Guards Red/Indischrot color correction

[Jonny042]

I'm posting this because I've seen many threads and much confusion over this color, and wanted to share my experience dealing with this paint.

Introducing the Rot Rod:



It is certainly photogenic, in all sorts of lights, but in reality it's a bit of a turd. Calling it a beater would be too unkind, but it definitely is a driver. When it comes to this car, I tend to spend more time on suspension setup, than polishing.



The car has mostly original paint, with exception of the RF fender (it's been repaired and painted with BC/CC (of course ). Also the rockers and front and rear valance have been re-coated along the way.

The original paint has a really neat patina to it, that doesn't come across in photographs. Suffice to say I've gone from hating Red cars to loving this one (it followed me home, honest!!)



I noticed this in the door jamb and it made me wonder if Guards Red was particular when it comes to primer color. Not sure what this means exactly and I wasn't able to come up with anything on a search.



To be continued... it gets more interesting I promise!

[Jonny042]

In my quest to make the car lighter and faster I was bolting on some Euro Bumper shocks which necessitated removing the front bumper. I was really struck by the difference in the paint that has been hidden under the "smile" all these years, and also under the headlight washer sprayers.

I immediately went to work with a bit of 2500 and some compound, and did a 50/50 test on the horizontal part of the bumper.



I could hardly believe my eyes! The fresh paint hidden under the old layer of crud is far lighter and brighter than 99% of the car. The headlight ring is freshly sprayed GR that I assumed was a poor match. Turns out it's almost perfect!

[Jonny042]

I did some more testing on various areas. The difference is very distinct. I did try a few different methods, including trying without sanding: A few more progress shots:











Hood (note the light stripe, that's a test area):




Rear fender (original "stained" paint on left, sanded/compounded/polished on right:

[Bob Kontak]

Interested in what that sticker means. Traditional 21 Line Glasurit is (was) single stage urethane (enamel) with hardener.

When I stripped my 81 down there was paint, primer and then a base primer that chemical stripper would not even touch.

I left the base intact. Used the two part primer from Glasurit and then the two part color, although 22 Line, that had the lead removed.

Don't understand the two coat. That sticker has been painted over. Wonder if "manufacturer instructions" refers to the paint manufacturer? Is that sticker Porsche?

[Bob Kontak]

Clearing off the cooties brings out the true "tomato" hint of the color.

Nice work.

[Jonny042]

I'm probably 30 hours into this now, and almost done:









It's a little bit tedious, but the results are astounding. Hoping to get it into natural light this weekend (only have the roof left to do).

So what's the moral of the story? I always thought that red paint would oxidize and get lighter over time, but I'm wondering if that's more of a clear coat phenomenon? Certainly if you were to try and match the old paint with new guards red (like I did) you wouldn't have much luck.

Oh, and it case it needs to be said, don't do this at home unless you are really comfortable with the process. This car has a dent/gouge/scratch/crease on every single panel and really does need some bodywork and paint, so this experiment was worth the trouble - it will get me through a few more years until there's room in the queue

[nathanbs]

I'm guessing the two coat is referring to an important under color or ground color if you will, like perhaps white for example. The finished color relies on the under color brightening up the top color by the top color being just slightly transparent enough for it to make a difference.

[nathanbs]

looks amazing by the way

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

Interested in what that sticker means. Traditional 21 Line Glasurit is (was) single stage urethane (enamel) with hardener.

When I stripped my 81 down there was paint, primer and then a base primer that chemical stripper would not even touch.

I left the base intact. Used the two part primer from Glasurit and then the two part color, although 22 Line, that had the lead removed.

Don't understand the two coat. That sticker has been painted over. Wonder if "manufacturer instructions" refers to the paint manufacturer? Is that sticker Porsche?

I know it looks to have been painted over but it isn't - the sticker actually has a clear backing and the 45 degree dog ear corners are a part of it, not a hokey masking job. The paint is original in the jambs (and most of the car). There is, however, a coat of white directly under the red top coat so I wonder if that's what it refers to?

