Reconstructing Constant Velocity (CV) Joints

[Jim P]

Its all a bit of a mission isn't it. Mine is going OK except the M8 50mm bolts I was supplied (they are 50mm) seem to be about 5mm short. They certainly don't extend by a thread or 2. Will they be OK or should I buy some longer ones?

[jcsjcs]

It is a mission - seems strangely more complicated then I expected.

As far as the short bolts - seems that the consensus is that you don't want to risk the CVs coming out - so I would investigate the 55mm bolts.

Other people indicated that the height of the metal in the boots can be higher in various versions - which would eat up a few mm.

Also are you using the spring washers and moon plates?

Not sure what I can offer here - but am curious about the above.

I will be putting my new CVs, new boots, new washers together in the next few days and am curious if I will have the same problem. I am electing to leave out he moon plates (at least for now) as my car did not have moon plates or washers. I did buy the washers and plan to use.

[Jim P]

Thanks for that...I went and purchased 55mm long bolts. These are a perfect fit. I have used new washers, no moon plates. Alaways better to be safe than sorry.
The CV part of the rebuild was straight forward, thanks to the advise here.
The rear wheel bearing replacement presented a few more challenges but the freezer and heat gun are the secrets!

[RWebb]

can't recall, are these things high strength bolts, 10.9 ??

[RetiredRider]

I have a '90 C2 - 964 that is in need of a new wheel bearing. After I removed the axle, I discovered one of the dust boots is torn. So, I removed the inboard CV joint but I cannot figure out the outboard CV joint. Is the splined shaft that fits into the hub pressed onto the axle somehow? If so, how is it removed. I have looked thru the posts on this but cannot find any detail on removed this splined shaft so I can get to the circlip on that side.

[koteles]

hello , I'm sorry for the noob question but this clunk is driving me insane !!!

the sound appears when going in reverse or starting from full stop and it appears when I lift off the gas pedal or doing a right 90 degree turn .

I made 2 vids of the noise , I think it could be the CV , but there's no play at all

YouTube - BMW E36 Rear End Noise , CLUNK

YouTube - E36 driveshat U Joint


thanks again for the much appreciated help !

[michael pagano]

I am installing new rear wheel bearings soon, So i will be taking the shafts out anyway. Looking at my boots, I have no clamps on the smaller ends of them I dont sense anything wrong with the car or CV's, other than a kind of clunk/shudder when i lift off the gas at high rpm/accelerating, which is kind of normal for a manual car. Is it a problem that i have no clamps on the smaller ends of the boots? Can I just put some hose clamps of them and call it a day since the CVs seem fine? I dont know if mine are bad...but they probably are in a 30 year old car...

[1-ev.com]

Hey guys,

Can you clarify please where grease seals were used on 68 year M8 bolts?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads5/MVC+015S1117330165.jpg

Thank you.
-y

[RWebb]

An update -- I see a lot of interest in drilling the heads of the fasteners and using safety wire...

Safety wire is not needed if the correct fasteners are installed and installed properly.

More importantly, safety wire will NOT maintain the correct force on the faces of the CV assemblies. It is this force that transmits the torque from the engine to the wheels.

The cap screws on the CV assemblies are in tension (axial direction) and that tension creates the force to transmit the torque of the engine to the wheels.

If the cap screw loosens but is held in place by safety wire it will be loaded in shear, which it is not designed to take. The cap screws will then be highly likely to break ("shear off") and you will be in just as bad a situation as if they had fallen out all the way. The only advantage is that you might hear a noise from the loosened assembly before the bolts break.

So my view is to NOT depend on safety wire to compensate for incorrect installation procedures.

[ClickClickBoom]

Hello,
For the 100MM CVs on my '84 were installed with 8MM x 50MM hex head bolts. I installed some new Lobros, new boots and bolts, promptly came loose. Removed again, replaced gaskets, cleaned all grease out of the CVs. Cleaned every surface with brake cleaner, then an acetone wipe prior to DRY assembly. Dry bolt up followed with brake cleaned assembly bolts. Installed new 8 x 50MM hex bolts with Loctite262, torqued to 33lbft. Injected new grease with grease gun and needle through the axle opening, into every ball groove and all over the inner joint area, almost 4oz per joint.
Still as nervous as a turkey on the 24th! Internet rummaging yielded many resources. I had ordered Schnoor washers from our host, got a bag full of washers that start with a 999 part number and looked to be for 10MM bolts, too big! Went to the old internets standby and found a metric hardware retailer and ordered 8MM x55MM 12.9 black phosphate bolts, 8MM Schnoor washers, and from another retailer( TORQUE DISTRIBUTION WASHER [87-5081-0] - $1.75 : Vwbugworld, World Of Vintage Volkswagen ), funny moon plate washers for 100MM joints.
I think after hours of reading this forum, I applaud Grady and all the other posters who stretched their brains and bloodied their knuckles and shared their vast knowledge with the rest of us!
The VW number to search the Internet is 875081, lots of options.
Hardware:https://www.belmetric.com/

