New Harley

[rcooled]

Originally Posted by cockerpunk

they are also making an electric bike.

This is an interesting move for a company who's stock-in-trade is turning gasoline into noise. Who'd want a whisper-quiet Harley anyway? Can't draw any attention to yourself with something like that...

Originally Posted by BSiple

Cue the typical nagative comments in 5,4,3,2,1.....

Didn't wanna disappoint you

[varmint]

I like the sport bike. It’s almost as good looking as this husqvarna.





The other one looks like someone tried to make an Amy Schumer robot and gave up half way through.

[Yorkie]

I'd hit the café. Would not touch the other thing with yours.

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

No disrespect, I've got to ask, what about this cartoon of a bike do you like? Exhaust alone makes me chuckle.

None perceived. I've wanted a Harley for a long time but I'm a little guy and at 66 yo nowhere near strong enough to deal with a typical HD ride. This one looks like a geometry I could handle and if they used any of the VRod engine technology it could be fun.

[epbrown]

Originally Posted by BeyGon

I think the first one looks hot. but then I had a 77 Café Racer so that's something I like.

I like the first one as well, but - this being Harley-Davidson we're talking about - I'd want to know what it will weigh.

[Tobra]

It will weigh about the same as a Fiat 500

[HardDrive]

Looks cool, happy they are making it, but I sure hope they are pouring more R&D into their electric bike, because that is the way the world is going. Big time.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by peteremsley

its a water cooled v4 from what the article says... might not shake your bones too much!

Everything I've read says V-twin. That makes more sense for Harley.

This actually looks like a pretty savvy move. As a naked twin sportbike, they are clearly not trying to be the pointy end of the spear as far as motorcycle performance. Leave that to the Japanese and Italians to squabble over, with the necessary year on year changes to keep up with the Joneses. This bike will represent real world, usable to mere mortals street performance in a platform that should be able to evolve at a pace that will not bankrupt the company in constant race shop R&D.

I see it as a good, solid platform that can offer many variants, like Ducati are doing with their Scrambler package. Or like H-D themselves have done for generations with only three basic motorcycles. Naked upright sport bike, add a fairing and bags - sport touring bike. Raise it up, add knobbies, adjustable windshield, rock guards, and ammo cans - adventure bike. Put a full fairing on it and clip-ons - canyon carver. Lots of potential here - we'll see what they do with it.

[Chocaholic]

For your assertions to hold water, HD will have to price it at an attainable level. Sounds like you describe mid-tier performance in a market saturated with stunning machines. Not sure I see that as a savvy move, but as you say, time will tell. Perhaps the HD heritage will pull it through, but I wouldn’t bank on that.

That leaves HD with a dilemma. Lower margins and a market perception of “meh” performance reinforced by low pricing (and margins). Or try to foist a mid-tier performer at a high price to appease the finance guys. That model didn’t work so well for the V-rod.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

HD should be applauded for trying something new but I don't think designing for the 50+ customer base is a smart move.

The second bike is much more Scrambler hipster millennial. They should focus on developing that market. And I've posted this way too many times, they should put out a modern version of this bike. Young people will buy it. Want proof? See pic under video. Or they can just keep making your father's Oldsmobile.




How freakin cool is this bike?!

[Chocaholic]

Triumph already makes that bike...believe they call it a Bonneville Bobber. Cool, but trendy. Don’t think it’s a big seller. You really think they need to make yet another modern version of a retro bike? I think that’s partly what got them to this point. Seems a trend that’s run it’s course.

In y humble opinion, Harley’s chops are in the touring segment. I hope a significant part of their R&D is going there. Long past due to take that platform to a new level. But the retro stuff is worn out. Something new, innovative and tech savvy that’s appealing to guys much younger than me.

[Chocaholic]

Here’s the Triumph...

[javadog]

I'm not terribly optimistic. Harley has tried many times to make something other than their current product and none of their offerings have been successful. At best, I think they will have a niche following.

Their engine is not suited to a sport bike, you would have thought they had learned that lesson with Buell. When I look at their sport bike offering, the three thoughts that come to mind are fugly, heavy and a high center of gravity.

The second bike is peculiar, in the same vein as some of BMW's worst offerings. No thanks.

Harley is not alone, though, there are any number of other offerings from just about every manufacturer that are butt ugly and pointless. I think they need to revisit there roots to find out what a motorcycle is, it seems like they are watching too many CG Hollywood movies to get their frame of reference.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Designed for old men. But at least they tried.

here's what Harley and apparently Triumph don't understand. A retro re-design must appeal to a new generation. Not their original old one. Cadillac finally understood that and has done phenomenally well with that simple yet elusive concept.

Old people buy things but they die. It's not a recipe for growth. Young people buy things and become lifelong customers, when done right. Subtle difference.

Harley has never actually done a retro re-design. They've just kept selling old bikes. Again, not a recipe for growth, and here we are.

Originally Posted by Chocaholic

Here’s the Triumph...

[javadog]

Designed for old men? Not this one. Having been an avid motorcyclist for what I consider it's glory decades, I just cannot stand most of the new designs.

As for designing bikes for a younger market, in theory that's a good idea but I'm not seeing much interest between young kids and motorcycles. I don't know one that would prefer a motorcycle over the latest smart phone. I don't think the industry will die completely, but I think it will continue to decline in the Western world. In the parts of the world where motorcycles are just a means of transportation, I think they will continue to be popular.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by javadog

As for designing bikes for a younger market, in theory that's a good idea but I'm not seeing much interest between young kids and motorcycles. I don't know one that would prefer a motorcycle over the latest smart phone. I don't think the industry will die completely, but I think it will continue to decline in the Western world. In the parts of the world where motorcycles are just a means of transportation, I think they will continue to be popular.

It's not theory, it's practice. I've recently developed a new food. The first thing I did was google "millennial food trends" to see if they would buy it.

A quick google reveals motorcycle sales took a hit after the 2008 global meltdown but were climbing fast just prior. If the right bikes are designed for new young markets today, they will sell. Electric bikes, bikes designed for women, bikes designed with millennial tastes in mind...

[javadog]

And what do you think a millennial's taste in motorcycles would be? Assuming that you could find one that knows how to ride one, of course

[Shaun @ Tru6]

There's a reason market research companies are hired to do focus group testing.

Sand and snow bikes are selling well to millennials. I see them all the time on streets and roads.

[flipper35]

You would think these would sell better then?

[dlockhart]

KC's speculation on the new HD.

Harley has historically worked with peak-power piston speeds of 3,500 feet per minute. Piston speed is just twice the stroke in feet, multiplied by rpm. Its engines, when bikes are tested on rear wheel dynamometers, tend to produce stroke-averaged net combustion pressures of 120–130 psi at peak power, and 130–140 psi at peak torque.


https://www.cycleworld.com/closer-look-at-harley-davidsons-new-975-and-1250cc-v-twin