Tail or no tail that is the question......

[racer]

Just a couple of questions...

At what speed (corners) did you notice additional body roll?

How old are your shocks/torsion bars/sway bars?

Maybe something is wrong like a bad shock, broken sway bar mount etc.

You shouldn't have to adjust ride height, assuming it was correct before the rear spoiler was added.

Also note that at speed (and it does take a fair amount of speed for the spoilers to become effective- like 70mph or so) your car should be more balanced. Perhaps what feels more skittish at the front is a result of improved rear grip. Just a thought.

[makaio]

Originally posted by island911
HERE is a good thread outlining available tails for that period.

I bought one a while back for ~$400.

Crap, that was 5+ years ago, and still not installed or painted. --It's red w/ a very good condition rubber lip. ...slightly dusty. -4sale

Island,

Is it a Carrera tail? I might be interested.

Let me know, if you really want to sell it.

[island911]

it's an early turbo Carrera tail . ... looks like JAdams



except it's red.

[sfoster13]

island911 PM sent about your tail

[JBO]

I like tails in general, and that happens to be my favorite version. Looks great IMO!

[wachuko]

That tail looks awesome, keep it. If you decide not to keep it then send it my way

Just install a lip spoiler in front to balance the car.

BTW, Did I say that it looks awesome

[Mattcamp]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by racer
[B]Just a couple of questions...

At what speed (corners) did you notice additional body roll?

How old are your shocks/torsion bars/sway bars?

I noticed the body roll at slower speeds than I think it would take to create a strong down-force on the tail. 2nd gear 40 mph.

Shocks are pretty new, Green Bils. This car always handled unreal.......maybe it's coincidence but right after I put the tail on, I noticed the change. Maybe my body guy was out joyriding??






"wachuko
That tail looks awesome, keep it. If you decide not to keep it then send it my way

Just install a lip spoiler in front to balance the car.

BTW, Did I say that it looks awesome"

Thanks, I like it too....My wife isn't too keen on it. That said; it's not for sale yet but you never know.......What color is your car?
BTW...I already have the chin rubber spoiler.

[safe]

Originally posted by island911

Crap, that was 5+ years ago, and still not installed or painted. --It's red w/ a very good condition rubber lip. ...slightly dusty. -4sale

Mine is also red and dusty, just bought it
But I'm having mine painted in a few weeks, when the pay check arrives.



It's a little heavier than the original deck lid, basically its the rubber lip that is the extra weight.

[cubby911T]

Originally posted by Scooter
That tail was not available in '84, but who cares? It looks good, so go with it.

+1 to what Scooter said.....it looks Rockin'!!!

[porsche911girl]

Originally posted by island911
those rubber lips can take a few hits and still survive.

I can attest to this! Even when you think you've ruined a fog light, then you check and realise that all is well and there's no damage to be seen!

Wish I could say the same about my Jeep...

[safe]

Mattcamp, how did the car perform at 60-100 mph with the tail compared with before.

[Mattcamp]

Originally posted by safe
Mattcamp, how did the car perform at 60-100 mph with the tail compared with before.

It feels like someone is lifting my front end off the road..........that may be a little exaggerated but compared to before....big difference. After the tail install on my way home from the body shop, lane changes on the freeway were scary.......It was cold outside but dry.........downhill @ about 120, right hand smooth corner, right hand lane....started in the corner and felt like the front was sliding on ice....by the time I finished the corner that I had driven hundreds of times before with no problem...I was in the left lane....heart pumping, and worried about black ice the rest of the way home.
Point and moral....there was no freaking ice!!!!!!
I crawled under the front end and saw nothing out of place. What the H3LL???
Still drives straight as an arrow.
Any Ideas???

[wachuko]

...
Thanks, I like it too....My wife isn't too keen on it. That said; it's not for sale yet but you never know.......What color is your car?
BTW...I already have the chin rubber spoiler.


My car is Slate Blue Metallic (Schieferblaumetallic - Paint code L661 / X6)... but don't worry, I have the technolgy to make it change colors, .

I currently have one that I purchased from a fellow member of Pelican. But it lacks the rear (second) small grill. So looking to see if I can find one like yours. Let me know what you decide. In the mean time I am finishing the repairs on the one I have and should have it painted by the next weekend. I will post photos when I am done.

My suggestion, again, is to keep it. Looks real good in your car. But my offer stands of buying it if you decide to sell it.

Here is the current one I have:

[safe]

Originally posted by Mattcamp
It feels like someone is lifting my front end off the road..........that may be a little exaggerated but compared to before....big difference. After the tail install on my way home from the body shop, lane changes on the freeway were scary.......It was cold outside but dry.........downhill @ about 120, right hand smooth corner, right hand lane....started in the corner and felt like the front was sliding on ice....by the time I finished the corner that I had driven hundreds of times before with no problem...I was in the left lane....heart pumping, and worried about black ice the rest of the way home.
Point and moral....there was no freaking ice!!!!!!
I crawled under the front end and saw nothing out of place. What the H3LL???
Still drives straight as an arrow.
Any Ideas???

