Group B info and picturs wanted

[stv951]

I am not sure that it is a 911 Turbo, despite what the title says, but its a great vid from an incar coverage of a rally 911 at a special stage

Worth seeing it

YouTube - 911 Turbo Porsche Rally Crash

[jimmcc]

Porsche Group B

911 & Porsche World - April 2002

[willtel]

Jackpot
Porsche 930 - Racing Sports Cars




You can see the Ronal logo on the wheel here.

[911st]

That looks like a Porsche Kremer intercooler. Kind of what I was expecting.

Looks like the wheels where probably the center-lock BBS wheels.

[911st]

It looks like the Kremer motor build might be close to the same as the Group B. If so the following holds some clues.

Basically a blueprinted 930 w Group B cams, Kremer IC, race muffler, larger turbo (K29 style?) adjustable boost (.8 to 1.2 bar) making about 360hp to 480hp.

Originally Posted by voitureltd

This car has group B cams

I have heard from others the motors (ed - Group B) were tested open exhaust at what boost level I do not know but maxium set up overall I would assume. . So now after the US restrictions, who knows. We just had the turbo out for oil seals to Bob @ Durabilt turbo rebuilders Chicago. They usually have a 1 day turn around however he said the turbo rebuild parts took a week to get as the Turbo was a race hybred and was similar to the much later KKK 7200s inside. Anyway I do not know what that has to do with the HP output other than he said it was well suited for the motor spec, by it's internal condition.img]http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads16/DSC000821264891087.jpg[/img]

[jimmcc]

[QUOTE=911st;5251669]That looks like a Porsche Kremer intercooler. Kind of what I was expecting.

Looks like the wheels where probably the center-lock BBS wheels.

QUOTE]

If you look at the engraving on the IC tank, the last characters appear to be Kremer or are my eyes playing tricks on me. If so, what are the preceding characters? I'm not familiar with Kremer ICs of that period.

The wheels on the car featured in the Group B article in 911 & Porsche World were BBS. However some of the other shots show standard five lug patterns. This may be differences in Group Bs built by Porsche vs the privateer versions or cars set up for Le Mans as opposed to other racing events.

[911st]

The IC might say 'Porsche Kremer'.

[jimmcc]

Originally Posted by 911st

The IC might say 'Porsche Kremer'.

If I expand the original, uncompressed scan up to the point of blurring I can make myself believe it could say Porsche Kremer. How's that for being vague?

[zeb930]

Porsche Kremer for sure..

[911st]

Excellent Zeb!

[911st]

I do not think the factory cars had hood pins which might suggest this car has some mods on it over what was supplied from the factory.

I suspect the Kremer IC was delivered with these cars but this may also be an improvement.

I wonder if the 917 calipers were fitted, if the trans had a cooler and different gears?

The exhaust was changed so I also wonder about what this was? Guessing a gutted muffler and no heat exchanger tin on euro pipes. The turbo is also still a question. Probably close to the K29's or RUF turbo's of the time.

[kenikh]

Originally Posted by 911st

Another pic:

What wheels are these??? SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIICK...

[911st]

See post #13

[jimmcc]

I reread the article and discovered a side note that indicated the intercooler was a Kremer. The quote reads "Intercooler bears the name of the Kremer brothers."

The clutch and transmission were 935 components to handle the 500Nm of torque at 4500 rpm.

Wheels were 9.5 and 11 inch, 16 inch diameters. Front tires were 245/575/16 and rears 300/625/16 which roughly translates to 287.5/24 on the front with a 22.6 inch diameter and 312.5/36 on the rear with a diameter of 24.6 inches in todays measurements.

[willtel]

I found a few more pictures from the 1983 Le Mans race.

Le Mans 1983 - a set on Flickr

[911st]

Excellent!

Wish we could get some pictures or details on the exhaust system?

[willtel]

I ran across some info here, 1985 RUF BTR (Porsche 911 Turbo)

Originally Posted by Karl Ludvisgren

For the 1983 season Porsche built six 930’s expressly built for racing. Suspension was stiffened with torsion bars up 3mm in diameter to 22mm in front, and 1.5mm at the rear to 27.5mm. Front Anti Roll bars were a thicker 22mm while their rear bars were made adjustable for stiffness. The 930’s 917 brakes were good enough to start with, but Porsche was able to make larger 330mm brakes available for 1983. These fitted inside 16” wheels with 9.5” front rims and 11” rear. Constructed much along the lines of the 934, the Group B 930 had an aluminium roll cage and an aluminium cross brace above its 26.5 gallon racing fuel tank and an oil tank in the front compartment.


Working within Group B rules, the engine was given cam timing with more overlap, a larger intercooler and boost pressure raised to 20psi (1.4bar). Output rose to 364hp@5,500rpm and torque increased substantially to 360 ft/lbs @ 4,500. To cope with the higher cylinder head pressures, 935-type head gaskets were installed. Completing the drivetrain was a clutch with sintered metal linings and a gearbox equipped with an oil pump and cooler.


What would Porsche’s customers do with a car like this? Why take it to Le Mans, of course! It was a tribute to their confidence in the provisions that Porsche had made in these vehicles that their owners felt they could be subjected to more than 24 hours of flat out speed at Le mans. As a matter of fact, they could. Of the six cars entered in 1983, one retired and two finished well back. The other three were first, second and third in Group B and 11th, 13th and 15th overall. At scrutineering they weighed in at and above the 2,723-pound minimum for their engine size, to which they had to be ballasted by some 200 lbs of lead in the passenger foot well.....It’s 0-60mph acceleration took 4.5 seconds and it reached 100 from rest in one-fifth less than 10 seconds.

[911st]

willtel,

Excellent!!!

Sounds like a very streetable front stiff set up.

Wish we could get better info and a picture of the headers and muffler (zork?).

[spence88mph]

This car belongs to a buddy and fellow but rare posting pelican.

Factory delivered with Kremer intercooler, Kremer tail, group b cams, adjustable boost (wheel of death), front mounted oil cooler, headers, exhaust, 930S ducted rear guards, boxed rockers and seat belt holes cut and trimmed into the sports seats. It was a special wishes car built pretty much to group b spec. It's a very special 930 I enjoy drooling over...

[911st]

Cool!

Are you saying it was it factory delivered from Porsche with headers?

If so, any pics or info on them?