My Improving Shifting Experience

[zlatan]

I've been slowly chipping away at 82 911 SC I purchased about two months ago. Driving it is as much fun as working on it. I am not a mechanic by any means and learning how to fix my own car is absolute pleasure. Something I don't get to do on our Panamera and Cayenne.

So the shifting was very challenging. Going from first to second was a chore and going from fifth to fourth I would grind reverse often. Also as the transmission got warmer the shifting would get worst.

Following this article Porsche 911 Shifting Improvements | 911 (1965-89) - 930 Turbo (1975-89) | Pelican Parts DIY Maintenance Article I replaced the shift rod and ball cap bushings. I also replaced the OEM shift coupler with Stomski Racing coupler. My coupler was in a very bad condition.

The first test drive was terrible. The shifting was so bad that I thought I royally screwed up. Then I did a bit research and found the instructions on how to adjust the shift linkages on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3nPONBAaZM this really helped. The shifting was greatly improved but not perfect. It would still get a bit worst as the car warmed up and going from first to second required some patience. However, I could shift gears with two fingers .

Then I decided to change the fluid. After reading a few posts it looked like Kendal was a good choice for colder climates. I replaced the fluid and also replaced the top OEM plug with a magnetic one. My shifting seemed the same and even worst than before after longer drive.

Then I remembered that my driveway is sloped so my car was not level when refilling the transmission fluid and I put only 2.5 l instead of 3 liters of fluid in the transmission . So I leveled the car, which was a bit tricky, I used the level on the door to ensure I get it right this time. Put more oil and to my delight the shifting is improved a lot. That was a stupid mistake but a good lesson to follow the instructions carefully.

My shifting isn't perfect but I can now shift without thinking about it which lovely. I notice that if I am shifting at lower RPMs the shifting is better than at high RPMs. The second gear seems to be the hardest and it needs still needs a bit of time to click in. Also when going into first sometimes I need to pull to second a bit and then it goes easier to first. I do this almost mechanically now. I also notice that it really likes double clutching, it feels much easier on the transmission system.

My next project is the clutch adjustment. I hope this post helps someone else and if you have any suggestions to further improve my shifting please let me know.

[Knockdown]

Congrats on the new car, nice write up! Just went through most of this rebuild recently myself, the little darlings really do like double clutches and heel & toe.

[Joe Bob]

All fluid checks should be done on a level playing field. Next time kick out the Mommy Wagon in the garage and do it proper....

[Trackrash]

Find a newer shifter. One of the factory short shifters. They were standard on the '85 and '86 (I think) Carreras. This is not the same as the short shift conversion kits.

Then add a Seine gate unit.

The later 915 shifters also added better adjustability in the shifter itself to reduce slop.

Although a little late now. There is a fork inside the transmission that is accessible through that bottom access plate on the trans. It supports the shift rod in the trans. It can come loose causing poor shifting. Worth checking.

[zlatan]

Originally Posted by Trackrash

Find a newer shifter. One of the factory short shifters. They were standard on the '85 and '86 (I think) Carreras. This is not the same as the short shift conversion kits.

Then add a Seine gate unit.

The later 915 shifters also added better adjustability in the shifter itself to reduce slop.

Although a little late now. There is a fork inside the transmission that is accessible through that bottom access plate on the trans. It supports the shift rod in the trans. It can come loose causing poor shifting. Worth checking.

Thank you for this info. Would Seine do much for my stock 82 shifter. I can see how this would help as I don't like how loose the shifter is.

[juanbenae]

next move should be a new clutch cable and adjustment. don't consider a semi-gate like the seine until all clutch & shift linkage have been sorted out. a new clutch cable, a precise adjustment, and all new shifter bushings if it still shifts balky consider a clutch before syncros. adding a short shift or gate shifter to a car that is not shifting well is putting lipstick on a pig.

how is the pedal travel on the clutch? a new cable can buy you 5000 miles, but ultimately if your not aware of when the clutch or syncros have been refreshed it seems like you are working toward getting that sorted by refreshing bushing 1st.

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by Trackrash

Find a newer shifter. One of the factory short shifters... Then add a Seine gate unit.

The later 915 shifters also added better adjustability in the shifter itself to reduce slop.

+1, beat me to it.

Stomski + Factory Short Shift + Seine Gate all for less than $500

[juanbenae]

after reading your post again that gearbox likely needs work if it's not a clutch adjustment issue.. you can keep checking the bushing and/or clutch boxes by replacing the externals/fluids until you've narrowed down the issue to internals.

if you do not note miles on the car or if there are records as to when a clutch or transmission work was done. if the gear box has 100k miles on the fare side to 250k on the high side it needs syncros & k9 teeth...

[Trackrash]

Originally Posted by zlatan

Thank you for this info. Would Seine do much for my stock 82 shifter. I can see how this would help as I don't like how loose the shifter is.

