Is C.A.R.B. changing the rules? (CA smog)

[tiorio]

So I'm working on exhaust ideas for the 930 and toying around with the Land Cruiser again and I come across this gem today whilst at one of my local 4X4 and exhaust shops:

You USED to be able to put an aftermarket Catalytic converter on your vehicle in CA but ONLY if the factory one was BAD. You had to have a BAR recognized repair shop verify it's bad-ness and then you were legal. Today I hear that this regulation may be NO MORE.

Which means to you and I faithful CA residents, that if you haven't put that GHL system on yet, as of Jan 1 2004, you no longer can and pass smog, regardless of documentation. OEM only!

Of course it is of no consequence that the new-and-improved aftermarket cats are CLEANER than OEM...

I'm tyring to scour the internet for answers and my wrench will contact the BAR in the morning to verify but does anyone else have a line on this one?

If it is indeed true...well, let's just hope it isn't!

[sliminbay]

no more use of universal CAT installation on CA vehicles. it must be OEM, marketed as OEM replacement, or have ARB EO #. By the way while I am talking to referee, this law also effects air flow sensor as MAF or MAP change or mod, distributor mod, EGR mod, computer chip, elec ignition, headers, intake/exhause manifolds, fuel injection, turbo mod, and nitrous. All must have ARB's EO #.

[tiorio]

Wow. Over-legislation sucks big time.

How do they know when I had the mod done?

[tiorio]

Also, anyone know where I can find the abstract of the change? It's not Vehicle Code is it?

This kind of stuff really bugs me.

...the land of the free...

[edit]

Ok, so it is based on CA Vehicle Code

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc27156.htm

Which says you can't modify your car in regards to the emissions system unless the part has an exemption from the CARB by way of an executive order, searchable here:

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/amquery.php

But I think I'm still missing something as there's a lot that's 'not there' (like the Toyota Racing Development CARB approved 50 state legal supercharger for my 1997 Toyota Land Cruiser)...

And I really LOVED this one, right from the vehicle code:

(c) No person shall install, sell, offer for sale, or advertise any device, apparatus, or mechanism intended for use with, or as a part of, any required motor vehicle pollution control device or system which alters or modifies the original design or performance of any such motor vehicle pollution control device or system.

(d) If the court finds that a person has willfully violated this section, the court shall impose the maximum fine that may be imposed in the case, and no part of the fine may be suspended.


I've said it before and I'll say it again, enjoy your cars now because they will shortly be legislated out of existence.

[tiorio]

Not to bore anyone further but this explains the missing info.

...product has been granted a California Air Resources Board (ARB) exemption, an 'EO' number, or is a direct or consolidated replacement part. It is 50-state legal, per the manufacturer's application guide.

But I can't find a list of CARB exempted parts...

As far as I can tell, a part either doesn't interfere or modify the emissions system in any way (exempt) or it does but CARB says it's ok (Executive Order). I'm all for their cause but HATE their methods.



You laugh at me now but I've BEEN to the smog referee and he DOESN'T HAVE to play fair 'cause you're in HIS house. Unless you replace with only OEM you might be seeing him too!

[sliminbay]

It doesn't matter when the installation took place. It is supposed to be caught and fixed at 2 year smog inspection.
Complete list of allowed components are at the referee station. Two large volumes that referee is to check and issue BAR label for. The bad part is that you will fail the visual inspection so you will pay for at least two smog test fee plus referee appointment fee.
If you want to know the real killer is the fact that only BAR emissions certified techs are allowed to do repair. Currently in the law books but not being enforced due to lack of certified techs.

[Wayne 962]

How would a smog station know if the unit is OEM or not?

-Wayne

[aigel]

Wayne:

The deal is that these laws are made for folks that want the shop to install it for them. Then the shop can't touch it. If you DIY and bring it to an inspection station, I highly doubt that they will notice. Especially on the 911, the average smog checker has no clue and will go with what el machino will read. The problem with some of these exhaust systems is that they need welding and not everyone can do that at home.

Now if you ask me, I think strict smog rules make sense for the general public. Of course only if you spend time and effort in improving public transportation and getting people away from 100 mile commutes and 12mpg SUV driving!

Cheers, George

[Wayne 962]

Originally posted by aigel
Now if you ask me, I think strict smog rules make sense for the general public. Of course only if you spend time and effort in improving public transportation and getting people away from 100 mile commutes and 12mpg SUV driving!

I'm with you 100% on that....

-Wayne

[jyl]

But even the average smog checker will notice that your 911 has two distributors, won't he? So does that mean no more twin-plug conversions in CA for non-exempt 911s?

Originally posted by aigel

If you DIY and bring it to an inspection station, I highly doubt that they will notice. Especially on the 911, the average smog checker has no clue and will go with what el machino will read.

