79 SC Targa window seals

[spedrcr]

Put the mirror gasket into super hot water to make it more pliable while installing the mirror base. If that doesn't work, I'd try actually stretching the gasket a bit using a heat gun and some soft pliers to pull it bigger. It will most likely shrink over time so as to create an even better seal between the door and the mirror base.

On another note, how do you like the butt connectors with heat shrink and solder? Which brand did you order? I assume from Amazon.

[Robey5]

spedrcr:

I will hit the gasket with some heat later today and attempt to get it to sit correctly. Removing the gasket to put it in hot water is not really an option here without clipping the wires again, and I do not want to do that.

Regarding the electrical connectors: I have the "hassitronica" type --- got em from Amazon.

At first, I was quite skeptical because I was not really nuts about the idea of solder being in it's aqueous form without being able to "control" where the stuff goes. I used a couple of scrap wires to test and let them cool, and then performed my own continuity test and "pull" test. Once I performed my own tests, I became a believer, and it is unlikely that I will ever use a different wire-connection-method again. ... unless a "better" (faster and more effective) method becomes available. In essence: I love those connectors.

[Robey5]

I was able to get a minute to work the gasket into place and with some heat: presto!

It took a bit of massaging with the heat gun, and then I had to use my plastic pick to get the rim proper on the base of this mirror.




Then, I brought my triangle (vent) glass and frame over to the bench and hit the channels with some soapy water, and assembled the new seal ...





Then I said (to myself) ... why not, put the felt guide in there....





Now, I have to start putting the mess back into the door shell.

I still (really) do not like working with that 3M weatherstrip adhesive. It gets everywhere. I have to install that lower door seal sooner or later....and also finish off that targa bar seal.

[RDM]

This is a really great thread addressing something I have been avoiding. Thank you for doing such a thorough job!

[Otter74]

Ditto - I'm going to be doing this before long on my Targa, and your thread is very helpful.

[Robey5]

On the driver’s side, my biggest battle was getting the glass on the regulator. That was about 90% of the battle. So: I thought about this installation for a bit over the last few days and decided that there is no way that a factory would have made it this difficult for a reg install to happen in the factory. Even the most strict German plant manager in the 70s would not have been that masochistic. SO;

I decided to lube the latch pull-cable (sorry; no pics there, but, you get the idea...)

I installed the door-skin-to-glass felt (the snaps are pretty firm, but pretty straight forward.)







I cleaned the glass with my straight razor (to get all the overspray off of it)


I cleaned the glass guides





... and dropped the glass into the shell, before the reg, and the front rail.



Then, I grabbed the regulator mech, and set the upper stop to be the lowest it could be





And then I shoved the regulator in the oblong hole in the door.





Then, with the motor and regulator able to move with a bit of ease - I was able to get the lower guides on the glass with less negotiation, and not have to ask for another pair of hands.





It’s tough to see here, but this is where I stopped for the evening because my hands were getting a little beat up.

Next, I will install the “vent” window assembly. ... perhaps tomorrow.

[Robey5]

“Perhaps tomorrow” came; even though I can attest that my days are kind of running together lately.

I brought the “vent window” assembly over to the car and did the initial install.



I cannot do the final adjustments because, I have a bit of a science project involving the leather near the striker that will not stay in place no matter how much cleaning and adhesive I use.



Needless to say, we’re not closing the door for a little while (perhaps tomorrow), if that science project will ever “incubate”.

SO:
I went and ran my motor (with new grease in the worm wheel area) and pushed the window up as far as it would go (note the “hard stop” position would not allow me to trash my new soft-stop) and installed the motor; through the speaker hole.




Note that the key to this mess working (motor installation and regulator moving around) is leaving this bottom alignment part OUT for the time being.





.....which installs to the door shell HERE



Now, with that regulator in it’s rightful position, and the motor where it belongs: I had to clean up a bit of the electrical, and well: if you’ve ever been in the door shell before, you know that there’s not much room for shoving a camera in there. But: I will show you how I like to use my sharpie to remind myself where wires go (no worries: concours judges wont see these)





The wire connections for the motor connection were a little beat up so ... I put new shrink tube on there.

Anyhow: I tested the motor/mech about 4 times, and I noticed that my glass would not go all the way down .... something was binding! (Errrrhhhh)



The adjustment bolt that holds the rear track in place was sticking out jusssstttt enough to impede the glass from traveling all the way down. .... I put another washer under the bolt, problem solved. A couple weeks ago, I recall a thread stating that they could not get the glass to go “all the way down” on their targa, but because I am pressed to get onto my next conf call, I don’t have time to search the thread out. IF someone is having that problem: there is very little other place that this regulator can have something stop it’s movement.

Anyhow:
Looks like the glass is moving better, with the freshly greased motor, and lubricated regulator.





If my adhesive actually gets that leather to stay in place, I will do the alignment tomorrow.

[Robey5]

OK: one more to show we have the ability to get the glass in the “full down” position.



(Only 10 images per post allowed!)

[Robey5]

So: my science project did not “incubate” .... so there was little I could do today.

....I installed the outer trim and squeegee as well as the inner squeegee.





This side was a little longer than the original, and I had to trim it. This side looks so much better than the driver; on the driver there is a gap, and .... well, I suppose I could live with it.

[Robey5]

By comparison --- the driver's side on the trim squeegee does not look right. So, I reached out to the host to see if there was a MFG error.




I have my doubts that there was anything wrong, but: the gaps fore-and-aft of the seal on the driver's side is really rough looking and will drive me nuts.

