Accident?

That's what they want you to believe!!!

Your Mother wears army boots.

You have a photographic memory except you ran out of film.

I hear your wife really likes it when you say something nice about her tooth.

I'd like to thank you for so kindly proving my point. Someone who calls another a troll or suggests a shill relationship without even a shred of evidence is not someone to be counted on for customer service. Your product might be the very best, but without customer service, it will never gain the market share it deserves. You seem to ignore the good advice from folks who wish you well, and also seem bent on making enemies. Trust me, you seem to be a rude person, and anyone who does business with you should ne warned up front that you are not easy to deal with.

Whereas before I suggested that people research all the options, I will now actively warn people away from your products. Maybe this will cause you to think before you post.

So this is my car, and the reason this project is not complete is because sometimes life gets in the way, such as kids going to college (where my "projects" money is being diverted), and getting in a motorcycle accident among other things.
Also I did many more things to my cab...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129055.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129195.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129218.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129250.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129285.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129309.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129339.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129419.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129456.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1462129486.jpg

Excellent! Now we can only hope that Kelogs is true to his word and will not longer post any more nonsense a/c information or re-cycled pictures. :)

Honestly, if it wasn't for the fact that Gilles/Zippy has some of Reid's products in his possession, I would be convinced that Reid has never even laid hands on a 911 a/c system, and that his many years of posting garbage on the subject here is just a sham meant to entertain himself.

Absolutely spot-on post . . . Kelogs is the most pompous, abrasive, and downright abusive, vendor (who is selling, but not selling, but selling his products) I've ever seen post on the Pelican forums. Couple that with his pronounced lack of a/c knowledge, which doesn't prevent him from claiming that he is the new, A/C Messiah, by the way, and you've got the makings of rarefied comedy on your hands.

G thanks for the rescue!

now that you have bared yourself

perhaps you start a new thread for what we are doing?

I so wish Ronnie were still here. He would know exactly what to post in response to this.

thanks for being a very nice gentleman ! you are right
but not seeing it all

time to make a new thread

Why? This thread will still exist.

...and yet, I feel his presence as if he were still among us 😏

Actually I have been following this thread (for a year now) waiting to hear how this system works. The primary condenser is smaller than the secondary with presumably less airflow, there must be 4 lines running from the engine bay to the front instead of two normally present. Will it need another 1/2 lb of 134a to charge also? Lots of promises and teasing but no posted results yet. The PF condensers do look pretty slick, but is rerouting (reversing) the flow actually advantageous?

CORRECT!
CORRECT!
YES! But not how he does it...

My car came with an underbelly condenser and it was run, by design, as the first condenser. So, it was "reversing the gas" long before Kellogg Cereal showed up...but putting the tiny front condenser first, hoping it would do anything? Silly.

howdy dentist90

fyi the whole a/c system with these PFCs will probably require approximately between .95 lbs to 1 lbs .10 oz -to- 1 lbs .20 ozs of R134A refrigerant for optimum amount gestiment from my experience installing these particulate version PFCs when reversing the gases, however CABRIOLETS have cloth tops compared to hardtops and this is the first Cab I have had any version of my PFC designs installed into and expect the cockpit to be warmer then my other installations do to the Cab cloth top air leaks, that is why I am digital controlling the evaporator to run within only one degree increments precisely controllable above freezing to compensate colder

note r134a has a very small/tight window of optimum amount to SYSTEM efficiency, closest to the least amount possible to obtain the coldest temperature;

this is why with 134a your vent temps get coldest just before they need refrigerate added with an extremely slow leak over time than quickly turn warm

for your other very excellent questions you will haft to wait until G starts a new thread, I am done with this thread and abuse

G has unlimited support from me day or night 24/7

No doubt about that!

And anther silly aspect of the whole deal is Kellog's oft-repeated claim that his gear and system renders all existing a/c componentry woefully inadequate and obsolete, while offering supporting vent temp evidence that shows performance which is maybe equal too, and definitely inferior than (depending on the particular, "antiquated" components used and the skill level of the person doing the installation and system charging), systems built with the proven aftermarket items that Kellog so forcefully maligns.

So where are the benefits; a little bit less component weight? Maybe each condenser weighs a little less, but how much does the extra hose required to "reverse the methane" weigh?

It's one thing to post "I have designed a/c alternatives that perform almost the same but might weigh less than what's already available" and another to say that one's new stuff blows everything else out of the water and then provide evidence to the contrary.

Talk about "exposing" one's rear end!

Not to hijack this thread but I rebuilt my pedal cluster and waxed my car this weekend!

