910 clone!

[Randy Webb]

Hey how come I never got one of those decals?

BTW, Exl. is mailed out by zip code, somehow that always cause us (OR) to get it late.

[jluetjen]

I won't turn this into a advertisment, but here is another pic.

Nice Rick! While I'm partial to the looks of the 906, an affordable 910 would certainly do.

Ok - I'm dreaming right now (too many projects as it is), but let me play the straight man. Ballpark - what would a "finish it yourself" kit cost? What's included and what's not? I'm sure that there are a lot of folks on this BBS who would like to know and even afford to buy one. Besides if I have a number I can at least put it into my 5 or 10 year financial plan.



PS: More pictures would not be considered gratuitous.

[JMPRO]

I gatherd from the artical that the reason he made his own boby is because the original body was not unifrom and diminsionally equal from side to side because the first model was made of clay and it was a race car anyway.
Jerry

[masraum]

OK, can some one tell me definitively what the difference is between a 906 and 910, I guess I should get a couple of books side by side to compare, but of all of the things that I've seen these two look darn near the same.

[cegerer]

906 is much different! Here's one:

[masraum]

hmm, looking in some of my books it seems as though the 906 was a fastback while the 910 had a rear window more like the early '70's Vette, and the shape headlight covers, 910 was squared off while 906 was curved, also, apparently the 906 used centerlock wheels while the 910 used 5 bolt hubs, and the scoops in front of the rear tire on the 910 were more squared off.

Does that do it, or is there anything else?

[masraum]

Hmm, seems I may have gotten the differences correct, but on the wrong models, but I still wouldn't call it MUCH different.

I'm glad this thread came up, I've been wondering for quite some time.

Thanks

[David]

It's articles like this (and Jack's) that encouraged me to renew my subscription for another 3 years. My only gripe is that if it wasn't for the articles, you'd think the only Porsche ever created was the 996 and the Cayenne. Whatever pays the bills I guess.

[jluetjen]

Here's my summary of the primary (non-styling) differences between the 906 and it's successor the 910.

906: 15 inch wheels from the 904. (Note same sizes as a 911's 15ers). "Full width" green house over the driver compartment. Fast back. "Gull wing" doors.

910: 13 inch wheels and uprights from a contemporary Lotus F1 car. Obviously the suspension geometry and brake were modified to match. The Greenhouse was made narrower to reduce the frontal area. With the smaller wheels, the fender sizes could be reduced for the same reasons. The doors no longer hinge on the roof (which is in fact removable to create a "Spyder"). The "fastback" glass over the engine compartment is gone and replaced by a flat deck between the butresses.

Otherwise, my understanding is that they are very similar in regards to the frame, engine and transaxle.

[eshahoian]

Gentlemen,

I ran into your interesting discussion contrasting the 910 / 906 and thought I may be able to shed some light on the topic. The two cars are really MUCH different when you take them apart. Gunnarracing's recent web site is the most incredible tour one could take of these prototype cars - check it out!

910's use hollow magnesium upright castings unique to that model, not Lotus parts as the 906 did. From chassis #17 to the 907 cars which followed they used different castings again designed to work with vented rotors. The suspension geometry of the 910 carried forward to the 907 and 908 steel frame cars.

The exotic suspension parts and unique frame structure define the 910 /907; how it behaves on the track is a result of the details of these design areas. The 906 frame was completely diffferent and it was laid out to accomodate the off-the-shelf lotus parts as John noted. The only parts in common between a 906 and 910 are the windshield, pedals, and a few knobs and hardware bits. The 13" wheels were also cast just for the 910. The 907 would see 15" rear wheels fitted at some point.

The 907K is similar in many ways to the 910 - same suspension - but the frame is different again tube for tube. Narrower cockpit and bigger engine - they rac six and eight cylinder engines...

Paul Frere's book reports the reality of the evolution of these cars - highly recommended read. There is so much interesting history in these cars.

Cheers!

[jluetjen]

eshahoian;
Just to clarify (disagree) on one thing, the 906 was specifically designed to use off-the-shelf 904 suspension pieces. Per "The Porsche Book" by Boschen and Jurgen Barth regarding the 906...

