Miami condo collapse

[dad911]

Originally Posted by rfuerst911sc

It's being reported the condo is insured for 45 million , that will hardly be the deposit on all the costs that will be racked up with clean up/demolition/lawsuits/other . This is going to be one ugly ride.

The units were selling at 7-800k. That makes it a 80+ million dollar building.

[rfuerst911sc]

Then they were/are grossly underinsured .

https://news.yahoo.com/simply-not-enough-surfside-condo-155823070.html

[porsche4life]

Will insurance even pay? If they can prove that it was a known issue that the HOA failed to address, you can bet money their lawyers are going to put up a huge fight before they scratch any checks.

[craigster59]

Originally Posted by porsche4life

Will insurance even pay? If they can prove that it was a known issue that the HOA failed to address, you can bet money their lawyers are going to put up a huge fight before they scratch any checks.

Kind of like not clearing the brush around your dwelling when you live in a high fire area?

[porsche4life]

Originally Posted by craigster59

Kind of like not clearing the brush around your dwelling when you live in a high fire area?

On a much larger scale? I mean I’m not an attorney, but I’ve seen one played on Tv enough to know that this is the kind of thing an insurance company would love to wiggle out of.

[hcoles]

Originally Posted by rfuerst911sc

Then they were/are grossly underinsured .

https://news.yahoo.com/simply-not-enough-surfside-condo-155823070.html

I bet you are right. They are not insured to the level needed if negligence caused ~100 people to die. I'm thinking the lawyers are going to be careful regarding involvement - there is not enough money available after it is split 100-150 ways.

[john70t]

In 2019, five of seven Board members quit.

https://www.businessinsider.com/florida-condo-collapse-most-board-members-resigned-2019-repairs-report-2021-7
Most of the collapsed Florida condo board members resigned in 2019 amid disputes about the cost of repairs that never went ahead

[javadog]

Originally Posted by dad911

Probably broken pipe. That video was shot at street level, ramp down to parking.

That water wasn’t under pressure, it was draining from above. There may have been a broken pipe, but it was in another area. That makes me wonder if the upper floor of the garage flooded for some reason, the water collected in the middle where it was previously known to pond and then the weight of the water precipitated the collapse of the slab. That slab seems to have collapsed before the building, which makes me think that a column or two may have been damaged when the slab collapsed and that was what precipitated the rest of the building to come down.

Early days, but I wouldn’t bet against that possibility.

[hcoles]

Originally Posted by john70t

In 2019, five of seven Board members quit.

https://www.businessinsider.com/florida-condo-collapse-most-board-members-resigned-2019-repairs-report-2021-7
Most of the collapsed Florida condo board members resigned in 2019 amid disputes about the cost of repairs that never went ahead

This will all change when the residents demand collapse insurance. I wonder how much a 500 million policy costs?

[HobieMarty]

^^^ there is a video from the Miami Herald showing a computer model of that very scenario. It shows that when the parking level/pool patio area collapsed, it then triggered the middle of the building to collapse and then that other section, now exposed, couldn't stand on it's own and came down as well.
Now it appears that the remaining standing structure is showing signs that it too may fall.
If they have to bring the remaining structure down, will it still be possible to determine what caused the collapse or will it all be guesswork and speculation from here on out and no answers???

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[john70t]

They will be sending in the remote cameras for sure.

[dafischer]

Originally Posted by MBAtarga

Certainly a precursor to the "breaking" point and inevitable collapse.

Did anyone happen to see the bits of rubble on the parking lot floor behind the water leak?

[ramonesfreak]

Originally Posted by porsche4life

Will insurance even pay? If they can prove that it was a known issue that the HOA failed to address, you can bet money their lawyers are going to put up a huge fight before they scratch any checks.

that is the very thing you must prove as a plaintiff….that they knew or shoulda known there was a defect and still failed to cure….that’s negligence and it’s what liability insurance is for

it’s also a perfect res ipsa loquitur case….though no idea if that theory is recognized by florida tort law..probably is

the HOA has lost already

i think the real question here is, what were the policy limits…i can’t imagine the policy anticipated an event like this, with this many death claims but maybe it did

[ramonesfreak]

Originally Posted by porsche4life

On a much larger scale? I mean I’m not an attorney, but I’ve seen one played on Tv enough to know that this is the kind of thing an insurance company would love to wiggle out of.

ain’t gonna happen unless there was a clear policy exclusion that applies and that is unlikely. an insurance policy is a contract with all terms spelled out and you don’t wiggle out of it

if your drunk and you drive into a minivan and kill an entire family, you think your insurance company is going to wiggle out of it because you could have avoided the crash by not driving drunk? nope

plaintiff still has to prove negligence but an insurance co doesn’t get to just walk away because the facts look bad…..this defeats the public policy of insurance

[javadog]

Originally Posted by HobieMarty

^^^ there is a video from the Miami Herald showing a computer model of that very scenario.

Do you happen to know a link for that?

[javadog]

Originally Posted by dafischer

Did anyone happen to see the bits of rubble on the parking lot floor behind the water leak?

I saw what you’re talking about but I couldn’t really identify what it was, the video was pretty lousy.

[McLovin]

Given how ummm, “frugal” the condo owners were with critical repairs, I’m going to guess the association is very underinsured. To keep the premiums down as much as possible.
As far as coverage, of course insurance covers negligence, that’s the whole purpose of it. However, very often gross negligence (of course along with intentional misconduct etc) is not covered.
That’s usually tough to show, and here it appears the association was in the process of getting bids, putting a big assessment in place, etc. So they were taking steps, it was just a little too late.

[HobieMarty]

Originally Posted by javadog

Do you happen to know a link for that?

Sorry no, I found it on youtube by scrolling through videos about Champlain Towers collapse.

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[HobieMarty]

https://youtu.be/BoV_GRR931k

Hope it works. This should be the video from the Miami Herald that I was talking about.

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[berettafan]

Originally Posted by hcoles

I bet you are right. They are not insured to the level needed if negligence caused ~100 people to die. I'm thinking the lawyers are going to be careful regarding involvement - there is not enough money available after it is split 100-150 ways.

I'm reminded of a very, very brief foray into condo management some years ago. Owner in a 4 unit building calls me and asks 'who do i sue if my father falls going up the steps here?'.

I **** you not, that is a quote.

The answer, of course, 'Yourself'