Outer Carrera CV Boot

[Hnichols]

Looks like I'm about to be initiated into the mysteries of the 911 CV joint. The car is an '88 Carrera with a torn outboard boot. It's fairly recent, and there's no noise coming from the joints, so I'm just going to replace the boot. Question: do I need to remove the inner joint to get a new boot onto the outboard joint? I gather from my reading that I cannot remove anything from the wheel end (outside) end of the axle. Is that correct? I would prefer not having to touch the inner joint at all.


Thanks!

[dersledite]

Your research is correct, you will have to remove the inner joint to give you the clearance you need to get the boot over the axle to replace the outer side.

[Flat6pac]

At that point, you might as well do a new inner boot too
It’s much easier to remove the whole axel and work on the table
You do have to unbolt the bottom of the shock to get the outer to clear.
Bruce

[Hnichols]

Thanks, dersledite, I was afraid of that. So I have to tear into the inner joint (I'm wondering if I have to clean and regrease it?) and cut off the clamps of the inner boot, but I can't really access the outer joint, which is the one I want to examine and clean. It's nuts.

A check in the minus column in the perennial SC vs. Carrera debate.

[dersledite]

Originally Posted by Hnichols

So I have to tear into the inner joint (I'm wondering if I have to clean and regrease it?)

Yes, you’re going to have to take apart the inner CV joint in order to pull it off the axle. Super messy.

[86 911 Targa]

Looks like I'm in the same "BOOT".

No leaks, no noise, but it will need attention soon.



It has been suggested that due to the age of the car (1986),
and, the mileage (119k), that I just replace the axle.

Gerry

[Canada Kev]

Yes, it's messy, but once you're all dirtied up, it's not that bad. Just plan for it and all will be ok.

Seeing that you're gonna have to pull the inner CV anyway, it's probably a prudent decision to inspect, clean and re-grease it and install a shiny new boot. Same thing with the outer. Then, for all intents and purposes, you'll have a "new" axle on that side.

Probably wouldn't hurt to get two more boots and enough grease to do the other axle; you might have to tackle that one in short order as well. Be sure to inspect the boots for splits or cracking rubber on that one, too, just to be sure.

I don't know what your thoughts are on the CV bolt debate, but you may need hardware on hand to bolt that baby back on to your transmission.

And in order to get the axle bolt (I always replace mine with new - they're only about 5 bucks each, one required for each axle) off, you'll need a big ass breaker bar and, I think, a 32mm socket. I went to the Canadian equivalent of Harbour Freight and bought a 4 foot long, 3/4" drive breaker bar, six inch extension and socket for a few bucks. You might use it once every five or ten years, so high quality isn't necessarily of paramount importance.

When you torque the axle nut back on to its (holy crap) 340ish ft-lbs, I estimated my weight and distance from the end of that breaker bar to get close and then took it to a shop I was friendly with for them to torque to the proper level. A trip to see the service manager at a shop that works on heavy trucks with an offering of a box of beer will likely give you the same result.

Good luck!

[Hnichols]

Originally Posted by 86 911 Targa

Looks like I'm in the same "BOOT".

No leaks, no noise, but it will need attention soon.



It has been suggested that due to the age of the car (1986),
and, the mileage (119k), that I just replace the axle.

Gerry

Yeah, a gather alot of people make that calculus. On my car, the rubber on the three other joints looks like it's in good shape, so I decided to bite the bullet and try just replacing the boot. I may come to regret that decision, though. Sounds like it's going to be a character-building experience for sure.

[Canada Kev]

Originally Posted by 86 911 Targa

Looks like I'm in the same "BOOT".

No leaks, no noise, but it will need attention soon.

It has been suggested that due to the age of the car (1986),
and, the mileage (119k), that I just replace the axle.

Gerry

Gerry, I, too, am in that same position, though your boot looks worse than mine.

I replaced an axle last year due to a torn boot. Once I got the axle off, I discovered some other minor damage that likely was a result of an off road adventure I had about five years prior. That event may have damaged the boot so I had no idea how long it was like that so I just replaced the complete axle and tossed the old one.

This time, I bought a new axle as well, but because the boot on my existing unit is still intact so I know the time and mileage of the failure, I plan to inspect and essentially "rebuild" it when I have some spare time and then box it up and put it on a shelf. That way I'll have a spare one for when the poor quality, can't get good ones any more, rubber boot on my new axle fails.

[Hnichols]

Kevin,
Thanks for the tips. I already broke the axle nut free with a 4' steel pipe over a breaker bar. Not a problem, but it took a helluva lot of force. I was wondering about the accuracy of the bathroom scale technique for reassembly. ...

As for your advice (and Flat6pac's) to replace the inner boot too, I'm inclined to leave the original on there, as I've read that the new boots are made out of cheaper rubber. I have a spare on hand, though.

[yelcab1]

Bathroom scale technique is fine. I just did this this morning, but I have a 3/4 inch 600 lbs torque wrench so it was easier than the bathroom scale method.

Changing the boots was not that bad. Doing all four boots on both axles took 1 hour.

