They can be quite evil, actually. Our cats tended to play with their "toys" for quite a while before they were killed.

We all should be scared of you, you must be the best hunter in the world. TV show maybe? LOL

I have tried tree stands and I see the advantage. It is unacceptable to me. I have a picture of my brother sitting under a tree picking a tail feather off of a wild turkey from ten feet away when the turkey wandered too close while we were resting after walking the hills all morning stalking deer.

I'm always impressed when someone using unfair advantages tells me how hard it is........[/QUOTE]

I think that anyone who is against hunting should go tour your local slaughter house. It is a disgusting process. At least the animals people hunt have a fighting chance and got to live a decent life.

I was lucky enough to get a tour once. its like a Dis-assembly line where seconds equal money. The tour started at the end product and ended where they were bolting the cows. That was quite an experience!

SO man of mystery just who are you to be able to beg for latitude in sniping from afar? I have had some run ins on this board and if I am wrong I will admit it. I have been known to PM regrets. There are many folks on this board that get on my nerves when we are politically beating each other over the head, and quit often, they are right and I am wrong. I actually enjoy getting my a$$ kicked by them, as they teach me something. I respect them as they have shown me otherwise, and in cases made me look a blithering fool. Such is the cost of an education.

You on the other hand have an acerbic presentation, often arrogant and I see nothing that you have presented in such a manner that allows you to be such. Now that is my humble opinion, if you can prove me wrong you will have my respect. We may not agree, but I am sure that you could than teach me something.

As far as where I put my nose, well you are entitled to your opinion. I assure you that it has never been up someone's keaster; my boot on the other hand . . .

Grizzlies are not known to overproduce, deer maybe. In fact, they are a threatened species and on the borderline of being protected. While some grizzlies have been known to eat humans, they don't go out of their way to do so unless threatened (mom with cubs, too close, etc.). If human meat was their main course, they'd be stalking the campsites right now.

Just to get this straight. Most hunters hunt to bag a trophy and for the thrill of hunting. The side benefit of food for the masses is a nice thought but pretty much a rationale, especially when the target is a grizzly. Let's not try to justify the "sport" by telling us how early in the morning hunters rise, the cold temperatures they endure or the miles they walk to get from point a to point b. My wife does that every morning with her crazy jogging friends.

Sherwood

We all kill things.

There is no escaping it. Every day we each kill millions of living creatures. Drive a car? You're smashing bugs. Use mouthwash? You're killing germs. Eat beef, fish, chicken?Killer. Wear leather items? Killer. Wear cotton clothing? Millions of acres of animal habitat has been ruined by cotton cultivation, killing animals again. There is no difference between the germ and the deer. Both are equal in natures eyes. Man applies more "value" to the deer, but that is based on emotion only, not rationality. Man is part of nature and cannot escape it, but how you fit in can be controlled.

It is not the killing that is distasteful. It is the how and why that is important. Need to kill to feel like a man? That is so sad. Need a trophy? How very sad.

What you kill (or support killing) should be judged by how and why. For example: I no longer eat sushi that contains endangered species. I no longer eat factory farmed animals. You have a choice.

Well, I've never been a hunter. I have nothing against it, just am not into it. However, if I were hiking in bear country, I would definitely bring a gun, even if I weren't already a gun nut. There is no other defense against such a large beast. I wouldn't enjoy killing a bear, but I wouldn't hesitate to kill anything in a "him or me" situation.

Ya know, I dont know 1 hunter who is all that concerned with getting a trophy. But I would like to hear you explain how wanting a trophy makes it wrong.

That cartridge will not stop a half ton griz. There have been numerous instances where soft point 30.06 have failed to penetrate. These are huge animals.

I do concur that the shot placement is key, and taking down such a large animal, especially if it is charging requires great skill or high power.

By the way, what was the cartridge that dropped that animal? Just curious, If it was a 30 30 I'm an a$$ bag.

I kill pheasants, they taste pretty good.

I send the tail feathers to my cousin who makes flys out of them and uses them to kill fish. Mostly Trout as I understand it.

Its like a cycle of killing.

