...but it's designed to be driven!

[rscupper]

We've all seen the ads: "...never tracked...", "...no track time...", "...no drivers ed...", "...no track use or other 'abuse'...."

Abuse? I thought Porsches were designed for just such USE. Assuming no cosmetic woes (for those who don't track their cars, small bits of flying debris is somewhat common) or heavy structural damage (hitting walls or other cars is pretty rare) what's the big deal?

Indeed, I would think Porsches NEED to be exercised. Personally, I very much like the idea that a Porsche owner has learned to drive at a DE event. Such an owner, the 'whole' enthusiast, is probably more conscientious about proper maintenance, too.

What do you think?

[Joeaksa]

Brian,

If I were interested in a car in my area, knew the person or had friends who knew him/her, I would have no problem buying a car that had some track time or that had been upgraded/modified.

The one thing we all want to avoid is a car that has been abused, or jury rigged by someone who is trying to go fast while using JC Whitney parts on the car! I hate to think of some of the things I did to the Healeys I was racing with SCCA years ago! Now I would not think of the mods we did, yet it was somewhat safe and we all survived.

The networking we all do on Pelican/Rennlist helps a lot, as someone somewhere will know the car that is up for sale. As long as the car has good history and has been taken care of, most people will give it a fair chance and possibly end up buying it.

I learned a lot with my time on the track and agree that most people do not know the limits of their car until they push it to, and beyond the limit, and this should be done on the track only. If a car like a Porsche is properly built and maintained, its being on the track is not going to hurt it as long as you stay away from the walls and Armco!


JA

[rscupper]

Yes, I absolutely agree that a poorly prepared car (actually even a good one) can be objectionable. Most street drivers would likely find any track-specific modification uncomfortable.

I'm wondering about the completely stock, well maintained SC or RSA or whatever. No mods. What harm could DE events pose to the obviously-other-than-perceived value of such a car?

Hope I'm posing the question clearly. I'm truly curious.

[Jack Olsen]

The most obvious downside is cosmetic. Lots of track use will sandblast the front side of the car. Windshield and front valence, in particular, get ruined by it.

Aside from that, I'd guess there's an accelerated aging effect that comes from stresses to the mechanical components, and plain old metal fatigue. Torsion bars, Fuchs, bushings and brakes all take more of a beating at track speeds. The extra stress on brake rotors, calipers and pads requires more diligent maintenance. I would also guess that the internal components of the engine are under more stress near redline (otherwise, why a redline?), and the temperatures under those conditions also get hotter, which accelerates the wear rate on the metal.

Having put in a temperature gauge on my transaxle also bears out the concern that track driving is hard on the box as well. I've seen 260 degrees in the tranny while the engine is at 210-220. Once again, the price of friction is greater at the higher temps.

These cars are designed for hard use, but that doesn't mean the use isn't hard. Given the choice between a car with 12,000 annual street miles and 4,000 track miles, I'd go with the street car if I were shopping.

Of course, if I'm wrong, somebody set me straight.

[rvanderpyl]

Hmmm, designed to be raced means that it isn't hard on the car to track it. I would rather buy a Porsche that was well looked after and never tracked than one that was.

On the other hand if you want a track car you'd be better off buying a 911 that was driven on the track than a Ford Mustang subject to the same conditions. The 911 wil wear out faster on the track than on the street, but no where near as fast as the Mustang.

Robert

[tmctguer]

"never tracked" doesn't imply never driven. i believe it implies that it has been exposed to some of the risky items affecting a car while on the track such as, accidents, over-revving, paint rash, and overall racing-related wear and tear.

unless i was specifically looking for a car to race that may have racing mod's already made on it (seats, harnesses, roll bar, suspension, etc.), i would lean toward a non-tracked car.

[rscupper]

Thanks Jack. As always good, thoughtful points.

It still seems many buyers are - how best to say it - anal about this. Maybe it's a 'learned response', just one more bit among the countless other what-to-look-out-for-when-buying-a-Porsche bits. Fascinating stuff.

[speeder]

Jack is right. Track driving is a lot of fun and 911's were made to take it, but don't kid yourself. Even million$ full-racing cars get worn-out on the track. Real racing cars get rebuilt a lot, sometimes every race. Obviously there is a distinction to be made between a well-maintained 911 that's been through a few DE's and track car, but when shopping I bought a 911 that had an easy life, now I'm gonna wring it out.