Would like some info on a ROW 911

[Iowa911]

The car in question belongs to the husband of a client of mine. I think I can get this car for next to nothing. Here is what I know. It is a 1977 ROW targa. It's been sitting outdoors for a couple years. He says the engine was rebuilt not too long before he purchased it and parked it. It has carbs. The car is in rough shape. I doubt the car itself is worth anything. What I would like to know is, what tranny is in it? It is a 4 speed, would it be the same tranny as the 930? Second, I'm in the mood for a project. Would the drivetrain be worth removing and putting in a roller? What I am thinking is pull the engine, go over it real well, rebuild if needed. Here is the Vin#9117311263. Any thoughts or suggestions would be great.
Oh, one last thing what wheels are these and are they worth anything?

Thanks

[acapella8]

Here's a good place to start:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/911/technical_specs/911_guthrie_faq.htm

[billybek]

What does the other side look like?
You have to love the price even if it is a little rough.

[tonythetarga]

IMO, it might be a LOT easier to work with the car you have instead of trying to find a roller to swap parts into. If the tub is solid, then you have to deal with the interior and cosmetic repairs to the car. It depends on the level of restoration as well. If you want it to be a decent driver that you can continue to improve over time, there are plenty of parts available to replace the stuff that is visible in the picture.
The wheels are Rial's I believe and are nothing special.

The VIN does indicate a normal 911 with the 2.7 engine. These can be a problematic engine in their original form and there are a number of upgrades that need to be done to address the original problems. The head studs are one, five blade fan is another, and upgrade to Carrera oil fed tensioners are among the basics. The transmission should be a 5 speed. Are you absolutely sure it isn't? In order to verify you do need the number from the bottom of the trans which identifies the type. While you are at it, get the engine number to the right of the fan. I think the carbs are a bonus and better than the CIS system.
You might want to check out the Mid 9 club here to learn a bit more. They are a bunch of Pelicans that have specific issues with the 2.7 mid year 911's (74-77). http://www.mid9.net/

[Rot 911]

What makes you think it is a ROW 911? Wrong headlights, no side lights.

[Iowa911]

Billybek and Tony,
You are right it would be easier to work with this car, but last time I saw it there was an inch of water sitting on the floor. I guess there is good news and bad news there, the roof leaks but the floor is still watertight. I'll take a closer look, but it is a lot worse than the photos show.
I am aware of the issues with this engine, just looking for opinions as to wether it is worth keeping/fixing. I was told by the owner it was ROW, but he is kind of clueless as far as Porsches. I assumed because of the 4spd. that he may have been right about it being ROW. Here is a picture of the Tag.

[Rot 911]

Cool import sticker. That explains the headlights and no side lights!

[tonythetarga]

From the VIN and my reference book, it was not originally a US destination car. The 4 speed is puzzling though, I was sure by this time they were all 5 speeds by then but I do not have an option list for that year.
If you have the time and a place to work on it and the price is a give away AND you want a project, why not take it on? Keep in mind that at the end of the day it will be worth less than what it will take to get it right unless you're getting it for a grand or so. Parting it out will be the way to go if you're looking at flipping for $.

[Iowa911]

Thanks, parting it out is an option. I'll keep you posted. It may not happen til spring, it's probably frozen to the ground right now.

[GMR911]

Strange, my 77 911 targa was built in march 77 and my serial numbers last 4 digits is higher by almost 400? Jerry

[Iowa911]

That does seem strange. Are the cars assembled absolutely in numerical order? Does anyone know how it's done?

[petrolblue83911]

If that car has been sitting for several years, during which time several inches of water have at times collected inside the car, I would pass. There are a ton of solid sc's out there for very little $ right now which will likely cost you much less to own than this will to restore.

[Iowa911]

I was really just interested in the motor/tranny. If I can get it for next to nothing, is this worth putting some time into as a possible transplant into an older roller?

[M.D. Holloway]

Iowa - I have a 77 ROW with a 4 speed. I thought it wierd at first as well but with a little investigation I found out that ROWs were fitted with 4 speeds - type 915/65. Turbos also had 4 speeds type 930/33.

Keep in mind they only made 1724 of these cars in 1977 with VINs from 9117310001 to 9117311724. With the rap they have gotten, I would be suprised if 500 were still around.

As for the VIN, 9117311263 seemed really familiar. I checked mine and it is 9117311265 so these cars were made pretty much at the same time, maybe the same day. My car was imported as well - a sad thing is that the guy who brought it into the country died in the 9/11 attacks on the WTC. There is a long story about this car. I won't get into it. needless to say it would actually make for a book of sorts.

Were in Iowa are you? We were in Iowa for Christmas. As for the 'problems'. I have 90K on the car. I doesn't leak oil as much as others. It still has its original 5 blade. I often think that the issues surrounding the 2.7 are more about the US version engine than the ROW. If you can get it for under $4000 I personally think it would be a fun project. I also think that if you ever do part with it, sell it (or give it) to someone you care about. These cars really are not the investments you may think they are but they do provide endless conversations pieces and tons of pleasure. Plus you get all sorts of support and compassion on this bored!

[M.D. Holloway]

If you decide to part it out - let me know. Also, try to get some more pics of the engine as well as the interior. A horse eat my original ROW seats.

[Iowa911]

There's the info I was looking for. Thanks! Wow, that's so cool that your car is this one's brother. Was the ROW fitted with thermal reactors too? Have you done the tensioner upgrade and how about the head stud issues.
I don't think of these as investments, I purchased my '84 as a salvage title and probably paid more than I should have. I have loved every minute of owning it. From the hours of wrench time to the many more hours of driving. If I break even when I sell it, I'll be amazed. My car has been problem free for three years, and I'm really just in the mood for a project. I think I can talk the owner into a barter arrangement. It might cost two days of my time.

[Iowa911]

I'll try to get some pictures soon. I'll let you know about the seats. I forgot to mention I live in Des Moines.

[M.D. Holloway]

The tensioners have been upgrade but the head studs have not. The engine doesn't have any heat exchangers and I suspect if yours does it may be because of the emissions laws - maybe that is the only way the car would pass when it came in? That must have been an after thought. The carbs are an after thought for the 2.7. They where equipped with the CIS. Open up the airbox and see if there is a pop-off. I bet there is. if someone went to the work of tensioners and a carb you may have some other things going on as well.

[MBEngineering]

HI Iowa911
I would check the chassis No' under the bonnet/hood and it ties up with the one on the sticker?? as the "3" in the No' is for Japan??

"Here is the Vin#9117311263."




the photos/info is for educational purposes only


I have just checked with my OPC and your chassis No' is not good, please check under the bonnet/hood it is correct.

regards mike

[ChrisBennet]

If you could get the car for free you'd still be paying too much.

-Chris