[ClickClickBoom]

Update!
After endless OCD driven research on locking washers I decided to use Nord-Lock NL8 locking washer system along with new black phosphate coated bolts. When I removed the old bolts one at a time and replaced them with the new bolts and washers, I noted a reduced torque to remove the old bolts.
I posted here about my research:
All About Nuts and Bolts
I will follow up after a bit.

[Guardsred911]

ClickClickBoom - I have an 80 911 SC that originally had the 8X50 on the CV's with no Washers or moon plates on it. After reading through all this and other posts, I am looking to get the longer bolts as well.... the 8X55's... what's the thread pitch on those? 1.25?

Thanks for the links to the moon plates, bolts and Schnoor washers. I just ordered 12 plates from VW world..... 6 for the inner, and I will have the extra 6 for the outer when I replace those joints....

[Nickshu]

I am about to do this job, I have all new bolts 8x50mm. The OEM setup on the SC was bolts with no washers at all. I have found a place to get M8 Schnorr washers, if I add these will the 50mm bolts be long enough? From what I have read so far I gather that increasing to 55mm bolts is only necessary if adding the Moon plates (which originally in 82 were only installed from the factory on the Sportmatic cars).

Right??

[Guardsred911]

Nick, I added the M10 Schnoor's on the 8X50 bolts, just to get everything tightened.... (reordering the correct sized washers tomorrow). That said, it looks like with a washer, the bolt is about 1.5mm short of flush.

[Nickshu]

Originally Posted by Guardsred911

Nick, I added the M10 Schnoor's on the 8X50 bolts, just to get everything tightened.... (reordering the correct sized washers tomorrow). That said, it looks like with a washer, the bolt is about 1.5mm short of flush.

Hmmm. It just seems wierd to me to have to do all this. Mine were fine for 30 years as designed. Do I dare try to just use the stock bolts per OEM/factory setup with no washer???

[Guardsred911]

I had the same thoughts.... but then I read the posts by Grady and the clamping forces necessary to make it not shear or come loose... I ended up figuring $50 was better than dealing with the mess...I think the CV mess was the most annoying and slowest part of the entire engine drop, clean, seal and reinstall... the rest was pretty straight forward...

[Nickshu]

Originally Posted by Guardsred911

I had the same thoughts.... but then I read the posts by Grady and the clamping forces necessary to make it not shear or come loose... I ended up figuring $50 was better than dealing with the mess...I think the CV mess was the most annoying and slowest part of the entire engine drop, clean, seal and reinstall... the rest was pretty straight forward...

Alright, you convinced me. Just ordered Moon Plates, M8x55mm 12.9 bolts, and M8 Schnorr washers. I have no interest in doing this job twice or spewing CV grease all over my recently cleaned up suspension if they come loose.

Interesting, I am awaiting new half-shafts with CV's (complete) from Pelican. In the Pelican catalog it says they come with M8x47mm (not 50mm) bolts and to use these bolts. Wonder if the thickness of the replacement CV's is thinner than original? Not sure....will have to see! According to the parts catalog the Sportmatic used 48mm bolts, the standard SC used 50mm and the 930 used 60mm. Not sure where 47mm comes from.

[Guardsred911]

I saw that too... let me know how that turns out with the 8X47mm's.... might be the flange is thinner and that 50's would hit the tranny.... but I was curious and would be good to get on the ground intel.....

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by Nickshu

... Interesting, I am awaiting new half-shafts with CV's (complete) from Pelican. In the Pelican catalog it says they come with M8x47mm (not 50mm) bolts and to use these bolts. Wonder if the thickness of the replacement CV's is thinner than original? Not sure....will have to see! According to the parts catalog the Sportmatic used 48mm bolts, the standard SC used 50mm and the 930 used 60mm. Not sure where 47mm comes from.

I pick my axles yesterday and here is a pic with measurement of the "47mm" bolts...

I work with British Specification for fastener on daily basis and God knows where the "47" come from as there is nothing that measure 47mm on these studs

[Nickshu]

Thanks for posting that. I'll measure them against the 55mm bolts when the come in.