My 944's timing belt broke. Wondering about options upgrading engine.

[tomwg123]

My '85 944 has been good to me and I have loved driving it. I was bummed to to find out today the timing belt broke. It's sounding like it will be ~$2500 to fix.

I have wondered for a while about options for upgrading my cars engine. Now may be a good time to look at possibly doing something like this.

A couple years ago I saw an awesome 944 on e-bay. I wish I still had the link. It was a copy of one some professional driver made. The HP was like tripple the stock 944's, plus other mods.

I'm curious what engine upgrade kits are available and what recommendations people have in this area.

-Tom

[krystar]

the LS1 upgrade adds 4 more cylinders and 3.2 more liters.

[rickharrison]

Too bad you didn't go the the Hershey swap meet...heads there for $25.00...shop my friend, shop. It shouldn't cost you that much at all.

An Ls swap (V8) will run you $5-$10,000 depending on how "skilled" you are at fabrication, if you want it done right.

[Icey1174]

There is a classified section on this site. I am sure there are people there with a head that will work for you. Post over there that you need a head. I would think you could get one for $250. Maybe $100 or so for all the new gaskets and a few+ hours of time and you'll be back up and running.

[Icey1174]

Here is a link for used parts on this site. There is a search function. Just type in head and pick which one you want.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-924-944-968-used-parts-sale-wanted/

[rmconner80]

Rebuilt 8V heads are available on the cheap, just turn in your core...

Anyone have a 8v NA head with bent valves?

http://www.benms.com/944head.html

[many944s]

Thanks for the reference rmconner!

He's correct, heres the brakedown:
Rebuilt head: $375
Head gasket set: $110
Belts: $65

Getting your car running again... priceless.
- I couldn't resist

Once you add in shipping, you get everything you need to get your engine back up and running (less oil, coolant, and labor) for under $600. At least that's my package deal!

Let me know!
-Nick

[KrazyKarl]

semi hijacking the thread, how much to rebuild an S2 head?

[tomwg123]

Thanks for the replies everyone. That's good news I can fix it for a lot less if I put the effort into it. I don't know the first thing about doing this type of job, but it could be fun to learn.

I remember reading the equipment for the 944 timing belt install is pretty specialized. I'm guessing I would have to go to a Porshce specific garage to install it, right?

As far as upgrading to a bigger engine, that would be most fun if done myself. I'll have to learn the basics first I guess. Also since I don't have the money right now I'll just try and work on planning that out for the future.

[tnporsche]

How about a chev G6? I think thats what this is.

[TibetanT]

tomwg123:

First and foremost, welcome to the Pelican forums. The 944 folks here are simply incredible and very knowledgeable of the engines in these cars. Especially, Nick, he is very good at what he does. I said it once and I will say it again, here:

Nick can switch an engine out of a 944 faster than you can wipe snot off of a baby's chin!

And, this brings up a good point that I feel must be taken into consideration at this time. While you can have this list:
Rebuilt head: $375
Head gasket set: $110
Belts: $65

You must ask yourself one other important question. That being, what caused the belt to break in the first place?

Why do I say this? Well, until you get to the root cause of the problem you will only be scratching the surface to get this car fixed right.

For example, I am currently working on my 60K miles maintenance and I am finding out that while the timing (cam) and balance shaft belts have lasted 59,956K miles, the balance shaft seals were just beginning to leak and the water pump was showing signs of aging due to scoring on the pulley. So, if I were you, I would do a complete maintenance/overhaul of the timing components as well. I mean since you will have the engine torn up for replacing the head, this will give you plenty of room to replace all the seals, gaskets and service the oil cooler at the same time. These seals and gaskets should only add another $100.00 to the total. If the water pump is the cause of the failure, then that will add another $300.00(new).

If you can do the work yourself, that is the real winner here because YOU will know the car was done right!

Once again, welcome and good luck with your car and getting it back on the road.

[tomwg123]

tnporsche: Oh that is a pretty picture Makes me want to get good at working on cars. Where is it from?

Maybe if I dig through all my old backup CDs I'll come across the e-bay listing I saved of a really nice looking 944. I wish I could remember the details of it.


TibetanT: Thanks for the kind welcoming. This seems like the best place on the net like this for talking about 944's (as well as some other types of cars).

Good point on wondering what caused the timing belt to break. I would imagine it was just because it was so old. I don't know when it was last replaced and it was recommended for me to do a while back, I've just been low on funds.

I look forward to in time fixing my car up and bringing it back to life. I have an attachment to it and want to do that even if I come up with enough money to get a nice new car. I'm sure some of the guys on here will have some good feedback as I start looking into possible things to do.

