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Guys
thank you very much for the nice words. The 911 & PW article is really nice. It was a wonderful experience and I had a great time. As per the car after the 1st 5 months of ownership what can I say? After a couple of hickups due to some wiring issues with the ECU and injectors it is running fine. I am really enjoying it. The performance is really on a different level. I can honestly say that the car can stay with the likes of 997 GT3 RSs on the track. The driver needs to improve a lot though to take advantage of the car's potential. Clearly it came out much more hardcore than the initial (remember 28 months ago? I was going to be my daily driver.... ;)) proposition. Between the aggressive cams, the huge ducting for the massive oilcooler (with no thermostat, even though we are fixing that), the impossible toe settings etc it is a real handful on the awful UK B roads. But take it to Silverstone, Doninngton or Brands Hatch and it is just a blast! And this is just the beginning.... I am really happy and proud of driving the 911! http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1213949547.jpg |
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Great writeup in 911 & PW! I'm sure most of you noted the author... ;)?
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Did you write it? I haven't seen it, but will try to pick up the magazine. Doug |
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Matteo, can you summerize how the engine would perform as an ocasional dd? Looking for feedback on idle, starting, general docility around town and on high way. Any issues w/ gasoline?
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The day of the photoshoot I was meant to drive 150 miles to get to the location. Whilst on the highway all of a sudden my car started cutting off. Remember that I have had the car now for just a couple of days. And now i was stranded on the highway... well to cut a long story short there were a couple of issues with the wiring. The ICU (Ignition control unit form the 993) was mounted on a very small heat sink and was therefor overheathing. John made a couple of calls and I was able (after having let the car cool off) to reach Tuthill (a very well known Porsche specialist in the area).... These guys dropped everything and built a bespoke heat sink plate and provided me with a brand new ICU... But things were not meant to go smoothly that day. Back on my way the car started running very rough. I eventually manage to get to the photoshoot location but by the end of the day the car was undrivable. We would find out later after taking the car to Bob Watson (the Motec guru in the UK) on John's suggestion that the mapping was all over the place and that the connector from the wiring harness to the Motec ECU was faulty, firing only one distributor. Basically the car was running too rich and I wet all the plugs. I could not drive home (I was 150 miles away) so John offered me his treasured 1976 3.0 Carrera. The agreement was that he'd pick my car up from Bob Watson's after he had dealt with the mapping issues and we'd swap cars back. It turned out that the problem was not only the mapping. A couple of injectors were not properly connected and the engine builder had used the cylinder temp sensor to control the cold start cycles. Needless to say the sensor was showing a very high temp immediately switching th map to a richer one too early, resulting to eventually wet plugs. So it took a while to diagnose the problem and fix it. Everything now is fixed and Bob switched the CHT sensor with an engine mounted one and remapped the whole thing. Still John let me have his beloved orange beauty for 3 weeks, whilst my car was getting fixed. And I had not met John before that day. To me that goes a long way to show what kind of man he is... I hope I will be able to pay him back sometimes in the future |
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my situation is a bit atipical. Unfortunately we were not able to solve all the teething problems with the original engine builder because of the fact that the car was shipped to the UK as soon as it was assembled. But we had to do quite a bit to make it to my liking. Basically Timmins built a conservatively tuned (rev limiter at 7,800 and not super aggressive cams) race motor for me. Which would have been great had I raced the car only. But I was planning on driving the car to work (20 mile commute). So we encountered some problems. First the plugs were way too hard. Second because of the CHT sensor was chosen to control the cold start maps the car (especially during the cold British winter) would not get onto temps quickly enough and was running way too rich. And the maps themselves were