[Canada Kev]

Judging that balancing on a scale on a breaker bar was a recipe for a cracked skull, I used math to get my torque fairly accurate: 340 ft-lbs (axle nut torque) / 190 lbs (me)=21.5", so I just stood on my breaker bar with my weight centred on the piece of tape I placed 21.5" from the socket. It was pretty accurate as when later torquing with a proper wrench required only a bit more tightening to reach the correct level.

It's not rocket surgery, so I assume anyone capable of changing out the axle can figure out how to manage a correct tightening level for the Big Ass Nut.

[Hnichols]

So the axle nut turned out to be not much of a problem, but the bolt holding the shock absorber to the trailing arm is another matter. I think it's supposed to be 22mm, but it seems there's some play in it. It couldn't be a standard, 7/8" bolt, could it? Anyway, it's supposed to be torqued comparably to lug nuts (100 ft/ibs or thereabouts?), but I was getting some groaning and a snap without breaking free. Just wanted to make sure I have the right tool on it before I attack it in earnest. And, if I'm not successful, is its removal essential, or only a convenience?

[Canada Kev]

If my memory is correct, it's in the way when you try to pull the axle free of the wheel hub. But by all means, undo all the fasteners on the CV and see if you can get it out without moving the shock out of the way.

Did someone replace that bolt with one with a standard size head and not metric, maybe? And if your socket isn't fitting the shock bolt, I might think about getting another so when you eventually get it free (if you need to), you can replace it with a good one.

[Hnichols]

Ah, I broke it loose. I think the problem is the angle: it slopes down, so when you torque the bolt it has a tendency to twist to the side. That and the fact that someone over-torqued it. It's an honest 22mm -- I think it was only in frustration that I considered the standard theory.

Anyway, I have all the bolts loose. Tomorrow I remove them and see how difficult it is to get the axle on my workbench. So far so good ...

[wrxnofx]

I’ve just done this over the winter and the biggest tip I can offer you is to RENT the necessary torque wrench from Autozone. It is FREE to rent. It’s a 3/4” drive, so buy a 3/4” drive 32 mm socket. Then use a pipe between the hub studs and the ground if the car is on jack stands while you torque the bolt down. Way easier.

Not every autozone has this torque wrench. The one I went to initially did not have it but they told me which one does. The tool rental number is 27309.

[Quasimoto]

Originally Posted by Hnichols

but the bolt holding the shock absorber to the trailing arm is another matter. I think it's supposed to be 22mm, but it seems there's some play in it. It couldn't be a standard, 7/8" bolt, could it? Anyway, it's supposed to be torqued comparably to lug nuts (100 ft/ibs or thereabouts?), but I was getting some groaning and a snap without breaking free.

*You are probably doing this already, but just in case*

This bolt should be removed with the weight of the car on the wheels or at least the hub supported by a floor jack. If the wheels are in the air, the weight of the wheel and suspension are on this bolt, so not a good idea to try and loosen it.

[Hnichols]

Originally Posted by wrxnofx

I’ve just done this over the winter and the biggest tip I can offer you is to RENT the necessary torque wrench from Autozone. It is FREE to rent. It’s a 3/4” drive, so buy a 3/4” drive 32 mm socket. Then use a pipe between the hub studs and the ground if the car is on jack stands while you torque the bolt down. Way easier.

Not every autozone has this torque wrench. The one I went to initially did not have it but they told me which one does. The tool rental number is 27309.

Thanks for this tip. Looking online it seems as though the biggest torque wrench Autozone (and Advance, O'Reily's, etc.) is a 1/2" with a 250 lb/ft maximum. But it's worth asking them. They've gotta have the jumbo wrench somewhere in Chicago ...

[wrxnofx]

Originally Posted by Hnichols

Thanks for this tip. Looking online it seems as though the biggest torque wrench Autozone (and Advance, O'Reily's, etc.) is a 1/2" with a 250 lb/ft maximum. But it's worth asking them. They've gotta have the jumbo wrench somewhere in Chicago ...

I stopped in at my closest autozone and asked them if they had rental tool 27309. They did not but looked up all area stores that did have it. When I stopped at the store that did have it, the guy didn't know what I was talking about. Then I said, the BIG torque wrench. He said that he had been working at the store a year and no one had ever rented it. The thing was brand new. I got a 32mm socket from Menards I think it was for like $8. Here are some pics. In the 3rd pic you can see the size in comparison to my 1/2" drive breaker bar and 180 ft-lb torque wrench.

[Hnichols]

Does this look right?
I know I have the thin-thick thing right. I'm wondering about the cage: to my eye it looks perfectly symmetrical, so the orientation shouldn't matter. Is that true?

wrxnofx: Thanks again for the info on the Autozone torque wrench. Also for the Menards reference: they seem to be the only ones who have 3/4" drive sockets. Question: is there a particular reason you torqued the axle bolt before putting the wheel on? I was planning on having the car's weight on the wheel, which was how I removed it in the first place.

Also -- do you have to recheck the torque on the axle nut like you do with bolts connecting the CV to the transaxle?