:D

Jog with a slow friend. Then you don't have to outrun the bear, just your friend.

I'm sure you are trying to sound opened minded, but "man of mystery" and "sniping from afar" are just negative insinuations with no basis. What mystery? You want to know something? Ask, before you voice an opinion. From "afar"? This is the internet, silly. I could be sitting next to you. The fact that I do spend a lot of time in other countries, should not dictate your assumptions.

I'm sure much of what I post seems "an acerbic presentation, often arrogant" but positions of ignorant dogmatic opinion often see things that do not conform to their narrow world-view that way. Just check the facts and validate from several sources and you too, can learn.

As to proving myself? Please, all you have offered is baseless opinion, if you can run with that, why look for proof?

It wasn't your nose that I was speaking about...... or do you walk around with your head down there?

[QUOTE=Fishman7;4557433]We all should be scared of you, you must be the best hunter in the world. TV show maybe? LOL
[QUOTE]

No need to be scared, I'm not hunting you.

I'm hardly the hunter my brother is, or for that matter many other hunters I have met through the years. But I try to be the best I can. Every time in every way.
How about you? LOL

Well you need a lesson on ballistics, thats for sure. Ask Jeff if you don't believe me.
Bullet placement can overcome most bullet constuction problems. Stupidity cannot.

where were you all when this wild animal was wreaking havoc?????

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?t=463850

As I posted; I was starting to think about shooting people with it; and I'm a man of action ;)

I lived next door to a great white hunter in AB. He was also a golfer and we lived on a golf course. We became buddies, golfing at least once per week. He then convinced me that I needed to become a hunter; my son was about 10 at the time and then I could teach him to shoot and hunt.

So I went along...... I just wasn't impressed with the program. Keep in mind I like things like "camp Hilton" and freezing my bag off in the middle of the bush with a bottle of whisky to keep me warm just wasn't my gig.

Him and my other hunting buddies use to eat everything they shot and I mean everything!

MOSES: who in the world is that gal french kissing that bear? Yikes! You wouldn't catch me anywhere near it.

fwiw, I couldn't shoot and kill one of these creatures. I did however work the farm as a youngster and whacking a farm animal meant nothing to me; but then again, it tasted good. Who am I to judge anyone else?

I'm guilty of killing at least a million bugs; per year.

go Bear go............:D
'I hear ya..been told we taste like chicken'



Rika

I had an ex-RCMP officers cabin listed for sale once; he was a HUGE hunter and had lots of animals stuffed in his cabin. It got that I had to warn people about it before I took them there; some of the reactions were incredible. I saw lots of people cry and one lady broke out in a hysteria, even after I'd warned her.

It's definately difficult for most people.

This was the place:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237596844.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1237596888.jpg

I dont like people that care more about animals than humans.

Humans forget that humans are animals also.

Thats true..... good point.

I might have to jump in the ocean to save a retarded kid or something some day. Should that come to pass, the less sharks the better. ;)

You served? In the military? The US military? What was your branch and MOS?

Do a google on "Grizzly man."

"'I will protect these bears with my last breath', Treadwell says. After he and Amie become the first and only people to be killed by bears in the park, the bear that is guilty is shot dead. His watch, still ticking, is found on his severed arm."

Yeah, real effin smart. The idiot even managed to get his girlfriend EATEN alive too. I think anyone that works unarmed that close to wild animals is a total moron.

There is audio on the internet of them both being eaten alive. Perhaps the bambiists among us should check it out. It might give you a new perspective on these "Grand and majestic animals."

They're only grand and majestic until they take that first bite out of your flesh...

That Sigfried fellow worked with Tigers for a long time too. I heard he had a little mishap...and i heard he don't look and talk so good no mo.

No one with any sense would choose a .30-06 to hunt grizzly bears. Way underpowered for that task, as i think any professional hunter would agree.

Check this story relating a black bear hunt, which is tiny compared to a grizzly:

"Several years ago my daughter shot a big black bear at approx. 150yds with a .280 Remington. This big bear received another 280 slug and 2 shots from my .300 Ultra mag before the bear was stopped as it closed the distance to us."

http://www.bearbums.net/2008/08/14/bear-hunting-caliber-recommendation/

IOW, it was charging them and took 4 shots to down. And that's just a "harmless" black bear.