all trimmed apart from the top 3 (90-95-100% throttle at above 6k rpm). This caused problems with the plugs (wet), the engine cutting off when comingoff the throttle (say coming off a highway ramp onto a stop I had to keep it revving above 2k to prevent it from stalling), and lots of backfiring. But now (and I must say it was a bit frustrating and also a little expensive) everything is good. The motor is a monster. It idles perfectly at 1k from stone cold. It revs quickly (the LWF also helps) and throttle response is immediate. What has surprised me the most is the torque that it still produces. Around town I can just sit in 4th and occasionally drop into 3rd and it would do it all day. On the highway I cruise at 90mph at 3k in 6th gear and I really do not need to downshift in any situation. The problem is that it is just too much fun to drive it "on cams" so I am always in 2nd-3rd (good for 110mph) gear. So all in all it I just love it. |
Shush Teo, or I'll have a line of broken 911s outside the back gate waiting to use my car! LOL
It is wide of the mark to say we had only met that day, I've known you through here for quite a bit longer and was glad to be able to help out. I wouldn't give the car to just anyone, but you are a genuine gentleman and it's the least you deserved given the disappointment you were suffering at the time. Plus it meant I got the Blue Meanie to play with for a few days, so it was 'swings and roundabouts' as we say here in GB; no payback required. Now though it is all good, the car is a proper gem on the move and it goes like stink. What more can a guy ask for, apart from some heat! EFI on throttle bodies is the way to go on our cars; there is no doubt about it. I look forward to working out my own system along similar lines, though staying 3 litres or maybe coming down a bit. Scott, thanks for the kind words mate ;) |
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Martin 83 911SC 3.6 83 911T RSR(ish) |
Great article in 911 & Porsche World. I've been reading that magazine for several years now, it's definitely one of my faves, next to Excellence, of course.
I actually went out and bought the mag today after reading that Teo's car was featured in it. Great write-up John! I can only hope that one day I will be as good a writer as you when it comes to Porsches. :cool: Keep those pics coming, Matteo! I can't get enough of such a cool car to come out of Charlotte, North Carolina! SmileWavy |
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Doesn't John get to pick your beast up?! Are you sure he did not have something done to your car just to set this whole situation up!;) John is a super nice guy. I hope to meet you in "real life" someday mate. SmileWavy |
just spent a good while going through page 1 to 61 and i am just amazed at the transformation. any updates on that car? enjoy the car in good health!
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dial 911, I just spent a good 2 or 3 hours looking through the pages as well. Amazing transformation, and Matteo, if you read this I was just wondering about the color of the car, is it one of the original option colors or your own custom one?
Thanks, and great car! |
Mexico Blue I believe and it was a factory color
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I seem to remember that they couldn't get the powder coat color to exactly match Mexico Blue so it is slightly darker/deeper. They then painted the sheet metal in the same shade as the chassis to match the darker shade of Mex Blue. My Iroc is Mexico Blue & it seems a few shades lighter than Matteo's, appearing almost powder blue. I like Matteo's color, wish my car was a little darker.
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Correct its a few shades darker due to the chassis powder coat color. I think it turned out perfectly as well. The color pays homage to the cars of the era but the slightly darker color really modernizes it at the same time.
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good work on rebirthing ur car!...
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Hey Teo,
What are you faster in the 911 or the Ford GT? Do you still have the Ford? Great car as well. |
I still have the Ford GT.
As per a direct comparison betweeb the 2 cars it is difficult. The Ford is much bigger and obviously less nimble. On a track like Silverstone it's unbeatable. But on smaller B-roads or tighter race tracks the 911 takes the win. I am sure as I get used to the 911 I will get faster and faster, but it has been a very frustrating 18 months with my car... and I have not been able to drive it much... I think I am going to write an update of what happened since that glorious Summer 2007 and the Excellence article... |
I think an update is over due.
