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Groucho Marxist
 
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That is why normal people complain, and soft heads claim the complainers are haters
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Libertarians: Actively plotting to take over the world, so we can leave you alone
Old 11-18-2017, 06:04 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #21 (permalink)
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maybe Musk is really Tesla reincarnated
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Old 11-18-2017, 06:13 AM
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Musk is good at what he does. He knows how to promote his ideas.
How that pans out in the long run remains to be seen but he's had a positive effect on the auto industry.

If money wasn't an issue I'd buy a Tesla just to see what they're all about.
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Old 11-18-2017, 06:31 AM
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One story I read a major long haul trucking firm said the truck has about a 600 mile range (compared to 1800 mile diesel) and is going to be in the heaviest weight class, reducing it's payload quite a bit over diesel. A charge takes a lot longer than filling a tank.
They said it was a total no go for them, but it might be useful for local deliveries in cities.
Again not ready for prime time.
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Old 11-18-2017, 06:55 AM
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Too many people have drank Musk's kool-aid and continue to throw money at his dreams that produce nothing the average person (or now, company) can use. His scam keeps growing with new ideas to keep the taxpayer's funds rolling in.
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Old 11-18-2017, 07:00 AM
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^yep

What is the market capitalization vs projected sales?

And because they are not making profit in each unit sold, can they make it up in volume?

= need more interesting Future story to sell. Perhaps a chart showing the future with a red line going up and to the right. Perhaps a 3D model of a Death Tesla-Star to be built out in the moon's orbit. Think of the light it would provide on nights of a new moon.
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Old 11-18-2017, 07:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy View Post
Yup. All of those amazing new products are offered with an ever so low buy-in to get on the wait list! A nice scheme for a company that is hemmoraging cash and unable to get anywhere near their promised production rate for the new Model 3. They are grossly behind schedul on the 3, what idiot in their right mind thinks they can get into full production on their first semi in two years?
Preston Tucker and his colleagues were indicted and tried for similar tactics in the 1940's...selling accessories and dealerships for cars that were not yet in existence. Ultimately he was acquitted but with all assets and progress seized for the trial his company was bankrupt once the trial was finished. How times have changed, and haven't.
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Old 11-18-2017, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy View Post
Except Musk did it on the government’s dime.
It's not the government's money, it's your money! Government is perhaps best at taking $ from voters and giving it to special interests that fund their campaigns.

That why when states and cities give tax breaks to Disney, Hugh has to pay more in taxes.

GE getting $25M in tax breaks from Boston, that money has to be made up somewhere.

Amazon being thrown billion $ tax breaks for the second headquarters...

Ultimately we only have ourselves to blame for not demanding election reform, spending reform, accountability when grants and tax breaks are given, etc.

Fact is whether it's a new football stadium or a Fortune 500 move or technology driven grants or gross mispending on military, we can all cry and complain but nothing is going change until voters have their own K Street representation.

Or serious government reform which is obviously laughable.
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Old 11-18-2017, 07:45 AM
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I think Shaun makes a very valid point. There are gifts to profitable businesses that don't need the money, while everyone is bent out of shape when money is given to someone who might actually be changing the way transportation works.

In an ideal world Musk would take all the risk himself. The world is not ideal.

He has a history of over promising, then delivering something slightly less than he promised, but he always delivers something.

I think the craziest claim he made was that his truck recharging network will be 100% solar powered. That is a long long way off....

Also, if you watched the live reveal, he is a terrible public speaker. Absolutely terrible.
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Old 11-18-2017, 08:22 AM
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Sounds like Tesla owes everyone who pays taxes a new car. Unless he pays us back.
Old 11-18-2017, 08:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ltusler View Post
Sounds like Tesla owes everyone who pays taxes a new car. Unless he pays us back.
I'm waiting for free Patriots SuperBowl tickets and an F35.
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Old 11-18-2017, 08:59 AM
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Why wouldn't an established automotive powerhouse purchase Tesla...... I know it is currently over-valued...... but........ when the money drain eventually catches up to value wouldn't the product fit nicely into an established marketing, manufacturing and distribution network..... and again I understand the valuation issue..... if this were a start-up candy bar hershey would have already purchased and integrated.....

