What to look for on a 3.0

[80spitfire]

Hey Everybody,
I'm new to this forum and I'm currently restoring a 74 Targa S. Unfortunately the head studs on the motor are bad. So I've been looking in to upgrading it to a 3.0. I've found one already a, Euro spec motor at that, but I'm wondering what's a fair price to pay for one. I went and looked at it and he actually took me for a drive in the car that has the motor installed in it right now. It sounded very strong. It has 86k on it right now. I was also wondering what should I all look at replacing on it before I install it. I'm just wondering what good preventive stuff I should since it'll be so easy to do with it out of the car.

Thanks,
Brian

[Joe Bob]

Fix oil leaks on top end, replace crank seals, upgrade clutch....check head studs, adjust valves.

[lindy 911]

Flat6pack has a freshly rebuilt 3.0 Euro for sale in the classifieds. Good price and no worries.

[dienstuhr]

The classic 3.0 fixes are pop-off valve and Carrera tensioners, turbo valve covers too.

Cheers and good luck,

d.

[80spitfire]

I checked out flat6packs 3.0 and it looks nice but it's a lot more expensive than the one I'm looking at. I could get this used one for $4300. It's probably the cleanest used one I've ever seen. Do you guys think $4300 is fair? Also what all has to be done to put this 3.0 in my 74 2.7?

Thanks,
Brian

[Joe Bob]

Consider that a top end runs 3-5K depending on who does it.....

[paulgtr]

spend a little bit more now, you will save a bundle later. when you are buying an engine that can cost over 10,000 dollars to rebuild it would be a good idea to look into one you can verify is in top condition.

[80spitfire]

Would any of you happen to know of a good place in Minnesota that rebuilds 911 motors? I'm really torn between getting a 3 liter or keeping my 2.7. I certainly get what you guys are talking about with how much it costs to rebuild the top end on a motor and so I'm starting to wonder if I should just rebuild mine.

[BK911]

Get a leakdown test done.

[Peter Zimmermann]

It's probably not the head studs on your engine, which was built with all steel studs. Your studs are probably intact, but they are pulling out of the engine case. That repair will require complete dis-assembly in order to install case savers. Dis-assembly opens other cans of worms, because your machine shop will probably discover that your crankcase will need an align bore. Then you must consider the heads, and valve guide replacement. The rebuild could easily turn into $14K if your piston/cylinder set is replaced with original Mahles, and the engine is updated to Carrera-type oil fed chain tensioners.

You might consider buying, from Amazon.com, the 8th Edition of my book, The Used 911 Story, to see how all of the 2.7 liter problems can be solved.

[marksearls]

Call Aaron at Flat Six in Minneapolis. Very fair and a good guy.

[dhagood]

while it would be very nice to have a freshly rebuilt 3.0 euro engine to put in your car, $4300 sounds like a good price for a low mileage 3.0 euro engine IF:

1) you're sure the engine is in good repair. take it to a garage and have a PPI done on the engine only (compression test, leak down, head studs, etc).
2) you're sure you have all the parts of the engine you need to install it in your car.
3) you understand what additional parts/pieces/rework/reengineering necessary to install it in your car.

the long block should bolt right up to your 915 transaxle and the motor mounts, but what will you need for fuel delivery, spark, heat, etc, etc.

good luck.

[80spitfire]

Well I ended up buying the 3.0. I got it for 4300 and he also threw in a bunch of parts to throw a turbo on it. So my question is what exactly will I all need to buy so that I can run it in my car. he said he's including everything IE intake, exhaust, injectors sheet metal and all. So what else will I all need for the conversion. Sorry to sound so uneducated, but I come from a snowmobile background so the Porsches are a quite a bit more complicated lol

[Flat6pac]

Did you get the CD 6 pin box, you wont run without it. The guy should have thrown in the oil cooler too, the one to the front fender.
Bruce

[brads911sc]

typically a turbo requires a lower compression ratio. which would require new pistons and cylinders. you also need to think about cooling, braking, exaust, induction, etc when doing a turbo conversion. I would NOT just throw it on an engine that has no documented history. you will likely be doing a 12k rebuild very soon if you do. I would HIGHLY suggest calling 1 or 2 of the following pros who will give you some advice based on what you are trying to accomplish: Henry @ Supertec, Steve Weiner, John Walker, Mike Callas at Rennnsport, Bruce(flat6pac) and there are others...

[brads911sc]

This was a very poor plan. Unless you bought in an educated way or got extremely lucky, you will greatly increase the cost of your project... seek some help before you do anything else. post some pics of what you have, post the engine number so people here can help you...

Originally Posted by 80spitfire

Well I ended up buying the 3.0. I got it for 4300 and he also threw in a bunch of parts to throw a turbo on it. So my question is what exactly will I all need to buy so that I can run it in my car. he said he's including everything IE intake, exhaust, injectors sheet metal and all. So what else will I all need for the conversion. Sorry to sound so uneducated, but I come from a snowmobile background so the Porsches are a quite a bit more complicated lol

[80spitfire]

Originally Posted by brads911sc

This was a very poor plan. Unless you bought in an educated way or got extremely lucky, you will greatly increase the cost of your project... seek some help before you do anything else. post some pics of what you have, post the engine number so people here can help you...

Wow that's encouraging to hear! lol The turbo is still kinda up in the air as to if it'll for sure end up happening or not. Either way I think a nice 3.0 will be really nice to have compared to my nonrunning 2.7. I will post the engine number next week when I get back home and pick up the motor.

[80spitfire]

Originally Posted by Flat6pac

Did you get the CD 6 pin box, you wont run without it. The guy should have thrown in the oil cooler too, the one to the front fender.
Bruce

Unfortunately no I didn't get the oil cooler because he's doing putting a turbo in the car that had it so he didn't disassemble the whole car or anything. I think he's giving me the CD 6 pin box but I'm not sure since the motor isn't out yet.

[dhagood]

Originally Posted by 80spitfire

Unfortunately no I didn't get the oil cooler because he's doing putting a turbo in the car that had it so he didn't disassemble the whole car or anything. I think he's giving me the CD 6 pin box but I'm not sure since the motor isn't out yet.

you will need an external oil cooler, so start looking around for one. our host sells just the cooler, cooler kits, etc, etc.

be sure to ask the original owner to include the CD 6 pin box prior to picking the engine up. also ask him what else you will need besides the engine. make sure you get the CIS, airbox, WUR (warm up regulator) and whatever else you might need as well, or at least know that you will need to find one somewhere.

do SCs also require a fuel accumulator?

edit: if i read the PET correctly, a 74S did not have the trombone cooler in the right front fender, which is what i mean by "an external oil cooler". if this is true, then you will need the oil thermostat as well as all the plumbing between the trombone cooler and the engine/oil tank. it looks like there is a different oil tank for the 74S and the 75 model year, which means that you're looking at a both a big change and a lot of money.

good luck

[TibetanT]

Do the SCs require a fuel accumulator? They sure do!

The 2.7 has one, but I don't think that will work with the 3.0L engine especially if the 3.0L engine you purchased is the later 9.3/1 CR with O2 sensor system; the engine numbers and type (930/16) will tell the experts on this forum what all needs to be done to make it all work.

Check to see with your seller if they have any documented engine history. This is very important so you know what's inside and how to tune it up properly.

Hope your "new" engine doesn't require any work. Good luck and have fun.