CHAPTER ONE I really wanted to write about epic drives to Spa, Le Mans, battles against flocks of GT3s on the Scottish Highlands and fun runs amongst scarlet Ferraris on the famous Mille Miglia and Targa Florio roads but I am afraid things didn’t go as planned… It all started quite soon after Zuffenhaus received the motor back from Timmins during the Summer of 2007. T he engine was quickly installed on the car as Bob Chapman was eagerly awaiting for the Excellence article. When the car came back from the Georgia trip (where Bob drove the car) it was clear something was not right. Some smoke had been detected coming out of the exhaust as soon as the engine was installed but it was attributed to some oil being present in the heat exchangers (maybe due to the crate not being level during transport?), but now there was no more oil to burn in the HE and yet the car was still smoking badly and getting worse. Here is a clip of the smoke. <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/3zk7XYvPq78&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/3zk7XYvPq78&hl=en&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> Obviously Keith and Aaron didn’t want to send me the car (I had already left for England at the time, thinking everything was OK) in such a state and so they suggested a compression and leak down test be performed on the car… On the 23rd of August 2007 we got the results, and they were not good. Cylinder #1 - 210psi 8% leakage, normal plug, Cylinder #2 - 210psi 12% leakage, normal plug, Cylinder #3 - 210psi 7% leakage, normal plug, Cylinder #4 - 210psi 9% leakage, normal plug, Cylinder #5 - 210psi 8% leakage, normal plug, Cylinder #6 - 205psi 13% leakage, wet oil and evidence of detonation on plug. Clearly this was not acceptable on an engine with 250 miles on the clock. Here I should have taken my losses, have the car shipped over and dealt with the situation from here. Instead I decided to have Timmins fix the problem. The car arrived at Timmins on September 17th. You can imagine the costs and time wasted on a second top end rebuild. The pistons had to be remachined and cylinders recoated and rings replaced. Then the engine would be tuned once again. Timmins never charged me labor for stripping and rebuilding the motor, but I had to pay for all the rest. On November 11th I received an email from Timmins saying that one of the cylinders had to be replated again as it did not pass quality control… On the 2nd of December Timmins says the engine is finally in the car and they will tune it shortly with Paul Schwartz. On the 29th of December the car was finally dropped off to the shipper in New Jersey. End of Chapter One |
Teo,
Wow, sorry to hear this. Look forward to chapter 2 and hopefully a much happier story of events |
Matteo,
Sorry to hear about your engine woes. How many miles/hours were on the engine before it burned oil? Apparently none if any at all. Do they attribute the problem to bad parts??? I hope this is resolved so you may get to enjoy that gorgeous ride. Our engines are configured very much alike. My 3.8 runs like a pig set afire, so far no issues. Good Luck |
Really sorry to hear about this! I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say that your car is just unbelievably nice and inspirational to us all! Hope it all gets sorted out in chapter 2!
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CHAPTER TWO
On the 20th of February the car cleared customs and was ready to be picked up from the docs. You can imagine my excitement. I had been waiting for 3 years now for this moment. I had a terrible night, but finally it was time to get on the 6am train to Southampton, in less than 2 hours I would be driving her home… Once again, things did not go according to the plans. I got to the docks at around 8am of a wonderful day. The sun was bright and there was not a cloud in the sky. The temperature was quite low, around 6-7C (40ies F) but it was brisk and pleasant. The importing agent had waited for me to unlock the container, so I followed him to the site with my hearth racing fast. The doors were finally unlocked and my car was right there, just behind my wife’s 993 (BTW she was not happy she had to wait an extra 6 months for her car to be delivered because of yet another delay on my built, but that is another story)… So we get the 993 out and then proceed to freeing the blue beast. All the guys at the docks (this is a specialized car import agent, so they see their fair share of cool cars coming and going) were drooling over it. It was really beautiful, shining in the stark sunlight, with it’s unique colour and impossible (if a little cartoonish) wide tyres… Anyway it’s time to crank it and drive it home. Unfortunately the 911 has different ideas. As we turn the key (after reattaching the battery) the motor cranks a couple of time but refuses to come on. Eventually the little Odissey battery gives up. No matter though as the docks guys have several power packs that we can use… After 3 power packs are drained trying to start the car I started wondering if Timmins had been too zealous when I told him to live the car as close to empty as possible. So I call a cab, drive to the closest gas station, buy a tank, fill it, go back to the docks, fill the car and try again. Nothing. At this point ( it is probably 11am now) the docks guys are starting to get a little impatient as I have taken up most of their morning. So they offer to connect the car to a fork lift to see if it has more push than one of the power packs, but the car still does not start. All the time the engine was cranking, but failing to fire up at all. I have to give up. So I get in the 993 and drive home. Once at home I convince my wife it is a great idea to drive the family down to the docks (80 miles), try one last time with the jump leads and in case of failure pull the car all the way home. Since we don’t have a trailer…. you can imagine