My science project has started to incubate, so I used my 3M weatherstrip adhesive and got my lower door seals to stick in place.

There are some adjustments I need to make on the glass on the pass-side now.

[Robey5]

OK:

I have more adjusting to do on the pass side - but I’d like to seek the advise of someone who’s come this far. I know there are others who have been able to get their targa to seal up nice .... I’d like my car to seal up *better* ... though I know that this car is a long ways from “sorted”.

For whatever reason, I have adjusted my rear track angle (on the bottom Of the door) but:




This rear corner does not look right. If I close the door and then push on the glass with my hand, I can get the glass *closer* to the targa seal and there is a smaller gap: but that’s annoying and is not “as intended”.

...however: I did get the glass angle improved and it is going to the correct height (which is pretty sweet).




According to the “targa adjustment manual” (from the Porsche school) ... the glass should kiss the targa top seal (on the top-to glass), and it looks like the height is as it is supposed to be. In thinking about all that goes into this mess: do I need to trim some of the material off of the targa bar seal? Is there an adjustment that I am not accounting for? Also: nothing is “locked in place” yet.

[spedrcr]

Kick out (adjust) the bottom most forward part of the triangle window frame toward the outside of the car. That may push the top of the window in to where it meets with the seals.

Think of the door window, triangle window, frames and regulator as a stiff sheet of paper. Balance that sheet of paper in the middle on a flat surface so no corners of the paper are touching the surface. Now, pick up the bottom right corner. That will push the top left down to where it touches the flat surface.

[Robey5]

spedrcr:

Thank you for chiming in again. The area that you are speaking of had 3 (!!) shims. So far, I’ve removed 2 of them, and I need to move the whole system rearward a smidge, because when I close the door, we have a lot of pressure from the door on the A-pillar.

Either way .... better, closer, warmer.....



Tomorrow, I will give it another look. I think that the amount of pressure that the top of the vent window was putting on the top was not allowing the glass to sit in the correct position. From an up/down perspective; I think I am on the money.

[spedrcr]

FWIW, whether I have my top on or off, anytime I close either my driver or passenger door I see my windscreen frame move forward at the A-pillar. I feel like 30+ years of fatigue along with the general dynamics of the targa concept creates a lot of pressure at the top of the triangle window and A-pillar location.

[Hotshot]

I’m waiting to get my roof back from Dan. Can’t wait. Before I did, I messed with my angle and height. Made it far better and like yours. I don’t know if closing the door with the windows 1/8 down and rolling them up is better that just closing it.

The PO had the windows too high adding pressure on the windows to close.

I don’t really want to pop my doors off again but I may. If I don’t, I was the roof side seals, as without the roof I set height and angle to match. May need shims.

[mcchesneyc]

This video on Targa alignment is all in German (auf Deutsch) but the things they measure and processes they follow are great examples of how to trim all the various adjustments.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYmjT8so5Lo

I have my driver side disassembled at the moment doing some of the same things. My manual crank window regulator has worn teeth at the top. Hoping I can find a welder locally who can mend those teeth.

Also replacing the door pockets, arm rests, replacing the door stay / reinforcing and replacing the front speakers (found the speaker loose and a huge hole from when the car was rebuilt years ago).

Parts were shipped by our host yesterday!! Isn't this stay home stuff great!! I've been putting off this project for 5 years!

[Robey5]

I chipped away the job today, and I am as far as I think that I can go, and the results are unsatisfactory.

So: I pulled the targa top to see if that is influencing the glass angle; nope.

I have pushed/adjusted the track as far over as possible; and still this gap remains.

Any further input on how I can get this gap out would be appreciated.





With the top on, I can close the door and push the glass in place, but that is lame, and is not the point.

[mcchesneyc]

You say you have "have pushed/adjusted the track as far over as possible". Was that the rear track or the front track? Moving the bottom of the front track inboard should push the rear top of the rear part of the window glass inward. Moving the bottom of the rear track outboard should also push the top inward. It's got to be a combo of the two.

[Robey5]

mcchesneyc: thank you very much for taking a look at my mess.

The rear track has been pushed all the way outboard; as far as it can go without removing the door skin and .... (I will withhold my sarcasm....).

The front track had 3 shims. I’ve removed all 3 Shims, and Ive pushed the front track as far outboard as I can without adding the shims back in to the equation.

In thinking about this alignment in sum: there has to be a way to get this right ... Ive seen many of these cars that are more sorted; and they don’t have gaps like this.

I will have to play with it again tomorrow to see if I can come up with a correct combination.

[Robey5]

Today was a beautiful day, so I had to do something active and outside. So: I met my FIL over at highland lake, where he proceeded to kick my ace through the whole ride. Fun times - I really need to keep my outdoor activity moving while the weather is getting nicer, and we’re still on quarantine.

Anyhow, while I was blasting though the double switch-backs and blowing though the rocks and roots - I decided that there was something *else* that was influencing my glass to push it so far outward like this. It took several cycles to figure out, but the rear track was: A) installed improperly (years ago, obviously) and B) was bent.

It took me several looks at the driver’s side to determine this, along with several cycles of the passenger system to determine what was going on here. The net result is mucho mejor (much better) than it was. I have not put the top back in the mix, because I think that I have a little more work to do here.




Along for the ride: I cooked my (new) battery because I used the windows so many times. .... So I tossed it on the charger.



Then I decided to reward myself.




I will take another look at it tomorrow to see if I can swing any other adjustment to get that gap to -0- on the passenger side. From what I’ve seen: it’s possible.