1967-73 resale value dropping? Your thoughts?

[Sunroof]

Their are two Porsche dealers in Atlanta, Hennessey being the newest and Ellis the one around the longest behind Brumos, which shut down back in the 90's. Hennessey has the second floor (after a building expension) that has the consignment cars. Many of the cars I understand end up in Europe so I will assume the sellers use a vast network to get the word out on inventory.

Yes, Atlanta (Georgia) is supposed to be the second largest Porsche market next to California. Driving is year round with perhaps a week or two worth of frozen precip and limited road salting. The PCA Peachstate Membership is large and events fill up quickly (DE, concours, socials, etc). Some of the best roads in the mountains are just an hour north of Atlanta. Overall, a great place to be a Porsche owner. Huge Boxster inventory here, with dozens always on the market.

Bob

[carjmark]

Restoration quality and originality obviously makes a huge difference. As an example look at Hagerty's valuations. Seems like a lot of #3 driver quality Long hood restorations are asking #2 or even #1 concours prices. A # 1 car can cost more than the $75K number being thrown around to do a top notch restoration. It also costs about the same to restore a 69' T as it does a 73 S. Where I get hung up (and I'm shopping) is looking at a nice 73 1/2 T coupe driver without records, decent older wrong color paint, "no" rust, matching motor with no rebuild record, nom gearbox, correct interior. A car like that is a great driver but what's it worth? Asking price ranges are all over the place! Like the wild west for nice #3 drivers.

[ShopCat]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

If a Porsche dealership is advising that the longhoods are in demand and prices are strong, who's to argue?

Bob
1973.5T

Who are they arguing to? You, an owner? Why wouldnt they want to consign for 10% and leave you a car short and $70k heavy? Sounds like the typical dealership game to me. Im sure they wouldnt at all try to interest you in a new Porsche once yours sells.

[Christien]

As someone who just sold a longhood, I think the market has definitely peaked and has fallen somewhat. Real world numbers: I got $65K CAD for mine, which is just shy of $50k US. I think a year ago I could've gotten 60 US for it. Mine was a decent driver. Not without issues, but a couple grand and a paint job and it'd be really nice. FS ad is here: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/910643-fs-1972-911t.html

Considering I paid $11000 back in 2004 for it, I'm pretty happy.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by carjmark

Restoration quality and originality obviously makes a huge difference.

Yep. I was looking through the August Pano on my flight yesterday and there half a dozen 70-71 Ts for $65-75k. Then you get to the 72-73 Ts and they are all $45-55k. Someone who didn't really know what they were looking at might assume that means 72-73 is less desireable. But a closer look at the cars being offered showed huge mileage and condition differences with the years being more of a coincidence.

[techweenie]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

Yep. I was looking through the August Pano on my flight yesterday and there half a dozen 70-71 Ts for $65-75k. Then you get to the 72-73 Ts and they are all $45-55k. Someone who didn't really know what they were looking at might assume that means 72-73 is less desireable. But a closer look at the cars being offered showed huge mileage and condition differences with the years being more of a coincidence.

This is the essential problem with simple dollar sale reporting.

I just sold a 72 T Targa for $17K.

You might need to know more than make/model/year to infer anything from that...

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/929177-1972-911t-targa-project.html

[ThePicker]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

I went to the local Porsche dealer here in Atlanta, Ga this weekend to order a part and inquired about the value of my 1973.5T (Sepia). I was surprised that the second floor of the showroom was full of consignment cars, none of which were longhoods. Apparently, longhoods are in high demand according to the rep. and going for top dollar. "We know a whole bunch of folks who would want your car"! Commission was set at 10% for an under 100K sale. I plan on selling my car and would think that handing it over to a Porsche dealership to place in a showroom setting for a low commission might be the way to go!

If a Porsche dealership is advising that the longhoods are in demand and prices are strong, who's to argue?

Bob
1973.5T

Bob, Hennessy Porsche Just became a Classic Dealer. The problem here is now Porsche is trying to get their dealers to jump in the Classic Market and they are uneducated. Just because they are a Porsche dealer they think they know all. Problem is not any of them know much about aircooled or even driven one. Much less set a value on one.

[Sunroof]

I would agree with you on this one Picker. The sales staff is young, no one could name the color of my car (Sepia Brown) and probably do not know the differences between the 1973 and 1973.5T cars, let alone MFI from CIS. BUT, that' would not matter given that you pay for the convenience through a commission for showing the car in a dealer showroom, avoid scams, tire kickers, over seas shipping, etc, etc). I would not expect them to be an authority on older cars; however, Porsche management might encourage sales folks to catch up on knowledge of the older models. Their are potential buyers out there who want to buy a longhood and know what they want.................lets face it, Joe Doe who walks into a dealership to buy a 40+ year old car, know's what he looking for. Dealer? consignment shop? personal rep? does it matter? Its about the convenience for me. I am one of those lucky ones who paid under 10K for a restored longhood almost two decades ago. A 40K to 60K profit is not a bad thing. Heck, its like buying IBM back in the 60's.

