3.0 to 3.2ss with pics and Dyno sheets before and after

[justinp71]

Ok, How did the crank look? Its possible he used red loctite and you had to prevail that torq? Did you see loctite on the threads? Over-torquing those bolts is a big no no...

Do you think its possible he forgot to put in the case halfs oil seal? I heard that can give you erratic oil pressure... then once the loctite broke out of the inside case half, your oil pressure would go all screwy kind of like you explained...

[Jcslocum]

Originally Posted by mazing3

I can't remember tq. Specs for oem rod bolts off the top of my head but think it's 55ftlbs. Even if that is correct, they were a hell of a lot tighter than that when I tried to remove them. It took a breaker bar and some serious effort to loosen them up to remove. WAY more than it should have if they were torqued properly. After struggling to remove a few I tested one and it was torqued to 85lbs!! And that was one of the easy ones. I know there was a lot of heat on that crank during this meltdown and if just one or two were extreme I might have chalked it up to that. But all 12 were that bad or worse.

I never thought more about it after that but I'm of the opinion the dufus "expert" either didn't use a tq wrench or grossly over torqued them. My thinking was by doing this he pushed the intended friction load of the bearings way past normal to a point where they were eating material and eventually wore through.

It is VERY typical for the break-out or loosening torque to be easily 2x the tightening torque. If heat and corrosion are involved, then 3x is possible. This increase in loosening force comes from many small changes that occur over time in the joint. The threads deform against one another, nuts and washers embed into each other, etc... I am not saying this was not your root cause, just letting you know the much higher torques are required from loosening.

Good luck with the new build!

[mazing3]

Both of you guys bring up good points for this mystery but I really quit thinking about it all 6 months ago. I know this thread is getting long and lots to read through now but I'm actually the OP of this whole thread and the 3.2ss I built to replace that dead motor is very very happy.

[justinp71]

Ok thanks for sharing, glad to hear your new 3.2 is running well.

I was just curious to hope make sure I don't make the same mistake on my motor...lol!

[KTL]

Appreciate the thank you. I like learning and sharing!

I bet the apparent tightness on those rod bolts was indeed loctite on the rod nuts. But then that wouldn't explain the spun rod bearing. I agree if you found other no-nos when building it, something had to be messed up along the way. Properly built stock engines go miles and miles w/out wrecking a rod bearing. I have a friend with a 3.2 Motronic with 160K on the clock, never had the case opened, and it runs like a scalded cat w/out using oil. The bottom end on these motors is rock solid when built right.

Yep it's my understanding the idle fuel jets, main fuel jets, emulsion tubes and air correctors (both main and idle) are same as the Weber 48 IDF. I don't have my carbs in hand yet but i'll report back when I get them.

I totally understand your intentional vagueness out of respect. Agreed that sometimes it's just more convenient to order stuff thru an online source vs. going straight to "The Man." I don't think that'd offend The Man. He makes his gravy on the carbs, not the little orders for a set of main jets. Just so long as you report back to him what those revised jets did, so he can add that data point to his database of experiences, I think that would make everthing cool with him? For all he knows, you got the jets from one of his dealers.

Don't take that the wrong way, I spoke with The Man just the other day for 40 min. and he was as pleasant and helpful as anyone could ask for. Will always send people his way or to a known good dealer to support his product. It is a work of art both visual and functional. Granted I was sending him $3500, but still, he's a very good soul and I give him boatloads of credit for taking the plunge to make a better Weber.

[Pierre911SC]

Hello Mazing3,

Well let's get back on the subject,

My built is: 3.2ss
3L block & crank.
98mm Mahle PC, 9.5 to 1 comp.
3.2 heads twin plugs, racing springs, tita...
DC-40 cams.
Electromotive ignition.
1 5/8 headers (Rarlyl8).
2 in 2 out BB.
PMO 46mm:
- main 160
- idle 60
- air 180
- emultion tube F-11
- ventury 38mm and 40mm

Your engine and mine are very similar in many points I will try differents mains jets, to see
if I can see a improvements in performances before going to the DYNO man.
I would also like to know, what kind of emultion tube you used ?

Regards

[mazing3]

Good call Pierre- back to you in a sec.

Justin- Spend 20x more time cleaning and cleaning and prepping that case and everything going in it than you do on assembly. Yes, do all three of those things. :-) Then triple check everything before points of no return- i.e. sealing up the case. I started taking pics too because I would stay awake trying to remember if I forgot an oil pump seal or something. Pics confirmed all is well. Do all that and you won't have to worry.

Kev- Richard has always been awesome. Even last week when I was ordering my jets whilst frozen in the Atlanta Snow gridlock for 18 hours last week. We spoke for 30 minutes. Half of which about the global warming phenomenon that caused my fair city to be frozen over. He is a wealth of all kinds of info. My beef is more that I don't know what I'm doing in the carbs that well and seeing sizes and descriptions of various carb parts is easier for me to digest and research before it goes in the car. :-)



Ok Pierre- I like that build and we are very close. Don't know what you are doing for plugs but mine are NGK BPR5ES to .045"

The other difference is the 180 airs. Mine are 185 and we came to think 180s may do a little better. Try those 170mains and maybe a few sizes bigger if you can and see how it goes.

I still haven't had a chance to pull one of my Emulsion tubes to see but will try to remember tomorrow.

The motor did indeed feel different afterwards. There is no butt dyno needed, you know it's different the first time you go WOT!! I got 30rwhp from just the jets and you notice it. Put that in HP Marketing terms and It does feel smoother, and oddly not quite as loud (but it's really loud anyway) and I am already getting better gas mileage.

The difference in our approximate numbers and curves could come from our heads and our exhaust setups. I'm curious to see what that would be like. What size are your heads opened up to? I have 1 3/4 headers and the magna flow-curious to see the differences.

Keep us posted on this one. Should be very interesting. I'm planning another dyno run myself in a couple weeks and am going to implement some of the other great ideas I've picked up on this thread as well.

[Reiver]

Half of which about the global warming phenomenon that caused my fair city to be frozen over. Lol..
But the mechanical info is very worth while......

[mazing3]

Yeah, no one is saying otherwise here.

I just like ordering faster than fax it in and wait for a call when I'm in a hurry. I even have his cell but feel reall funny dialing it like I'm breaking the rules or something.

[Pierre911SC]

mazing3,

My plugs are NGK BP 6ES with same gap as your's,
the heads from a 3.2L, are not modify, except for the added plug, racing springs and titanium retainers.
Headers from Brian Bodart (Rarlyl8) which are 1 5/8 OD, connected to a
Billy Boat muffler 2 in 2 out. (very loud and unpleasant).

Regards

[Dr J]

Can you tell us where you sourced the pistons and cylinders?

[mazing3]

Got it all from EBSracing

Easy to work with and loved that they gave decent credit on cores.

[mazing3]

Awesome Pierre! Get that thing on the dyno and take lots of notes!