the idiocy of the idea, but I was not ready to give up on my baby yet… We to cut a story short we tried again to no avail, realized it was impossible to drive 80 miles in tow and so I called the equivalent of AAA to come and trailer the car home. I would figure something out then. It’s now gone 6pm, I am freezing my butt off and cursing the engine builder when a little AA van shows up. Apparently the policy is to send a little guy with the power packs out before calling the real trailer. I am really upset now as I have wasted my day trying to start the bloody car with no results and this little man still wants to give it a go. Anyway he sprays something magic on all the electrical connections in the back and within 5 tries the car starts firing. At first I am super scared as it makes some terrifying bangs, but then it settles on a very lumpy idle… At once all my bad thoughts vanish… My car is running. I am taking her home. The journey home is not one of the easiest. It’s dark, cold, but most of all this car is LOUD. I get home at around 9pm… managing to wake the whole neighborhood up. I am destroyed, but I am happy, the car is here. I am going to have a beer!! |
Chapter3?
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CHAPTER THREE
The following morning I get up all excited once again. I put the battery on a trickle charger to make sure it will start ok. Still I am having issues. Even when the engine eventually fires up it does not seem to be running smoothly. The previous day I really didn’t could not pay attention to it, but now I realize there is something wrong with it. After a 2 hour drive I finally realized I am running on 6 plugs. There is no power to one of the coils (remember I am using the stock 993 set up, with the 2 coils and dist). At the end I manage to narrow it down to the ICU (Ignition Control Unit, the 993s have 1 as opposed to the 964 2 unit) and I order one from Porsche. It takes 3 days to arrive and when I finally swap it with the old one and the car starts immediately. I am a bit puzzled on how this thing has failed (and why would it fail on just half) but it’s ok. The car is running, that’s all that counts. In the meanwhile John Glynn (911 & PW) had been talking about getting the car featured in the UK press as well and was following my troubles closely. When I told him I had fixed the mysterious problem we set a date for me to drive to the nice countryside around Oxford for the photoshoot. We are shooting in the 1st week of March. On the 25th of February, exactly 2 days after I installed a new ICU the problem reoccurs… I am really upset now… it only took a year and $50k to have a motor that is not running properly. Out of time and patience I drop the car quickly at RSR engineering who diagnose the problem quickly (wiring to the connector to the Motec ECU was not secured properly and one of the male pins was being pushed in when connecting to the ICU, creating the problem) and fix it temporarily (they need a new Motec connector) and send me on my way (I am scheduled to meet up with John in the next couple of days). Frustration is mounting, but I still get up bright and early on another glorious week day to drive up the M40 to meet JG and the photographer for the 911 & PW article. I am sure you’ll think I am making this stuff up, but as I am driving on the highway (M40) the car just dies. I lost power to the coils. I frantically call JG that suggests I take the car to Tuthill (fortunately it is just 10 miles away from where I am) to see if we can fix the problem. Eventually we’ll find out that the ICU was overheating and shut down going into protection mode (that why as it cools off it allows me to drive again). The culprit? A heat sink plate that was so small and attached to the floor with Velcro that was not absorbing enough heat, frying the ICU. So I am now 3 hours behind schedule (as at Tuthill they drop everything off to diagnose and fix the problem to send me on my way) when I finally meet up with John. The photographer and John are very understanding and we get all the pictures done. After that John and I decide to go for a quick spin but ONCE AGAIN the car has different plans. Basically the car has become undriveable. No throttle response, it refuses to revv, no power… it seems to me the plugs are all wet. I have never really sat down to summarize all the problems that affected this motor until now. I am sure you think I am making stuff up, but we are nowhere near the end… Anyway John suggests I take the car to Bob Watson (Motec guru and well regarded engine builder) leave the car there until EVERYTHING is sorted and go home. John even lends me his precious Carrera 3.0 for me to get home. He’ll pick up my Blue one once Bob has finished with it. I thank John profusely (he just gave me the keys of his pride and joy) and head home really pissed. It’s March 2008, 9 months since the Excellence article, and the car is still in the shop… More to come. Enf of Chapter tree |
hi matteo,
i am with you :rolleyes: my 3.0 RS replica with a modified 3.6 964 motor has (had?) the same problems with the ignition. sometimes i can drive with 12 sparks, most time only with 6. we have changed the ignition coils (sometimes failed), the icu's, the wiring to the spark plugs...) but no really failure found... now i have rebuild the complete motor over the winter (with some more mods)... ...hopefully it will work now :( but one is sure - its not a problem of the color of your car :D http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1235999590.jpg tom |
Sounds like Timmins is no better than the Daryll and his other brother Daryll mechanics that broke the 13 head bolts on my trailblazer at the chevy dealer. Matteo you shouldn't have had to pay one penny or schilling more for that, it should have all been on the builder. My condolences on them putting a cloud on that beautiful car. This proves one thing cost doesn't mirror quality.
