Bubble finally deflating?

[silverc4s]

Originally Posted by wm711

Didn't I just recently see a $600K S in black, RHD? Or was I dreaming.

Might have been the UK RS..

[wm711]

$600000 S

http://www.early911sregistry.org/forums/showthread.php?112760-600-000-rhd-2-4s-sold

[Ferraripete]

Originally Posted by silverc4s

Might have been the UK RS..

no. not an rs. this was the Richard Hamilton car.

[Ferraripete]

Originally Posted by wm711

Didn't I just recently see a $600K S in black, RHD? Or was I dreaming.

you were not dreaming...bonhams goodwood auction of last weekend.

another long hood s went for nearly $250k

an 83 930 turbo went for nearly $170k

don't count the bubble as bursting just yet...

[2ndTARGA]

Take a look at just what went in to that car:

Bonhams : Formerly the property of Richard Hamilton,1973 Porsche 911S 2.4-Litre Coupé Chassis no. 9113300884 Engine no. 6331402/911/53

To me, that seems like an anomaly. 48 993tt's currently (and in most cases repeatedly) listed on eBay and cars.com? not so much.

[dienstuhr]

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

Take a look at just what went in to that car:

Bonhams : Formerly the property of Richard Hamilton,1973 Porsche 911S 2.4-Litre Coupé Chassis no. 9113300884 Engine no. 6331402/911/53

To me, that seems like an anomaly. 48 993tt's currently (and in most cases repeatedly) listed on eBay and cars.com? not so much.

"This car carries the registration 'RGO 6L', a number which will resonate with Porsche aficionados, placing it alongside a batch of historically important 911 models successfully campaigned by racing drivers such as Nick Faure."

Why would the registration number "RGO 6L" resonate with Porsche aficionados? Other than that Faure's Carrera RS bore reg no RGO 2L? It's certainly no GVB 911D ;-)

Plus, right hand drive. The breathless prose of the auction description is laughable. But apparently, effective.

Cheers

d.

[ShopCat]

Originally Posted by 2ndTARGA

Well, some of us are old enough to remember the bust in the early 90's. I saw a formerly $1M Ferrari F40 sell for $350K to name just one example. So anything can happen.

And there's demographics as well. When I started going to car shows the "can't loose" investment cars were, believe it or not, top-level Model A's. This caused any Model A that still sat on 4 wheels to be dragged out and restored and flogged. Then it was T-birds, and so on. This article sums it up well: Baby Boomers Created the Classic-Car Market—and Could Crash It – Feature – Car and Driver

But wait, none of us Porsche owners will never get too old to care, right? Hmmm, maybe all those cheap Tips are worth a 2nd look. I could store a bunch of them for 10 years and make a killing!

Im with you, plus I find it extremely arrogant to think "No no no, MY car is better than ALL of those other cars of the past, it would NEVER follow that same trend we've seen over and over again. Its different."

[Nick Triesch]

Just a few years ago I saw my little SO Cal house go all the way up in value to past $600,000. I remember folks saying that So Cal homes would never go down again. Then the bubble, then down to under $300,000 overnight. Now steady at $400,000. All in the last 7 years. Cars, guitars, mandolins, antique radios and such are all the same. What goes up must come down. Just drive your cars and have fun.

[KNS]

I just scrolled through the "Cars for Sale" here (haven't really looked in a few weeks). It seems many cars that would have been snapped up a while ago are for sale with several 'bumps'.

[Palum6o]

I think these cars 'were' more fun when money and values weren't so much a part of it. I almost feel sorry for the new generation of air cooled owners. Is it possible anymore to just have fun and drive them? All this anxiety... Just shut up and drive already.

[Rick Brooklyn]

You all seem fully convinced that the main market driver is some sort of speculation / get-rich-quick greed.

Could it be simply that prices have been rising because more and more people are sick and tired of riding in computers on wheels and they long for the experience of driving a real car instead, and the aircooled 911s are the greatest example of an uncomplicated, nimble, and very analog (at least up to and including the SC) sports car, and demand vs supply has led to higher clearing prices?

That's certainly the case with me. When i finally manage to buy my 911 I won't be giving a damn about resale values and future price trends because I want to drive that mother****** until the wheels fall off or until the government makes it illegal (de jure or de facto) for people to drive their own cars, whichever comes first.

[Westy]

^^^^ Understand ur point, but.......Uncomplicated? Just a quick read of the Tech Forum would suggest they're more complicated than Dennis Leary. Which is strange since you can look in the motor compartment and there it is. ALL of it!! Looks simple enuff!

