Would I be disowned for considering...

[Siena911]

converting the pcar to run on LPG as well as normal unleaded?

Anyone ever done this? Just curious.

Cheers Jakes:

[KobaltBlau]

No way! it would be an interesting technical project...

I don't know if anyone has done it on a 911.

[deoxford]

Wow , I love the idea, I myself have thought about , that or Hydrogen
I think I will look in to it more when my current project is down , with a early 80s model 911.

Let me know how it goes!

Oxfordsearly911@mchsi.com

[VaSteve]

You could drive it in the HOV lanes here in VA if you do. Might even be eligible for a tax credit. I thought about getting one of those hybrids and taking out the motor to put in a cooler car. Only problem with that is, nobody knows the long-term maintenance tail on those things yet.

[dickster]

jakes,

i can't see the point unless you're running 15mpg or lower. great for range rovers etc - but on a sports car!!

[juanbenae]

the city i work for got a few crown vics police cars and had them switched over to LPG. once the cars were switched over the cops hated it. way down on power and up on weight. part of the weight issue was since the were "50" they had to have some type of steel/lead covers for the tanks. gun play you know.

i did drive one (lpg type) of them once (we inspectors used to drive old cop cars) and it was a gutless pig. the gas crown vic police cars go pretty good from my experience driving them. drove em for about 4 years playing undercover, scaring kids and traffic violators.

[island911]

I've just got to ask; why?

[bigrubberjeep]

I think it's an engenius idea!

[dickster]

I've just got to ask; why?

thats what i meant to say

[Dutchie]

I've just got to ask; why?

we pay 1.23 euros here for a liter of normal gas in Europe a liter of LPG does 49 cents maybe thats why

Interresting idea but you will need at least a 80 liter LPG tank somewhere in the car next to a smaller normal gas tank. I think it will eat some HP plus it will raise temps even with the newer LPG systems.

[vash]

my work truck has a switch so i can choose my fuel. i once burned about $45 dollars worth of propane just driving to sacramento from san francisco. i think it was a 1.75 hour drive. on the way home, i switched to gasoline and i burned a quarter tank. big difference. i never refilled the LPG tank since. it took the technician about 25 minutes to fill my truck. not really worth it, besides being greener.

[island911]

Wow, Cliff.. .(vash) that is some tough imperical evidence.

I know that the energy per liter of LPG(liquid) is quite a bit lower than gasoline (~75% of gasoline) but $45 dollars worth, for that distance? . ..yikes!

Maybe Hank Hill will chime in here.

[Glasgow 911SC]

i Saw a conversion article on one of the motoring programs a while back (I forget which one). They dynoed the car (I think it was a BMW) before & aftewr the conversion and also tested the MPG. The power went up by about 5~10hp IIRC and the MPG went down by a few miles.

My only concern would be if the government decided to stop the tax break at the review date and it became just as expensive as petrol. My local Shell station is now up to 85p ($1.55) per litre.

[dvkk]

Originally posted by Glasgow 911SC
i Saw a conversion article on one of the motoring programs a while back (I forget which one). They dynoed the car (I think it was a BMW) before & aftewr the conversion and also tested the MPG. The power went up by about 5~10hp IIRC

They had some other variable change cause the increase. Its a known fact that when you convert a gasoline engine to run on propane you lose 15-25% hp. Propane burns slower than gasoline and has a much higher octane equivalent. If you were to build an engine specifically for propane, go at least 14:1 compression ratio. Anything less is giving away hp. Since no one increases their CR when they switch to propane, you see a big hp drop because of it.
The biggest problem to overcome if you want to switch a 911 to propane is where do you put the tank? I don't think you can put it in the front luggage compartment because if the tank leaks the compartment will fill up with propane gas, not allowing it to dissipate.
Another problem is icing. Propane must be heated to turn it from a liquid to a gas. Watercooled cars run the cooling water through a heat exchanger for this. You could do the same with oil, but its not quite as easy as with water.

[GrindingGears]

no...b/c you already deserted the SCWDP...hmph...

[masraum]

I always thought the LPG cars lost some power because of slightly reduced efficiency like dvkk said.

I think the problem that I see is that I understand the tanks to be very, VERY heavy, like several hundred pounds. On the other hand, you wouldn't ever have to worry about carbon build up. From what I understand when you pull one of those motors apart the combustion chambers look like the car has never been run.

[Erakad]

So it sounds like LPG is really a bust, but what about hydrogen? Besides the obvious problems with a ready supply, what are the pros and cons. I know BMW has been working with it, and even has a refill station somewher in Munich. Also, Arnold Schwarzenegger is said to be converting his H2 to hydrogen and is pushing for more filling stations in CA. If this all comes about, will hydrogen produce performance on par with gasoline? Conversion kits? So many questions...

[masraum]

I don't really know much about it, but I don't think hydrogen will be something that you can convert, but I'd be interested to hear from some of the more informed.

[johndglynn]

Originally posted by dickster
jakes,

i can't see the point unless you're running 15mpg or lower. great for range rovers etc - but on a sports car!!

You have to be doing the miles to get the cost of the conversion back and those donut tanks would never fit under the bonnet!

[David]

I saw a Camaro in Car and Driver or one those mags many years ago that converted to propane so he could pass Cali emissions with a really radical motor. If that's the case you would want to build a high compression engine to take advantage of the fuel. Of course you couldn't run gas then.