[v9ff]

Originally posted by jyl
But even the average smog checker will notice that your 911 has two distributors, won't he?

Yeah, riiiiiight.

Some of these guys look at the two heat exchagers and cat and ask, "why does your car have 3 catalytics?"

I just grin and shrug.

[jyl]

Where is the official list of what systems are considered emissions-related, so as to be regulated by the CARB?

E.g., where does it say that mufflers are not regulated but distributors are?

I searched the CARB website but just got frustrated.

[tiorio]

Originally posted by jyl
Where is the official list of what systems are considered emissions-related, so as to be regulated by the CARB?

E.g., where does it say that mufflers are not regulated but distributors are?

I searched the CARB website but just got frustrated.

That's exactly what I want to know, what needs an EO to be legal or not vs. what is legal becuase it doesn't affect the emissions system...

And I also got frustrated...


A smog weenie example would be a single cat on what was a dual cat system. (going into smog-weenie grammar mode)

My Land Cruiser was factory with 2 cats, but the PO put a single cat on. Smog weenie said 'this book here says you need two cats' and I said, 'those cats, they were broke so the PO put on a universal single cat' and the smog weenie said 'you gotta take that cat to the referee' and the referee said 'this book here says you need two cats' and I said, 'those cats, they were broke so the PO put on a universal single cat' and the referee said 'well then one cat it is 'cause that's legal ifin your OEM cats was broke'.

So at some point in the very recent past, this law changed. And it affects a lot of components but who knows what?

Side-note: I'm all for stringent air quality guidelines and such, but not to the point that I can't drive my well maintained olde car due to lack of parts availability. I'm not trying to defeat smog equipment, I'd like to replace my OE system with a newer, more efficient system! The more efficient the engine runs, the fewer emissions overall, so my goal happily coincides with CARBs goal. I'm perfectly happy and willing to incorporate a correctly sized catalytic converter, O2 sensors, and whatever else into my exhaust design and pass the rolling tests with flying colors! But I can't do it legally, thanks to CARB. Makes we want to test-pipe it...just as illegal as designing and paying for a well matched system with emission control intact/improved.

[Jeremy Cottrell]

You cannot buy OBD2 96- and later cats. They are only available from a dealer. Earlier cars still can run aftermarket cats.

[tiorio]

Originally posted by Jeremy Cottrell
You cannot buy OBD2 96- and later cats. They are only available from a dealer. Earlier cars still can run aftermarket cats.

Right, just found that out too. It's only OBD II cars (1996 and later) vehicles affected. So the 930 is out of the woods but the Land Cruiser is still affected. But Magnaflow sells an OBD II cat series?

http://www.magnaflow.com/02product/converters/converter04.htm

Nuttin's easy...

[edit]

Well, here's how they can (or more correctly CANNOT) do it:



Late model (generally 1996 and later) cars and trucks have On-Board Diagnostic (OBDII) systems designed to detect catalyst failures. These vehicles often use two or more catalytic converters and have oxygen sensors in front and behind one or more of the converters. In nearly all cases, these sensors are located in the exhaust pipe. The vehicle's on-board computer compares the oxygen sensor signals before and after the converter(s) to determine if the converter is working correctly.


Currently, aftermarket catalytic converters have NOT been officially approved by any government agency for vehicles with OBDII systems. The ARB is developing new, tougher tests for these converters but has NOT finalized the procedure and has NOT approved any aftermarket OBDII converters. In California, no aftermarket converter company's converters can be used on OBDII vehicles because none have been approved.


Outside California, aftermarket converters may be used on OBDII vehicles as long as the following guidelines are followed:
The original converter is defective as shown by emission tests, the OBDII system or the converter is physically damaged, and the converter is no longer covered by the OEM vehicle warranty.
The aftermarket converter is selected based on the vehicle weight, engine size, and physical fit.
The location of the oxygen sensor(s) must be the same as in the OEM exhaust system and CANNOT be relocated.
After hanging the converter, the diagnostic codes should be cleared according to the vehicle manufacturer's procedure, otherwise the on-board computer may immediately turn on the Check Engine Light.

[john70t]

And after the ARB finishes it's micro-surgery on daily-use vehicles people use to go to work, it's going to make changes to airplanes, two-stroke lawn equipment and diesels. Right.

Oh yeah, what about useless SUVs which are the biggest sellers because of tax breaks and have 4 times the emmisions.

Wanna know how much HC's a Wonderbread factory gives off? A lot, but they're allowed to because they buy their pollution credits from that refinery who got a massive tax break for putting a scrubber on their 1950's stack.

Sounds like two department heads are playing chess on paper.

[john70t]

There's that joke: Whats the difference between Americans and Germans?
If the speed limit were lowered to 50 mph, the germans would all drive 50 and vote the guy out of office. The americans would all drive 80mph, and vote for him again cause he's such a nice guy.