seem terrible though, agreed
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Linn County, Oregon
Posts: 48,529
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Guys, check out my youtube link above. It's a Jay Leno Garage bit, a firm that replaced the body of a 350GTR with all carbon fiber, shaving a bunch of weight.
Another of those fun things the wealthy can do, I guess. Cost? $70,000 was mentioned. As I hinted at in my opening post, all pretty useless for any real world driving. Unless you are a track junkie, one can't use what these type cars are capable of. Trapped in a traffic jam on I-5, the stop & go making my clutch leg weary, I look over at Cindy and said that it was times like these that made me really wish I had 500 horsepower. Hey, my '09 Bullitt Mustang, with it's modest 315 horsepower is slow, old, and obsolete. That kinda fits it's owner... In crowded traffic? Good air conditioning and a stereo are more important than power and handling. A sad indictment of the time we live in, but there it is.
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"Now, to put a water-cooled engine in the rear and to have a radiator in the front, that's not very intelligent." -Ferry Porsche (PANO, Oct. '73) (I, Paul D. have loved this quote since 1973. It will remain as long as I post here.) |
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Unregistered
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: a wretched hive of scum and villainy
Posts: 55,652
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Crash testing requires design changes.
Back in my day a guy could roll down the driver's side window and hang his elbow out the window and be comfortable and coooool. But to meet the crash test requirements for side impact, they need to raise the belt line of the door and reinforce it and install air bags and all kinds of nanny crap. That ruins the lines of the car and makes them heavy. Now the bottom of the door window is at the driver's ear and there's no way to hang an arm out the window. It's kinda like riding in the back of a pick up, no way to do it and look cool at the same time (Gallagher). |
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Woodlands TX
Posts: 3,946
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My exige weighs just over 2000 lbs is actually quite comfortable once inside. I consider it a modern poor mans RS. It is admittedly a pita to live with on the road sometimes. Reduced weight is the noblest pusuit in automotive engineering but there aren't alot of drivers to get too crazy with it. If you go to the track alot you are better off building something for yourself, and on the road the portly fast cars make are sensible. Hell some of these high powered cars even get good mpg.
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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(the shotguns)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 21,647
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sat in a new mustang the other day. most definitely not a car for the claustrophobic. how something can be nearly twice the size of my dear departed 911 and yet feel infinitely less inviting is beyond me .
it is no doubt infinitely safer too. but for the purposes of a car enthusiasts views you can keep the two ton monster. i'll take light and fun any day.
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***************************************** Well i had #6 adjusted perfectly but then just before i tightened it a butterfly in Zimbabwe farted and now i have to start all over again! I believe we all make mistakes but I will not validate your poor choices and/or perversions and subsidize the results your actions. |
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Woodlands TX
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its 33k with a 400+ hp and the track package, handles pretty well and can run way into the 12sec quarter mile
I agree Id much rather have lighter and give up some power, but you dont have alot of options if you are shopping new for this. You could buy a slightly cheaper miata or subaru BRZ which are definitely lighter and more fun, but MUCH slower. Otherwise lower priced performance cars are just a porky the small FWD performance cars are fun to drive though. I rented a fiesta ST for the nurburgring and it was all grins to drive. The world needs a new 2800-2900lbs 300 hp rwd small sedan for 30ishk. I dont think anyone will build one though
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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Cars & Coffee Killer
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: State of Failure
Posts: 32,246
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I bought a 2016 Mustang GT. I considered several cars.
I considered a C6 Corvette, but I kind of wanted a back seat so that I wasn't limited to driving the car without my kids. I considered a new FIAT 124 Spyder, but the engine reliability scared me. I considered a new Miata, but I really don't like the look of them despite being a great car. I considered a BRZ, but that was after test driving the Mustang and was already a little smitten with the Mustang having double the HP. I considered a Ford Focus RS, but dealerships were only taking orders for $20k over sticker (dealt with the same crap trying to find a GT350 at sticker). I can definitely feel that the Mustang is heavy in cornering, and it isn't as tossable as my old RX-8 or 951, but it's a blast to pull out of corners at WOT.
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Some Porsches long ago...then a wankle... 5 liters of VVT fury now -Chris "There is freedom in risk, just as there is oppression in security." |
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Did you get the memo?
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 32,469
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High beltline is for styling, not crash protection. The Camaro feels like a pillbox, the Mustang doesn't. As for weight, I suspect a lot of it is for lack of trying. The Miata is around 2400 lbs and meets every modern crash test. I think the 991 is around 3400 lbs. But with a huge V8 you can be lazy and not sweat every ounce. Besides, the vast majority of Mustang/Camaro customers buy them as cruisers, not corner carvers. Know your customers.....
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‘07 Mazda RX8-8 Past: 911T, 911SC, Carrera, 951s, 955, 996s, 987s, 986s, 997s, BMW 5x, C36, C63, XJR, S8, Maserati Coupe, GT500, etc |
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I read somewhere that ford initiated a big market study to determine if a 15% smaller mustang was the way to go. They really wanted to sell a bunch of these in europe as well. Im not sure of the details but it obviously didnt get any smaller. I think their customers spoke.
New miata is awesome, wish it was available with 30 more HP, and so it Goes......
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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I read somewhere that ford initiated a big market study to determine if a 15% smaller mustang was the way to go. They really wanted to sell a bunch of these in europe as well. Im not sure of the details but it obviously didnt get any smaller. I think their customers spoke.
New miata is awesome, wish it was available with 30 more HP, and so it Goes......
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84 930 07 Exige S |
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Location: Linn County, Oregon
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Legion; Well, the Coyote is no Voodoo flat crank, but you should find the power adequate. If you feel the need for more? Try a set of 350GT heads...they're a bolt on for the 5.0, and definitely improve breathing some..
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"Now, to put a water-cooled engine in the rear and to have a radiator in the front, that's not very intelligent." -Ferry Porsche (PANO, Oct. '73) (I, Paul D. have loved this quote since 1973. It will remain as long as I post here.) Last edited by pwd72s; 07-20-2017 at 10:00 AM.. |
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Location: Linn County, Oregon
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Quote:
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"Now, to put a water-cooled engine in the rear and to have a radiator in the front, that's not very intelligent." -Ferry Porsche (PANO, Oct. '73) (I, Paul D. have loved this quote since 1973. It will remain as long as I post here.) |
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Registered
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Woodlands TX
Posts: 3,946
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yesir the marketing researched seemed to have worked
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