Yeah....no sport at all.

A .300 ultra mag is vastly more powerful than a .30-06, by the way.

------------------------

Sumatra: Tiger eats illegal loggers
A Sumatran tiger mauled two illegal loggers to death in western
Indonesia, bringing to five the number of people killed by the
critically endangered cats in less than a month, a conservationist
said today.

http://forestpolicy.posterous.com/sumatra-tiger-eats-illegal-log#ixzz0ALotMcST

Nope, big game animals definitely aren't dangerous at all...

Sharks, cats, bears, apes, wolves, whatever- wild animals may look cute, but even 'domesticated' ones who 'love you' WILL F you up bad for seemingly no reason at all.

And animals kill for food and sport too.

Anyone ever seen a cat toy with a mouse until it was dead then just wander off and leave it there? I have, many times.

Incorrect, you really should read some US fish and wildlife studies. Game management and monitored/adjusted hunting (all funded by hunters license fees) is the best thing we can do for these herds.

When any one species is overhunted the hunting permits issued are reduced until the herd is again oversized, then restrictions are lifted. Meanwhile, the BILLIONS of dollars generated from the sale of hunting and fishing licenses is used directly on wildlife preservation issues.

Hunting is a great benefit to our wildlife populations, observe:

NRA-ILA Hunting Facts

"Often camouflaged from the public eye, the efforts of hunters as conservationists over the last century have restored America's game populations and enhanced the habitat of numerous wildlife species. No other group has come close to sportsmen in contributing the volunteer hours and funding necessary to make such an impact on wildlife conservation.

President Theodore Roosevelt, arguably America's first prominent conservationist, knew first hand of the advantages regulated hunting and conservation bring to wildlife. During the late 1800s, Roosevelt saw animal numbers deteriorate because of over-hunting driven by unregulated meat and fur markets. As President, Roosevelt began creating programs aimed at restoring game populations to healthy levels.

Hunting is an integral part of the fabric of our economy and cultural heritage and it is also an important wildlife management tool. Everyone benefits from the excise taxes that hunters voluntarily pay on guns, ammunition and outdoor equipment. Since 1937, hunters have contributed over 4 billion dollars through the Pittman-Robertson Act for the benefit of all wildlife species. These dollars have been used to purchase millions of acres of public lands.

Through over 10,000 clubs and organizations such as NRA, Ducks Unlimited, Safari Club International, National Wild Turkey Federation, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation and Quail Unlimited, sportsmen contribute an additional $300 million each year to wildlife conservation activities.

Hunters and fishermen fund nearly 75% of the annual income for all 50 state conservation agencies. Through license fees and excise taxes on arms and gear, sportsmen contribute $200 million per year for wildlife conservation. (U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service)

Through legislative programs designed to channel funds back into the conservation process, hunters have restored populations of deer, elk, antelope, turkeys and ducks to record numbers.

http://www.nraila.org/images/GR.gif

The numbers on that chart absolutely speak for themselves. The benefits of hunting are immense.

http://www.nraila.org/issues/factsheets/read.aspx?id=124

If hunting and the monies generated by hunting went away all 50 state conservation agencies would go bankrupt, and our national herds would plummet.

If you are not afraid to see a man die to the claws of a grizzly bear, watch this...
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/eFOPJ3MaYdQ&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/eFOPJ3MaYdQ&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

I am cautious of Wikipedia but here is some interesting stats. the September 26 1976 attack is the one that Charlie help hunt down. Evidently this bear was going into cabins through the walls to get to the goodies inside.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America_by_dec ade

Aurel,
You need to be more discrete with that type of gore!!! LMAO

Sniper - I read actual scientific research reports.

2nd - go back and read your own original post - it is not at all about increases in popn size.

Wow, i counted 27 fatal attacks just since the year 2000......including a 5 month old baby! :(

Ester Schwimmer, 5 months, female August 2002 Black Bear.