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Matteo, my God man I feel for you! I pray the solution and fix is right there so you can get the car back on the road soon. The ups and downs the false hope and teasing must be terrible to endure, being on this side of my project and it nearing completion I can honestly say your experience is my worst nightmere.
I pray for a quick solution for everyone's sake - THANK YOU for taking the time to go in depth on what's been happening. God, I need a scotch after reading up to Chapter 3... |
I have never delt with S.Timmins before one on one.. but I have heard and have a friend that had some serious issues with Timmins a few years ago that ended poorly as well... He had the SAME issues as you .. the motor was smoking like a camp fire..... I do hope it sorts itse;f all out. Love the car, I hate to hear of this stuff happening to people..
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CHAPTER FOUR
On the 14th of March 2008 I get the call from Bob Watson. The car is ready. He’s a bit puzzled by the whole thing but here is a summary of what he found… - He had to trim the fuel mix by 40% (FOURTY PERCENT) to make it idle properly (I was getting 6-7 mpg on the highway btw). - The lower plugs were all wet - The car was running the cold cycle up to 85C which is way beyond what it should be (50C). - The plugs are way too hard (racing plugs) so a new set has been ordered. - A new connector (from Motec) has been ordered to replace the cowboy job Timmins did. - A new and bigger heath shield has been fabbed for the Ignition Control Unit - A new muffler design will be implemented (2 mufflers, 1 per bank). As per the last item on the list the car was way too loud. I tested it with a noise meter and it read 115 db at 1m at 4,000 rpm. In the UK most tracks have a noise limit of 105dbs. The 997 GT3s are at around 105db… you can imagine what 115dbs sound like…. My ears are still ringing to this day… Anyway the car is finally running properly. It took a while, several days off work and some more cash, but I finally found someone who knew what he was doing. I am sure all these little problems were just teething issues and if I had still been in the US it would have been much easier to fix. Still it took a loooooong time. With March the weather here in the UK usually turns warmer and nicer and the track season gets interesting. My car is finally running properly and that gave me some time to start pushing it. I started experimenting with the geometry. I reduced the negative toe (on the track it was insane, but driving on the crappy UK roads made it very stressful and tiring) and the negative camber at the back (somehow it was reading -4.5…. I guess with all the tying down the original setting had gone) and we were close to getting to the sweet spot. I got some professional coaching and on the track there was nothing between me and a well driven GT3 RS. Spring and Summer were nearly uneventful, with me visiting Bob Watson just a couple of times. In the 1st instance the engine started leaking oil from the cam towers covers as all the bolts that held them in place were overtorqued and the case had to be re-threaded. The second issue was with the fan housing slipping off and causing the belt to rip off, but all in all I considered it to be a successful months… This brings us to September 2008. I had booked a track day at Snetterton (the track with the longest straight in the UK) to work on brake balance and a little more on the geometry. With me there was a PCGB club racer, who I had met through Impact-Bumpers and was helping me getting the most of the car. We were having a blast, getting the car on 4 wheel slides :D and basically shaming some properly driven race cars when it all went horribly wrong… The oil temp started going up all of a sudden so I slowed down to cool things off. It happened really quickly as there had be no other signs as the car was pulling fine. As I approached a slow hairpin I stayed off line and slowed down considerably to manage the turn on. At that point (I was probably in 3rd gear) the car stalled. I tried to restart to no avail. We pulled the car into the pits and tried cranking again to no avail. I thought abt a starter failure as we managed to make the crankshaft rotate a little by pushing the car whilst in gear. With my friend we decided to go for lunch and buy a pair of jump leads (the battery was now drained). After failing to get the car running with the leads we tried a jump start but the car would just lock the wheels. We tried pushing it to rotate the crank again but this time there was no chance. I called the AA and had the car towed to Bob Watson (200 miles) who had now become a friend… I knew something it was something bad… After opening the engine Bob did not want to tell me over the phone and suggested I went up to see him. End of Chapter Four |