The Seine kit will do two things. It adds a spring to the first and second gate similar to what you have in the 5 and reverse gate. The shifter will then stay in the 3 and 4th gate and require some pressure to move to the 1-2 gate. The point of which is to remove the vagueness of downshifting from 5th to 4th, and not 5th to 2nd by accident.
The other thing it does is add a gate similar to the stock one on the 5th and reverse portion of the stock shifter.

If your shifter itself is sloppy check out this thread on rebuilding one. 915 shifter--too much play-bushings?

Again, before going the rebuild route check the internal fork in the trans. They come loose and that would cause your troubles. Look at post #19 here Shafted twice on transmissions. Should I stay or should I go?

[zlatan]

I thought I would add another improvement I made to my shifting. I followed the clutch cable adjustment article and it made the shifting noticeably smoother. Especially going from second to first which was always hard. My shifting is still not perfect but this sure helped.

[Lake Guy]

I had similar issues when I picked up my 911 a few years back. It came with a seine shift kit from the PO so I did not have problems going from 5th to 4th but everything else you noted was happening.

First up was new bushings all along. Then came a clutch cable and refurbished pedal cluster. I found a broken helper spring when I did the pedals. After these upgrades things were 100% better. I probabaly also learned how to shift properly with these old boxes during all of this. That makes a big difference too.

Recently I pulled the trans and engine for rebuild and noticed I was probabaly down on trans fluid. I should have checked that originally but didn’t. Now I have it all out and will most likely rebuild it just because. I’m confident 2nd gear syncros need attention but it would have been nice to have verified the correct fluid before I pulled it.

Good luck on sorting yours and congrats on the purchase. The garage time is indeed fun!

[T77911S]

you have to shift slow.

[tirwin]

Trying to diagnose poor shifting over the Internet is problematic because not everyone describes things the same way. My buddy thought he needed a transmission rebuild when all he needed was shift coupler bushings.

It could be anything from a shift coupler that costs a couple of bucks to requiring a transmission rebuild.

Here’s my advice. Start with the simple stuff and normal proactive maintenance. Then you’ll have a good baseline.

You can easily pull the access cover in the backseat to inspect the shift coupler bushings. Replacing all the bushings is a 4-hour project. Maybe 6 if you’re slow or end up doing other things while you’re in there like me. Longest part is removing the center console. You can spring for the Stomski PSJ to save time/hassle of removing and reinstalling the plastic bushings in the shift coupler. Spring for the JWest conical screw with lock nut and the coupler clamp that lets you adjust one-handed. Replace the ball cup and tunnel shift rod bushing. If none of those things are the problem, tou just saved yourself the hassle in the future. Unless you do the PSJ it’s like $30 or less in parts. Doing all this will also remove the possibility that the shift coupler is simply out of adjustment.

The Seine GSK is great. It will improve the preciseness of the shifting feeling but the best reason to me is to prevent the “money shift” of accidentally shifting from 5th to 2nd. I can’t see any reason not to do it.

Clutch cable replacement. Again proactive maintenance and you’ve removed another variable.

You already changed the gear oil so that’s good. Magnetic plug is a good idea or just run a magnet through the old oil. Sounds like too late now but at least you’ll know for next time.

Replacing the clutch requires pulling the motor so if you’ve done the above and still have issues then pulling the motor and replacing the clutch is next. If you’ve gone that far it and still have reservations that things aren’t quite right then I’d get a look at the transmission while it’s out.

Also suggest driving a car that is well sorted so you have something to compare to. Find a local Pelican or local PCA member. Cold beer bribery has been known to lure fellow Porsche enthusiasts.

Good luck!

[blpetry]

FWIW, and this may just be my observation, but my 1-2 shift is MUCH quicker and smoother when shifting above 4000 RPMs. These cars were designed to be driven that way.

[echecsqueen]

Just found this and enjoying this write up. Thanks

[LEAKYSEALS951]

Originally Posted by zlatan

Also as the transmission got warmer the shifting would get worst.

that's funny. If I drive my 78sc about 500 miles at interstate speeds, then, AND ONLY then... does it get the oil warmed up enough to shift from 2nd to 1st smoothly at anything over a standstill!

[T77911S]

the problem with the 911 tranny is that even on a good day it does not feel as good as most cars on a bad day. so when non "Porsche people" get in one they expect something phenomenal because its a Porsche. then there are those that just don't know how to shift them. if you have had an old 901 tranny then you have learned, 2nd before going into 1st or rev and slow going to 2nd because that syncro gets torn to bits by the speed shifters.
in my old 77s if I went from say 5th to 3rd, it was a crap shoot as to if I was going to hit it because there was no feel at all, and then add the fear of hitting 1st.
my 88 325is shifted better than any Porsche I have ever owned.

as for feeling a slight "nick" or grind, if the rare chance a clutch adjustment wont fix it then its internal.

don't ever use synthetic oil in these, it makes shifting worse. too slippery.

don't get me wrong, the 911 gearbox can be a very reliable one, people just have to realize its temperamental and you have to give things in there time to "catch up" between shifts.

[gptom]

OP, if you have more trouble shifting at high revs, check the 4 motor & transmission mounts for slop