Like I said I can find no other reference anywhere, for the "two coat enamel" thing.

The car is most definitely single stage! Been washing a lot of microfiber towels lately!!!

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

I'm guessing the two coat is referring to an important under color or ground color if you will, like perhaps white for example. The finished color relies on the under color brightening up the top color by the top color being just slightly transparent enough for it to make a difference.

I hear you but that paint covers fast.

I would call it opaque.

Just my take. I don't know.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Jonny042

I know it looks to have been painted over but it isn't - the sticker actually has a clear backing and the 45 degree dog ear corners are a part of it, not a hokey masking job.

I see what you are saying. Those 45 angles are too crisp to be a masking job.

Perhaps added afterwards as part of the BC/CC repairs?

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

I hear you but that paint covers fast.

I would call it opaque.

Just my take. I don't know.

Yeah, the pigments are ridiculous, it covers so well. One thing was really interesting, when I first started sanding the sludge coming of the paint was basically brown, but after a few strokes it would go BRIGHT red. The pigmentation is unreal. I guess that's why red is so much more expensive that other colors, which never occurred to me until I went to buy the paint for the add-on bits below.

I painted the mini-duck (Thanks Johan!!) and the H1 headlight rings, different colors underneath, but no discernible difference.

One thing about this paint, it's gorgeous when you get it polished up so it looks like it's just been sprayed. I don't care what anyone says, single stage rocks!

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

I see what you are saying. Those 45 angles are too crisp to be a masking job.

Perhaps added afterwards as part of the BC/CC repairs?

That's quite possible. Unless we can find evidence otherwise, I'd say it's a red herring and can be ignored.

[RSBob]

Amazing results.

Also have a red head which was dull and unloved. Tried 3 stay hand polishing and after 8 hours it looked much better. Then I bought a Griots polisher and the 3 stage cleaner, place lush and wax and was dumbfounded at the difference.

Didn’t have the guts to try sanding. Well done sir

[Discseven]

Jonny... nice comparison you shared---sanded vs non sanded. Am curious what system you used to shoot paint.

[Jonny042]

Oh, I forgot to mention. If anyone is having doubts about their paint, and if it's changed over the years from sun/rain/contaminants, try taking off your hood ornament.

I did, and it was a "Pow! Right between the eyes!" moment. I wish I'd taken a picture but you would swear the color under the badge was 5 shades lighter and far more orange-ish. It also showed me that I hadn't quite sanded/compounded enough and I spent quite a bit more time on the hood.

The misleading part of the entire process is that unless you do a 50/50 split tape line on a panel, you could swear that particular panel didnt need the cleanup, but it was always very obvious once I had a side-by-side display.

[SCadaddle]

Originally Posted by Jonny042

That's quite possible. Unless we can find evidence otherwise, I'd say it's a red herring and can be ignored.

That sticker looked familiar. So I just walked out into my garage, and my 82SC in Platinum Metallic has the exact same sticker in the same spot.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Jonny042

I don't care what anyone says, single stage rocks!

+1

I pulled this relic just now from deep in my stash. I would hate to buy it. To buy and prepare that much paint ready to spray would be many hundreds of dollars.

I see you are using BASF. Sweet. I will go with that when I re-do mine. Glasurit is brutally expensive and a medium PITA to get in Akron. UNO ain't free by any stretch but more obtainable.

[SCadaddle]

[Jonny042]

Originally Posted by RSBob

Amazing results.

Also have a red head which was dull and unloved. Tried 3 stay hand polishing and after 8 hours it looked much better. Then I bought a Griots polisher and the 3 stage cleaner, place lush and wax and was dumbfounded at the difference.

Didn’t have the guts to try sanding. Well done sir

I'm good at sanding because I'm terrible at painting:




Project Heavy Metal - an all steel classic, remastered

The sanding insanity starts around page 9 or 10 I think. The red car has been distracting me from Heavy Metal but there is a chill in the air. Winter is coming and it's time to get back to work!!