[nota]

I don't get the over-restored like to new prices
for cars that are a joy to drive but will NOT retain that value if driven

who cares about matching numbers or perfect trim bits or paint color
the point is the cars performance

the insane prices are not for all cars
but many cars are being bumped into ever higher prices now
that is where the bubble is and will pop
cars like the 912 that get drug into the 911s class
or the middies
the 67 S is not the car that will drop alot in value

btw these cars all rust
investments should not rust

[Rick Brooklyn]

Originally Posted by nota

btw these cars all rust
investments should not rust

It's better to burn out than it is to rust, as a great poet once said

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Rick Brooklyn

You all seem fully convinced that the main market driver is some sort of speculation / get-rich-quick greed.

Could it be simply that prices have been rising because more and more people are sick and tired of riding in computers on wheels and they long for the experience of driving a real car instead, and the aircooled 911s are the greatest example of an uncomplicated, nimble, and very analog (at least up to and including the SC) sports car, and demand vs supply has led to higher clearing prices?

That's certainly the case with me. When i finally manage to buy my 911 I won't be giving a damn about resale values and future price trends because I want to drive that mother****** until the wheels fall off or until the government makes it illegal (de jure or de facto) for people to drive their own cars, whichever comes first.

^^^^This.
Tell Rich about the bubble bursting.
Hey, Rich, they're some *****in' deals out there for 911's these days, huh?

As I said, try buying one of these cars and get back to me about the soft market for 911's.

Good luck Rich. Market is tough, especially in our neck of the woods.

Nick

[ShopCat]

Originally Posted by NYNick

^^^^This.
Tell Rich about the bubble bursting.
Hey, Rich, they're some *****in' deals out there for 911's these days, huh?

As I said, try buying one of these cars and get back to me about the soft market for 911's.

Good luck Rich. Market is tough, especially in our neck of the woods.

Nick

Is "our neck of the woods" even a thing anymore? You know, with all this internet stuff going on and $150 one way flights...

[NYNick]

Ever try buying a nice 911 is metro NY? You'd figure out 'our neck of the woods' pretty quickly.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Rick Brooklyn

You all seem fully convinced that the main market driver is some sort of speculation / get-rich-quick greed.

Could it be simply that prices have been rising because more and more people are sick and tired of riding in computers on wheels and they long for the experience of driving a real car instead, and the aircooled 911s are the greatest example of an uncomplicated, nimble, and very analog (at least up to and including the SC) sports car, and demand vs supply has led to higher clearing prices?

That's certainly the case with me. When i finally manage to buy my 911 I won't be giving a damn about resale values and future price trends because I want to drive that mother****** until the wheels fall off or until the government makes it illegal (de jure or de facto) for people to drive their own cars, whichever comes first.

Um, show me where I have ever posted that this is speculation. I think many other of the regulars here would question the validity of that statement as well.

Your reasons for wanting one of these are pretty common these days actually. And add in the fact that the actual cost of ownership and maintenance has skyrocketed and we have cars that cost more. You get a bunch of guys all coming into their earning curve who had posters of IB 911s and 930s on their walls and they create an increase in demand with limited supply. The collector grade top of the market thing isn't really relevant to the average price of one of these cars, IMO.

Originally Posted by NYNick

As I said, try buying one of these cars and get back to me about the soft market for 911's.

Nick

He is trying to buy one and I think what we are seeing in the post I quoted is some of the frustration of trying to buy one.

[2ndTARGA]

I think this quote from NASDAQ.com may very well sum up this entire thread:

Economic bubble

Definition:

A market phenomenon characterized by surges in asset prices to levels significantly above the fundamental value of that asset. Bubbles are often hard to detect in real time because there is disagreement over the fundamental value of the asset.


No, wait, maybe it's this one:

“Another sign to watch for: In every bubble, there are always people trying to burst it by declaring that financial assets have become overvalued. At first, Prof. Goetzmann says, such skeptics earn respectful attention. But eventually, investors turn on them with anger and ridicule.”

[A&F]

Originally Posted by Nick Triesch

Just a few years ago I saw my little SO Cal house go all the way up in value to past $600,000. I remember folks saying that So Cal homes would never go down again. Then the bubble, then down to under $300,000 overnight. Now steady at $400,000. All in the last 7 years. Cars, guitars, mandolins, antique radios and such are all the same. What goes up must come down. Just drive your cars and have fun.

That has more to do with financing.

A small SoCal house could sell for $600k because someone could finance that and have a job to clear the ARM payments.

I don't think collectors are paying 6-figures on 911s using credit and hoping to flip it in 5 years for a profit.