Lorry..... Electric makes no sense except in urban environment.... now autonomous drive that can extend vehicle utilization and uptime..... that becomes transformative.....
Old 11-18-2017, 09:06 AM
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^^^

they may be in talks, we won't know until something happens but my guess is they aren't. Any M&A consultant would advise to wait for a negative watershed moment for Tesla. Of course the gamble is one may never come.

I can see licensing from Tesla and imagine FedEx and UPS are looking into it.

There is a ton of motor freight from NJ and PA to New England. Electric makes a ton of sense.
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Last edited by Shaun @ Tru6; 11-18-2017 at 10:04 AM..
Old 11-18-2017, 10:02 AM
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Truckers need dependability and access to quick and reasonable repair no matter where they are. Neither are in the electric equation at this time other than maybe for the Post Office or local UPS delivery vans.
OTR trucks don't want to use up half of their weight allowance on the vehicle just to have the privilege of getting half the distance between fuel stops.
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Old 11-18-2017, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6 View Post
It's not the government's money, it's your money! Government is perhaps best at taking $ from voters and giving it to special interests that fund their campaigns.

That why when states and cities give tax breaks to Disney, Hugh has to pay more in taxes.

GE getting $25M in tax breaks from Boston, that money has to be made up somewhere.

Amazon being thrown billion $ tax breaks for the second headquarters...

Ultimately we only have ourselves to blame for not demanding election reform, spending reform, accountability when grants and tax breaks are given, etc.

Fact is whether it's a new football stadium or a Fortune 500 move or technology driven grants or gross mispending on military, we can all cry and complain but nothing is going change until voters have their own K Street representation.

Or serious government reform which is obviously laughable.
+!
Get rid of all the subsidies and credits and I'm fine with throwing out subsidies and credits for alternative fuel vehicles. In the mean time, if money is going to get thrown around anyway, I'd like to see some of it thrown at something with a future.
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Old 11-18-2017, 02:41 PM
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A future? Here's what a guy who actually knows the car business has to say:

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/17/tesla-is-going-out-of-business-says-former-gm-exec-bob-lutz.html
Old 11-19-2017, 05:29 AM
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Groucho Marxist
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by island911 View Post
And because they are not making profit in each unit sold, can they make it up in volume?
That is how healthcare is supposed to work. You are not saying you are skeptical that the model works for electric cars are you?

Shaun does make his valid point, again.


People are sick of the way things are, that is how Mr Trump got elected.
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Libertarians: Actively plotting to take over the world, so we can leave you alone
Old 11-19-2017, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cairns View Post
A future? Here's what a guy who actually knows the car business has to say:
Yep. A guy who knows the car business. Lutz was a promoter of electric cars and backed the development of the Volt.

"I believe strongly that this country has to get off oil" he [Lutz] says, sitting beside a massive V-16 engine on display in his office. "The electrification of the automobile is inevitable."

Bob Lutz: The Man Who Revived the Electric Car
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Old 11-19-2017, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdfifteen View Post
Yep. A guy who knows the car business. Lutz was a promoter of electric cars and backed the development of the Volt.

"I believe strongly that this country has to get off oil" he [Lutz] says, sitting beside a massive V-16 engine on display in his office. "The electrification of the automobile is inevitable."

Bob Lutz: The Man Who Revived the Electric Car

He did not say electric was failing...... he said the bleed at Tesla was not sustainable.....
Old 11-19-2017, 06:44 AM
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No one is buying this company.
TSLA has a market cap of $30 BILLION. Same as GM.
And their IP / patents are open source.
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Old 11-19-2017, 08:27 AM
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