That sounds strange, the opposite of what I hope my wing will do.
BTW, the wing will NOT create any downforce, just less lift.
I guess you have seen these?

[Mattcamp]

{quote}
My car is Slate Blue Metallic (Schieferblaumetallic - Paint code L661 / X6)... but don't worry, I have the technolgy to make it change colors, .

I currently have one that I purchased from a fellow member of Pelican. But it lacks the rear (second) small grill. So looking to see if I can find one like yours. Let me know what you decide. In the mean time I am finishing the repairs on the one I have and should have it painted by the next weekend. I will post photos when I am done.

My suggestion, again, is to keep it. Looks real good in your car. But my offer stands of buying it if you decide to sell it.

Here is the current one I have:





[/B][/QUOTE]

Isn't it funny how $hit works out? I would rather have the tail without the grill. Paint your tail pewter metalic glasurit 956 and ship it here. Wanna trade?

[wachuko]

Originally posted by Mattcamp
Isn't it funny how $hit works out? I would rather have the tail without the grill. Paint your tail pewter metalic glasurit 956 and ship it here. Wanna trade?

Deal. What is the color code of your paint (should be on a sticker inside the front trunk, passenger side beam) so I can stop by the paint store and get the correct paint. L956?? )

Also send me photos of the engine side of the wing.

I will keep you posted on the progress. Always good to have some additional pressure to move along a project. I will send you a PM with my contact info.

[javadog]

Originally posted by Mattcamp
It feels like someone is lifting my front end off the road..........that may be a little exaggerated but compared to before....big difference. After the tail install on my way home from the body shop, lane changes on the freeway were scary.......It was cold outside but dry.........downhill @ about 120, right hand smooth corner, right hand lane....started in the corner and felt like the front was sliding on ice....by the time I finished the corner that I had driven hundreds of times before with no problem...I was in the left lane....heart pumping, and worried about black ice the rest of the way home.
Point and moral....there was no freaking ice!!!!!!
I crawled under the front end and saw nothing out of place. What the H3LL???
Still drives straight as an arrow.
Any Ideas???

Well, here's a couple. You had the chin spoiler first, then added the tail, correct? With only that chin spoiler, you were reducing the lift at the front and not the back. With the new spoiler on the back, you are reducing it on both ends. At the speeds you quote, the aero lift forces are starting to get significant. By adding the rear spoiler you have altered the aero balance of the car. Now the rear sticks better and the front will want to understeer a little more, or the rear will want to oversteer a little less, depending on how your suspension is set up.

You might also have had a different fuel level. Less fuel will give you a higher ride height in the front which will increase understeer in fast corners.

You also may have not gotten your tires fully up to temp. Cold tires do not grip nearly as well as warm ones. There will be less grip available on a cold road anyway, ice or no ice.

I doubt the car rolls much more though. Theoretically you have slightly raised the center of gravity of the car with the extra weight of the spoiler up above the center of gravity of the original car and this will make the car roll more for a given lateral acceleration. I really, really, doubt that you can feel the difference. It will be quite small.

JR

[island911]

Originally posted by Mattcamp

Isn't it funny how $hit works out? I would rather have the tail without the grill. Paint your tail pewter metalic glasurit 956 and ship it here. Wanna trade?

ditto, except the 'paint' part.

I keep telling myself 'better cooling, w/ the 2nd grill.' --but I still just want the Weissachs look.

[Venetian]

In no way am I a fan of any type of tail unless it is there for a purpose ie racing stability, turbo inter cooling etc. Otherwise it only detracts from the clean 911 lines. Most people rave about the look of the early unmolested 911"s with the clean look but think nothing of adding a tail for no particular reason to a later car.

I guess I have the same pet peeve about porsche scripts which again I think detracts form the 911 lines. After all it is the lines of the 911 that attracted us to the car to begin with-why molest it??

Only my opinion I guess.

[Mattcamp]

Originally posted by wachuko
Deal. What is the color code of your paint (should be on a sticker inside the front trunk, passenger side beam) so I can stop by the paint store and get the correct paint. L956?? )

Also send me photos of the engine side of the wing.

I will keep you posted on the progress. Always good to have some additional pressure to move along a project. I will send you a PM with my contact info.

My paint code is L956 but before you go to the paint store, we should talk first......PM me your phone #. I also would like to see some close up pics and underside pics. Thanks......you never know what good deals one might find here on the Pelican....
M.