Did you use the old school, "wax on wax off" method (a technique that I hear Corvax has mastered to perfection) or was a random orbital polisher utilized?!?!

I can't help myself...

Post 216 has enlightened me to the real purpose of this system; it's clearly stated this is being installed in a cabaret, nullifying the opinions of every air cooled 911 a/c "expert" in this thread (barring those whose career is installing HVAC in cabarets of course [Rawknees probably falls into that category, just sayin']).

:eek:

Brent, now that is what I call an appropriate choice of words, right thar! :D

^^^ ha

I will admit that although there may be nekkid wimmin on the walls on my garage, it does not actually qualify as a cabaret, despite my hopes.

It's a third to claim that you are patent pending when your design existed beforehand. A search for "parallel flow" here on PP shows people dating back 11 or 12 YEARS that were running various curved, PFC condensers in the decklid.

Now, who wants some REAL revolutionary A/C updates!? I'm currently putting together a DUAL CONDENSER SETUP which AFAIK has never been done before....

2 993 condensers in series, WITH fans (Spal, of course), in TWO fenders!

Woah!!! People have done 1 993 part, and people ahve done duel keuhl stuff, and people have done zero condenser setups, but No ONE EVER has done 2 993 condensers. EVER. NEVER. EVER. NOPE.

I expect that I will be keeping other cars around me cool it'll be so efficient.

One thing to consider with PFCs is that if any kind of debris gets introduced into the system (eg, compressor failure), it appears that the industry recommendation seems to be that the condenser must be replaced whereas the older tube and fin style can be flushed and re-used.

This was one of the downsides. IIRC, the other downside was that over time, they crack and leak. Supposedly, the really old style and the not so old but still old serpentine units do not fail this way.

I'm interested in this approach. Eliminate the front and decklid condensers? Or keep them? Which wheel wells get to swallow these condensers?

Eliminate the factory stuff. For sure the front fender left side, then probably the rear fender front side, unless the rear fender rear side works better. People have put the 993 condenser in all 3 locations, so I'll decide once I have it in hand with the fan mounted.

I have both a 10 inch Spal straight blade pusher and a 10 inch Spal curved blade puller coming, I'll decide which I prefer when they arrive and I can bench test them. The curved blade is quieter but weaker, and I know I'll need a pusher if I go in the very back location near the headers.

It is time to clean the rat packs in the a/c threads causing all the trouble
 

RONNE AND ERIC YOU HAVE BEEN banned permanently

YET YOUR STILL HERE WITH A NEW USER NAME

Black 993 Black 993
Administrator

Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 357

Quote:
Originally Posted by msort81 View Post
No it's not trivial. It's actually about where to post that content. Marketplace is not the joke forum and I would suggest not an appropriate venue for ongoing jokes about bestiality and lewd assignation that you find amusing. I stil struggle to understand why not take it to drivers lounge then those of us who don't want to wade through irrelevant marketplace content are not forced to.
Agree completely, and I suggested to Silber and Ronnie a while back that they're perfectly free to perform their routine in the OT forum, where they can waste as much of their lives as they want talking about sheep. But they didn't do that, because the point of their antics isn't actually to be funny -- the point is to annoy, frustrate, and troll everyone who is trying to use the forum for its intended purpose. I warned them to stop and even handed out temporary bans, but I guess they thought I didn't mean it. They're now banned permanently.

For the rest of the brat pack -- straighten up and fly right or you're next.
Old 04-08-2016, 05:24 PM
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It's interesting that rather than answer questions regarding how he makes claims about his products that he is unable to substantiate, Kellogs chooses to spend his time sleuthing out the supposed forum activities of others . . . typical blowhard behavior, I guess.

AKA - derp (as noted above).

I had considered doing the same thing. Doing the dual condenser thing in the wheel well, and eliminating the stock condensers. But let GTI do all the engineering for me. :) I like the idea of reducing some of the hose run. But really, the savings in hose would be small. The big benefit would be no heat dumped into the engine bay, and no clunky front blower. The idea of the upgrade is always in my mind.

^^^

At some point, I want to do something similar - eliminate the tail condenser so I can run a full-bay intercooler, and the nose condenser so I can easily run a nose oil cooler.

Mike B., are you going to post about your dual 993 condenser build? Would definitely be intersting to read about.

no you do not know how i do it apparently!!!