-Tom

[tomwg123]

A while has gone by. I didn't do anything with my 944 yet and it has been sitting in the driveway. I'm looking ASAP now to either sell it or fix it. I came on here to investigate the option of fixing it a bit more.

TibetanT commented that maybe some problem exists beyond typical wear that caused the timing belt to go. I'm hoping there isn't an underlying problem since it was overdo and my mechanic shop said it should be changed months prior to breaking. I know virtually nothing about car mechanics though.

Nick (many944s) presented a list of parts for a good price. I'll see if he still has them.

If he does, this still leaves a huge questionable area for me: the mechanic labor. I know nothing in this area. Does anyone have good input on how to find a qualified mechanic who will offer a good price? What would a good price look like?

Also, I've heard for timing belts Porsches use a specialized device to tighten them. Would an independent mechanic just rent this or would he have to have it? Should I require that any mechanic doing this have experience with working on Porsches? 944's? Porsche timing belts?

It would be nice to spend the few hundred extra and do other stuff while the engine is open, but it likely isn't an option. I'm trying to figure out a way to just do the minimum to get a running car again.

[TibetanT]

tomwg123:

Hey there! Thanks for the update on your car. Sorry to hear it is sitting in the driveway/garage not being driven.

Where are you located? If near Eastern Washington/Idaho border, I can help you with this work.

[TibetanT]

Also, forgot to mention this. If you go to www.pca.org, and join the PCA your local club/region will be able to help you get to the right place, as far as a mechanic is concerned. In order to join the PCA, you will need to have the VIN and be the registered owner of your Porsche 944. In other words, the legal owner which I am sure you are. Not necessary to join, but you will need the VIN.
Approximately forty two dollars a year to be a member.

Yes! There is a special tool Porsche factory trained mechanics use to tension the timing (cam) and balance shaft belts, the P9201.

There are some that use the "cricket" tool sold by 944online.com. You will need a flywheel lock as well to do the job correctly.

Do you have the Haynes manual for the 944? It is a big help, but, YOU will need other sources of information to be precise, such as: Porsche Factory manuals, Clarks-Garage.com technical procedures, and friends here at the Pelican boards to ask questions as you go.

Before I did my first timing belt job years ago, and even though I am a sessioned air-cooled type, I did extensive reading before even attempting to start. I read the factory manuals, the Haynes manual, Excellence magazine articles, and all the Panorama magazines I could find that related to the topic. (Guess, I was paranoid or something. Ha.)

If this sounds overwhelming, then, don't sweat it, save your money and in the mean time find a very good Porsche factory trained mechanic to do the job. Don't just let anyone work on this German wonder of engineering, it just is not worth it IMHO to go down that path.

Good luck and I hope you keep us posted here on how we can help.

[tomwg123]

Hey TibetanT,

That's really nice of you to offer to help. I wish we lived close enough where it was realistic. I'm in San Diego. I should have done it before but just now updated my info to show my location.

Maybe someone on here can recommend someone closer who would help for a reasonable price. I was thinking of checking Craigslist, but I don't know how much Porsche specific experience a mechanic would need.

We'll see how it goes.

[tomwg123]

If I had a setup with the right tools, it would be fun to do my self and learn on. It may go a bit slow, but I suppose with all the written docs and help on from people online, it should be doable. I'm trying to get out of my Dad's house ASAP though. Found a few craigslist mechanics to e-mail for pricing info. Unless something changes w/ finding a way to get more money, I doubt I'll have more than $1000 to work with. I'm doubtful on finding a mechanic who will fit my budget, but who knows.

Thanks. I'll let you and the forum know what happens.

[halik]

Originally Posted by rickharrison

Too bad you didn't go the the Hershey swap meet...heads there for $25.00...shop my friend, shop. It shouldn't cost you that much at all.

An Ls swap (V8) will run you $5-$10,000 depending on how "skilled" you are at fabrication, if you want it done right.

Judging he thinks it's $2500 to fix a broken tbelt, I would say that's out of the question...

[speedracing944]

Heck if you lived near wisconsin and you threw me $400 for labor and got your rebuilt head from Nick I would do it for you.



Speedy

[HondaDustR]

The belts can be tensioned by hand with the right technique. Do a search on the forum.

How did the belt break? Did it outright break, or did a few teeth strip off? You may as well start pulling some covers off and have a look, then you'll know if the water pump, some seized rollers, oil leaks, rubbing, or just age was the culprit. Then you'll have a better idea of what you'll have to spend.