Sounds like timmins is a real piece of work, who recommended him for your engine build. Its amazing you get the best of everything and get a mechanic that should be working in a chevy dealership not working on high end motors.
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Talk about cliff hanger......
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I keep hitting the refresh button on my computer AND CAN NOT leave till I see what happened in the next chapter...
I am very sorry for your problems Matteo... you of all people with your generosity and sharing your entire build with the Pelican community, should NOT of had these bad experiences. I hope it all works out in the end and all involved will be accountable for the +/- of the build... Best of luck!! Bob |
Chapter Five
So I am driving to Bob trying to imagine how bad it can be. I mean come on… the engine did not disintegrate itself at the track, there was no obvious sign from the outside…. I was thinking about a bearing… a pain in the arse I know… but it could be a lot worse… But why wouldn’t Bob tell me about a bearing on the phone? As I arrive Bob is busy with another client but he notices me. His face changes colour as he asks me to wait for a couple of minutes. After having finished with the client he leads me to the engine room without uttering a word. My motor is spread on the working surface. When I ask him what happened he replies that a bearing was spun, the carousel on the crankshaft is damaged and so it the connecting rod. PHEW I think. But it is not over… The case IS distorted. How? Why? It’s clear that it had been repaired (re-welded) from a major engine blow up (rod going through it?). You can see the welds on the outside and on the inside. How do we tell the case is distorted? Well all the crankshaft bearings are worn on one side only. Then there is the sealant used for the case that is too thick (white silicone) and applied in a bad way. Traces of sealant can be found everywhere inside the engine and also clogged the oil pump. This can have contributed to the bearing failure. There is more. All the pistons and cylinders are scratched (you can feel the grooves with your fingertips) and are basically useless now. The valve springs are not the correct height and were not sitting properly on their place. here are some pictures of the mess.... The case... see how the bearings are worn on one side.. http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1236006314.jpg This is a picture of the case where you can see the welding done to fix it... http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1236006384.jpg The rod and the bearing http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1236006470.jpg The sealant :eek: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1236006582.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1236006626.jpg I have plenty other pictures but you get the idea. I went back and forth with Timmins. To me an engine failure CAN happen. Especially when you take a car to the race track, especially when you push these engines a lot. I am fine with that. What I do not and cannot understand is the bent case. It just makes me mad. I sent more than $40k Timmins way and he used a repaired case???? For the rest I have my opinion of Timmins ability in building a motor and I am taking my responsibility because I chose him when I had other alternatives. I also sent the engine back to him after the initial problems when I should have paid attention to the warning bells. |
Well that sucks, sorry to hear that. Are you going to be able to get Timmins to pay for any of repairs to the engine?
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Good friend told me a long time ago: "what goes around, comes around, sometimes not as quickly as we'd like." From personal experience with Timmons; I hope it's his turn on the (coming around) part. The guy is a whiner. |
I was just on his wesite. His warranty is nothing more than a airtight disclaimer. That's a sure sign he has been here before.
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