Case saver and stud question

[gsmith660]

Originally Posted by my1st911

Thank you very much for the offer. I have a junk case that I will try on first, as I picked up my drill press today. I expected to pay around 350 dollars for all this, but when I was quoted 900 I quickly went with plan B. Now that this thread has turned from me asking for help from people who have done it, to everyone betting against me, I have a hard time accepting your offer without at least trying. I asked simple questions, which very few have even hinted at an answer. With the case flat and true, drilling the hole a bit larger with a drill press in my mind would be doable. I understand your concern for me tapping straight but with a jig I dont think it would be impossible. Is this what your concern is? I posed the question before, adn noone has told me where they believe I will fail at this task

Hey I am not betting against you, you sound like you have more experience than you let on good luck and I hope you get all 24 good straight studs.

[Peter Zimmermann]

Originally Posted by gsmith660

Pete is that a special offer or every day prices?

That info is straight off their price sheet. They're an amazing group of guys, when you have a set of 911 heads done ALL the valve springs are on right, and all of the spring heights are correct. They are the miracle workers that transform a tube of 2024 into my 915 pinion shaft bearing reinforcement sleeve in the diff housing. I can't say enough about them, or about the Ford Flatheads that they build from parts, the Corvair heads they fix that will never again drop a valve seat, the Packard bottom ends that might end up on the lawn at Pebble Beach, and other things that they restore with a very unusual amount of precision and dedication.

Again, no affiliation; just a ton of respect.

[ClickClickBoom]

Hello,
We aren't betting against you, just a group of folks who have walked the path before you. Before my boss would let me touch the PT-6s on his plane I had to attend the Pratt and Whitney light and heavy maint. course. Same with the Allison in the Jet Ranger and the Lycomings in the Robinson helicopters. The stuff learned in these courses cover all the things that cant be put into print, almost bordering on art technique. The fact that you are going to try this on a $90.00 drill press and don't understand the different types of taps, shows that you might want to take a class or two. At any rate good luck and post up some pics to prove us naysayers wrong.
Hola
eric

[brads911sc]

Not betting against you... i do most of my own work... the SSI/Dansk exhaust, complete rennaire AC system, new clutch/flywheel, new ignition, etc... but there are some things I leave to the professionals who do it every day... like my targa top restoration (Dan @ Cars Inc)... it is highly unlikely that I could have made my top like it looked when it came back from his shop... Installing case savers in a Mag case is one of those items where the tolerance for error, knowing what your looking at, knowing how it should "feel", and precision at which you must operate usually is benefited by someone who has done the job before. especially since you have to do it 24 times on one case. no one is doubting that you can drill a hole straight, drilling 24 straight is another matter... thats all everyone is saying... good luck with it. we hope you suceed. If you do, post some pics of the process you used. Im sure it will help others in the future.

[my1st911]

Just a follow up. I received my care package from pelicanite (not naming names, but they are more than welcome to take credit) and so far studs are coming along great. When removing all 24 of them, I had two BA*TA*DS that wouldn't give up. I ended up trying to heat them to loosen the threads in the case, but they didn't give up. In hindsight, I should have left them in there, but drilling the others would have been a challenge with two studs protruding. Either way one case is all done, with one broken stud drilled, and one waiting for tomorrow. I started at 1 pm, and calling it a night at 11 pm. Its not for the faint at heart, but very excited so far. My pelican case savers will be in middle of the week, and I will post pics. Its a difficult job, but similar to a good woman, slow and steady.....

[my1st911]

Originally Posted by brads911sc

Not betting against you... i do most of my own work... the SSI/Dansk exhaust, complete rennaire AC system, new clutch/flywheel, new ignition, etc... but there are some things I leave to the professionals who do it every day... like my targa top restoration (Dan @ Cars Inc)... it is highly unlikely that I could have made my top like it looked when it came back from his shop... Installing case savers in a Mag case is one of those items where the tolerance for error, knowing what your looking at, knowing how it should "feel", and precision at which you must operate usually is benefited by someone who has done the job before. especially since you have to do it 24 times on one case. no one is doubting that you can drill a hole straight, drilling 24 straight is another matter... thats all everyone is saying... good luck with it. we hope you succeed. If you do, post some pics of the process you used. I'm sure it will help others in the future.

You are absolutely right, some things are for professionals. But in my instance, some things are left for just me. I would like to let the pro do the studs, but feel like I can handle it. My baby will be painted by a pro who is a friend for cost of material. My targa top while not perfect but will be sewn by my momma because she works for free. It wont be perfect, but will suffice in a rain storm, otherwise the top is off anyway, so who cares. I'd love my top to be perfect, but in this economy things are tight, unless the almighty wants to pay my mortgage. If I can make one hole straight, then another 23 isn't the issue. Check and recheck three times to get good results. It has taken me about 10 hours for 14 holes so far, but its a great learning experience. pics will come after I get some case savers installed.....