There are not four hoses!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

keep your belly pan condenser mentality that was practically useless due to asphalt road heat rise

Might as well...but it's basically just taking everyone's engineering and sticking it together in a particularly messy way :D

It comes from the fact that I spent all of last year getting my system running all pretty like, buying the crimping tool, learning how to order too many fittings, designing a REVERSED GAS setup with the underbelly condenser that the PO had installed, doing all of the various sealing/upgrading/cleaning/insulating that you guys taught us...and ending up with a kick butt system than ran right around 39 degrees here in South Texas.

Right until they put a new speed bump in at work over the winter, one of the tall plastic bolt-down kinds. Trip #1 over the speedbump caught the underbelly condenser on the corner, Trip #2 ripped it open. Mind you, that thing had been there for about 12 years and never caught on anything...

So, now to RE-design the system using no underbelly condenser, which means moving away from factory stuff completely. Planning a clean shot from compressor to fender condenser #1 to fender condenser #2 to dryer to evaporator and back seems to be super efficient. Also, $100 993 condensers all day long? Yes please. More room in engine bay? Yes please. No front condenser hanging down tempting fate? Yes please. Lots of room in frunk near spare tire for tool bag and relocated mini-washer system? Yes please.

Of course not, there are 5, just like the factory. However, there is an extra 20 feet of hose.

I'll send you my belly pan condenser, so you can convert it to a PFC condenser that is big enough to air condition all of Miami.

Now, I know this is the tech forum, and all posts are supposed to have a certain gravitas, but that one made me snort. Nicely done.

don't send me your belly pan keep it maybe as a souvenir
 

Mike HOWDY

I DON'T USE 5 HOSES EITHER! :cool:

don't send me your belly pan keep it maybe as a souvenir

instead bare with me and let me give you some good advice

I have/had a friend now dead named Gerry, that worked in the well known south Florida Porsche 30 plus years shop; I used to develop, engineer and test my 911 A/C inventions that had a 911 with an OEM 911 belly pan condenser; besides its oem front and rear condensers, that used R12 Freon. Which is a colder refrigerant than R134A. His 911 had every possible, what I call 911 a/c tips and tricks; done to it to make it cold, by the 4 or 5 expert Porsche mechanics that worked for the shop.

To make a very long story short; no matter how much his 911 was tweaked and tried to make cold by Porsche mechanic experts the belly pan condenser system was only a couple of degrees cooler.

TO BE HONEST AS I ALWAYS AM, 911 belly pan condenser’s ARE A WASTE OF TIME AND MONEY, THEY ONLY LOWER AIR VENT TEMPS A COUPLE OF DEGREES and why Porsche quit using them!

Note I never worked on Gerry’s A/C system, he died just about the time just after , I started custom making & testing PFC’s for my 75 Carrera; after I got angry from sweating in my 911, and the obsolete OEM or aftermarket A/C condense technology available from anyone/everyone in the world, and decided to make my own. I DID THIS FOR MYSELF NOT TO MAKE MONEY

FYI Besides Gerry, I have talked about belly pan condensers with Butch Stokes, the original owner 30 years plus Porsche shop, extensively about this and other long term Porsche shops, including their long time senior mechanic’s I also know, about 911 A/C belly pan condensers and the condenses THEY DON’T make much of a difference!!

PFC front and rear condenser ARE THE KEY TO MAKING 911s COLD

I am not trying to sell you anything; I am trying to help you, your –probably on a budget check out ackits.com for universal parallel flow condenser (not painted aluminum) and/or ebay

And adapt them to fit your body cavities the largest size you can find that will fit

Note ACKIT.COM sells old technology that a couple of my competitors buy and resale to 911 owners that don't any better with a high markup

Also try a Google search
universal parallel flow condenser

these are all really cheap old technology or Chinese compared to mine,

mine all are state of the art custom designed specifically for 911s and when properly installed to produce air vent temps in the 30s F @ 95 degrees F Ambient

Yes you do.

Hose #1: Compressor to front PFC condenser (REVERSE THE GAS YO!)
Hose #2: Front PFC condenser to rear PFC condenser (REVERSE THE REVERSE!!)
Hose #3: Rear PFC condenser to dryer (BORING...)
Hose #4: Dryer to evaporator (PLEBEIAN...)
Hose #5: Evaporator to compressor (UGH, SO LAME!)

Please explain how you can do that with less than 5 hoses?

But...mine was FREE. Wouldn't you use (if you were being honest, as you always am), a free belly condenser that lowered vent temps a few degrees if you had the chance? I would, which is why I did. A few degree cooler vent temp for free is FAR better than expensive PFC condensers.

Dear Reid,
Please explain your hose layout. You have five components in a circular arrangement. I think that requires five hoses or pipes. Maybe you have run pipes for the majority of the fore and aft runs.
Thanks
Dave