As 50 identical cars had to be completed to qualify for hte newly created "Sports Car"group, Porsche's target was to build the required number of the new 906 before the 1966 season began. As there was a surplus of 904 suspension parts, it was decided that, in order to save costs, they should be used for the 906, which explains why the supensions of the 904 GTS and the 906 were virtually identical."

On the 910, I stand corrected. Lest I stick my foot in my mouth again, I pulled some books and checked. The Lotus wheels and uprights were used on the Ollon-Villar's Spyder (906-010) which was the direct predicesor of the 910. The 910 used Porsche designed suspension pieces and uprights and had a wider front track then the 906. The 910's greenhouse was similar to the 906's. As you mentioned, it was the later 907 (reported to be a rebodied 910) which had the narrower greenhouse.

[eshahoian]

Hi John,

I believe we have not contradicted each other -the 906 frame was laid out for those bits (I have the blueprints for that car also to compare with the 910) - there is also text in Excellence was expected I believe to the effect that they had all of these Lotus parts to use up... the Villars car is an interesting machine...it was a transition and testbed for new ideas - I would love to see it.

Having re-tooled all of the parts and castings for the 910 / 907 cars now - I can completely understand why Porsche elected to use up the pieces they had purchased - castings are a lot of work and expensive.

I find it very amusing how the books, as you say, "report" that the 907 was a rebodied 910... it is not quite that straightforward...

I am in the thick of building a 907K with factory bodywork and a new frame and I can say with certainty - also having built the 910 continuation car - that the two cars share only the suspension pickup locations on the frame and the actual castings...I made ten sets of suspensions and was happy to not have to adapt anything:-)

What is remarkable is that every one of these plastic porsches was hand built and the list of differences from car to car is significant. No two frames are identical and there is a large variation in how the bodywork was bonded on etc.

The 910 had three or four front A-arm configurations also - I have replicated two of them, but have not solved this mystery as yet.

The 907 is narrow and there is a ice box in the nose to cool the driver...very helpful...or you can just put beers in there for the end of the day:-)

E

[Mr9146]

Mechanical differences aside, the front fenders on the 906 are far more pronounced than on the 910. The 906 had a sharper (read: pointier) nose while the 910 was a more rounded design with lower fender arches. The 906 can almost be described as bulbous when compared to the 910 which was like a pancaked version of the 906.

At least, that's how it looks to me.

[Wil Ferch]

eshahoian:
I am impressed by your "first-hand" knowledge of these cars...but I am quite certain the reference to Lotus-sourced suspension parts *never* figured in the history of the 906. Certainly the 910...and maybe ( by imitation and in-house built by Porsche)...the 907. But never the 906. If I'm wrong here, I would be glad to be corrected.

The 906 attempted to use as many of the left-over 904 parts as can be. ...as attributed as being said by Ferry Porsche himself when chiding then Technical Director Ferdinand Piech for his foray into purpose built race cars ( $$$$$)...906/910/908/909/917. The 904 was the last of the true dual-purpose raod/racing cars. This high cost for prototypes finally prompted Porsche to focus on GT-racing cars in the succeeding Fuhrmann era ( 911 Turbo / 934 / 935 /).

---Wil Ferch

[Wil Ferch]

Masraum:
The 906 used 5 bolt wheels....just like the 911 ( some used Fuchs)...and the 910 used center locks....
--Wil Ferch

[RickM]

In light of what's been said here I'm not surprised about this. Or should I be? This "overhang" sits with me wrong.

[jluetjen]

Rick;
I wasn't going to say anything but that mirror is hardly "period correct".

[masraum]

Wow, I've gotten much more info than I anticipated!

eshahoian, do you work for/at Gunnar? If not what do you do that has you doing such cool work.

[jester911]

Here is the front view from magazine. It isn't great after scanning and resizing.
You guys can't get too picky about what is exactly correct or not.
It is a hand built car, for crying out loud

[masraum]

You'd be surprised, we can be picky about anything and everything!