[my1st911]

OK, I am happy to report that with a steady hand, a drill press and guidance from Craig (CGarr) my case savers went in like a charm. It took me about 16 careful hours, and by the last 2 studs, I had it down pat. I cant wait for the next case (I have a spare 2.7) that I do. Maybe one day it will be a 3.0 or 3.2. Now on to putting her back together. Waiting on parts. Here s some pics. One question to all engine gurus. The case has 2 dowel pins. Has anyone drilled out the case through bolts to incorporate the dowel pins in all the main "caps" for lack of a better word. If all the main had dowel pins, it would make the case stronger, wouldn't it?









Letme know what you all think.

[brads911sc]

wow. nice job. glad you proved all the doom and gloomers including myself incorrect... very cool.

[cgarr]

I have added mains sleeves but it really requires a line bore afterwords to really square everything up.

[sc_rufctr]

Great job... You're braver than I am. Well done

[my1st911]

Thanks ever one. I took the chance because I thought I would learn a lot from it, which I did. The hardest part is keeping the case from moving around on the platform. After my first drilled hole, I wised up, and got a strap to wrap it around the case and keep it secure. By the very end, the biggest learning experience I got from it is that you have to line it up, and recheck. But as you grind metal away, it has to look uniform. I got better results by watching the material that I was grinding than concentrating solely on keeping it perfectly centered with an alignment pin. Its something that you could understand better after doing or seeing. The case ended up really nice, but my best holes were the ones that was by eye and feel rather than obsessing over the alignment pin

[my1st911]

Originally Posted by cgarr

I have added mains sleeves but it really requires a line bore afterwords to really square everything up.

After all that work, I may just do that. Maybe I can spring from the line bore after all this. Thanks again for your guidance, I will be shipping your stuff back in the next couple days. By the way, where did you get the dowel pins. I have called a couple parts stores I geal with, but they do not seem to have what I am looking for

[cgarr]

The pins are made out of 1/2" .035 stainless steel seamless tubing, the case is set in a jig and holes reamed, the sleeves are turned .001 down on one half to fit the other case half, you only want a press fit on one half. You do have to allow for oil passage in 3 of the sleeves for the piston oilers but this is done with a simple hole bored in the sleeve.

[gsmith660]

Good job, you are a steely eyed missle man now lets see pics of that motor going back together.

[my1st911]

That sounds a bit out of my league, but then again it didnt stop me before. Since this is a budget build, and the car has run fine for 32 years, I may just leave it be. Its not raced at all, just a nice ride to the beach or pleasure. Plus with the prices that the machine shop gave for case savers, I almost don't dare ask "how much"

[my1st911]

Originally Posted by gsmith660

Good job, you are a steely eyed missle man now lets see pics of that motor going back together.

You got it. Just waiting on parts, and spare time. I do plan on getting her together within the next month. Summer is approaching, and my boat needs some attention. Anyone ever put a porsche engine in thre boat. My boat engine is, lets say beat. Its a mercruiser aluminum block with a ford 460 cast iron head. The block warps before the head, and I overheated her bad last year. I have a spare 2.7 in the garage that would make a neat boat engine, or anchor depending on the condition. I will be openning that one up over the summer

[gsmith660]

Put that in a boat and a wave splashes over the aircooled motor that is very warm and SNAP, CRACKLE, and POP.

[my1st911]

Originally Posted by gsmith660

Put that in a boat and a wave splashes over the aircooled motor that is very warm and SNAP, CRACKLE, and POP.

I'm on a lake in NJ. No waves big enough to come over the boat let alone get past the engine cover. The great part would be that I wouldn't need to worry about engine cooling. That would be alot less weight in the back. I'm sure my 3.7 liter mercruser weighs more than my 2.7, plus alot less stuff needed for cooling. Plus it would be eye candy

[jjrowe]

Pretty sure the case savers go in further than that ... Do you have some pictures of the the case with the case savers in? What procedure did you use to get them in straight?

Jesse
76 911S

[my1st911]

Originally Posted by jjrowe

Pretty sure the case savers go in further than that ... Do you have some pictures of the the case with the case savers in? What procedure did you use to get them in straight?

Jesse
76 911S

Well Jesse, as a matter of fact I do. I was installing the case savers as you posted the comment. Basically my procedure is that its imperrative that you secure the engine case to the drill press platform. This was how I started, because trust me I was shaking and scared, and I didn't want to post an ad looking for a case in the used parts section . But when I was closing in on my last one, I didnt have the case secured. Imagine that the hole being drilled will be enlarged. I suppose you could draw a larger circle around the existing hole, but you can have a mental picture of how much material has to be removed from around the lifted edge that the cylinder base sits on. This is the only hard part of the job. The metal is a dull gray, and as soon a the drill bit touches the metal, it takes the dullness, and turns shiney. With this shiney metal you can make slight adjustments with the case to get it right, and as it looks centered I just ate away the metal slowly with the drill. When you take away the "base metal" and your down to the stud hole, the drill bit will start to turn that dull metal shiny, and you can then see if you are centered by eye. After drilling the hole, I switched the drill with the tap, and lowered the tap to th case, and by hand turned it a couple turns, so the threads would be started, and straight. When was all done and the case was on the work bench, I finished tapping the holes with a 3/8 ratchet.