Bear grabs and kills 5 month old infant from stroller on the porch of home in Fallsburg, New York.[19]

Majestic huh? Symbiotic relationship huh?

Imagine if that was your kid eaten on your front porch...

Oh jeez, here we go with this crap again.

I just offered black and white NRA provided facts because i am not interested enough to hunt down detailed studies at this juncture in time. (i have read quite a lot about hunter conservation issues in the past however) Brief summaries are fine for the purposes of this thread.

If you have better statistics, post them.

wow. I have been backpacking close to there on mt. robson. And the only thing I was armed with were my fists.

Quote:

...Apparently it wasn't alert enough to smell the man waiting to blast his heart out, just as the jogger is not alert enough to detect the bear laying in wait.

No doubt stated by an idiot with absolutely no knowledge of bears. Perhaps next time the stupid jogger, or as in the case in Anchorage last summer a stupid mountain biker, might want to consider someplace other than a salmon producing stream in the late evening sun.
A bear that size is near the end of his life cycle and a threat to no one. Is a frontal of the skull available?

Quote:

Ester Schwimmer, 5 months, female August 2002 Black Bear.

So in your opinion all bears are the same?

Guys, the grizzly bears are nice and all, but how about bigfoot? He is suffering right now:

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/UCCWxL0jlPA&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/UCCWxL0jlPA&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

http://www.cougarinfo.org/beier.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_cougar_attacks_in_North_America_by_d ecade

Fatal cougar attacks in US and canada.

Some statistics:


Victims
Thirty-seven of 58 victims (64%) were children. Most eaten were 5-9 year olds, accounting for 19 fatal attacks.

Yep. These animals are so cute and lovable. Until they start eating your kids.

Fifteen of 54 victims (28%) were attacked close to a house or cabin, or just outside a motor home within a developed recreational area.

Yep, and they mind their own business and keep to themselves too....

The 3 most intrusive cases involved a cougar crashing through the window of an isolated cabin to attack a telephone lineman (Table 1: Kelsey Bay, B.C., 1951), a cougar who attacked a 2-year-old boy in the garage of his home in a village of 250 persons (Table 1: Lewis, Colo., 1970), and a cougar attack on a 6-year-old boy in a residential area (Table 1: Hinton, Alta., 1962). Not included in these 15 cases were 2 attacks on persons in tents or sleeping bags

Anyone that implies large game animals are defenseless vs hunters/man is a total moron. However, our children very much are defenseless vs these savage beasts of the wild- and unless armed, SO ARE YOU.

Especially considering:

Most victims (24 of 32 for which data exist, excluding 2 who were injured after they came to the assistance of a companion) did not see the cougar before being clawed or bitten; thus, no preventive action was taken.

If you're taking your kids or woman hiking or camping in a area known to have bears, wolves, or big cats, do them a favor, arm yourself suitably.

They all have 4 legs, fur and teeth don't they?

Large game animals are EXTREMELY dangerous. All of them. Yes- they are all the same. They are all predators at the top of their food chain and anything they lay their eyes on, they can eat at a whim....including YOU.

One of the fatal bear attacks in Danimal's link, the attacking bear weighed a mere 112 pounds.
A grizzly is what- 20 times that mass?

In the Army we were taught to never, ever, ever mess with the wildlife. Ever.

Time to get a hunters sportsman's permit. That will let you pack a sidearm of appropriate power legally. Here in Pa they give them out like candy.

§ 33.118. Pennsylvania sportsman’s firearm permit.
http://www.pacode.com/secure/data/037/chapter33/s33.118.html

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

"Snatch squach"

A man & his buddy were gettting ready to take a hike in the woods. The man saw his friend putting on sneakers. He said, "Why are you putting on sneakers?" The friend replied, "In case we come across a bear". The man said, "You can't outrun a bear!". The friend said, "I don't have to outrun the bear -- I just need to outrun you!"

this thread should NOT be getting more hits than the "divorce = $$ lost" OR "hot stepdaughter" threads.

focus fellas! :D

I get attacked by the cougars down at the local bar every thursday night...

bada-bing!

Those are the good kind of attacks. :D

Real men don't even need a gun!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKH2oLjQIAA