[69porsche]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

I would agree with you on this one Picker. The sales staff is young, no one could name the color of my car (Sepia Brown) and probably do not know the differences between the 1973 and 1973.5T cars, let alone MFI from CIS. BUT, that' would not matter given that you pay for the convenience through a commission for showing the car in a dealer showroom, avoid scams, tire kickers, over seas shipping, etc, etc). I would not expect them to be an authority on older cars; however, Porsche management might encourage sales folks to catch up on knowledge of the older models. Their are potential buyers out there who want to buy a longhood and know what they want.................lets face it, Joe Doe who walks into a dealership to buy a 40+ year old car, know's what he looking for. Dealer? consignment shop? personal rep? does it matter? Its about the convenience for me. I am one of those lucky ones who paid under 10K for a restored longhood almost two decades ago. A 40K to 60K profit is not a bad thing. Heck, its like buying IBM back in the 60's.

PLUS 1-I am all about convenience to sell my car, I don't want tire kickers but I want people/dealership that can handle and vett the lookers from the buyers. I am willing to pay a price to avoid the hassle but to me it's worth it. I would at least want the young sales staff to at least properly pronounce Porsche, but in the end if they have a great marketing strategy that's aimed at overseas buyers and have a proven track record, I am all in. My 69 is in great shape,both exterior and interior as well as mechanically, however I do not expect to see a profit. I merely want to unload so I can shift my efforts towards my other cars. I had my fun with it, but it's time to sell it.

[pmax]

Originally Posted by carjmark

...
A car like that is a great driver but what's it worth? Asking price ranges are all over the place! Like the wild west for nice #3 drivers.

It's worth 30 to 40s, the sweet spot where all nice drivers are.

[sugarwood]

I don't know the first thing about long hoods, but thought they were selling for $150k, and driving the entire rest of the vintage 911 market with it. Can someone post a quick summary of the hierarchy? 911, 911T, 911E, 912, etc. Which ones were worth thee huge money?

This '68 912 just sold for $37k
1968 Porsche 912 Coupe | Bring a Trailer

[Mick_D]

Pecking order, from top to bottom, according to the sales ads I see here:

1. Mine,MINE!MINE!!111!!1ALLMINE!MINE- $$WAYMORETHANYOURS!@
2. Everything else.

[69porsche]

911S, 911E, 911T and 912....but you have to look at years they were produced, some model years are considered better than others, and then there are the Porsche Carrera that were introduced....I think overall the vintage market 66-73 was driving the market up with a few exceptions out there. There is alot of info that can be googled that can be very detailed and I am sure the other forum members can chime in....but the 912 is quickly gaining ground more now than ever before, it will never be like the 911 scene but they are respectable if not chopped and taken care of.

[69porsche]

911S, 911E, 911T and 912....but you have to look at years they were produced, some model years are considered better than others, and then there are the Porsche Carrera that were introduced....I think overall the vintage market 66-73 was driving the market up with a few exceptions out there. There is alot of info that can be googled that can be very detailed and I am sure the other forum members can chime in....but the 912 is quickly gaining ground more now than ever before, it will never be like the 911 scene but they are respectable if not chopped and taken care of.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by sugarwood

I don't know the first thing about...

We noticed.

[whiterabbit]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

Their are two Porsche dealers in Atlanta, Hennessey being the newest and Ellis the one around the longest behind Brumos, which shut down back in the 90's. Hennessey has the second floor (after a building expension) that has the consignment cars. Many of the cars I understand end up in Europe so I will assume the sellers use a vast network to get the word out on inventory.

Yes, Atlanta (Georgia) is supposed to be the second largest Porsche market next to California. Driving is year round with perhaps a week or two worth of frozen precip and limited road salting. The PCA Peachstate Membership is large and events fill up quickly (DE, concours, socials, etc). Some of the best roads in the mountains are just an hour north of Atlanta. Overall, a great place to be a Porsche owner. Huge Boxster inventory here, with dozens always on the market.

Bob

i have been looking for an excellent local l1972 long hood for the last year or so and can confirm there is not a lot for sale in Atlanta. I know of some perfect cars but the owners are not selling. I would think you could sell your targa locally pretty easily. There is a shop in Virginnia Highlands (Motorcar studio) that specializes in early air cooled that I would consign with rather than Hennessy.

[Sunroof]

Rabbit.........their are several fine consignment shops around Atlanta; however, all do not just carry Porsche cars. So a prospective buyer walks into a showroom of consignment cars with his heart set on buying an older longhood but is presented with a lot of variety besides Porsche. Perhaps he decides to drive away with that restored Austin Healy 3000 he always considered? A small point, but at least showing it at a Porsche Dealership narrows the target audience and serious buyers. Commissions are almost the same for under 100K sales. Anyways, a PPI can be performed right at the dealer if need be. I am not defending the dealer here, but using the dealer does have its merits for a faster sale and targeted buyer. I have been to consignment shops and its like being a kid again in a toy store, especially if you grew up owning sports cars all your life! You might reconsider your choices then. Here is my ownership list: 1959 Bug Eyed Austin Healy Sprite, 1967 Triumph TR-4A IRS, 1972 Fiat 850, 1974 Fiat 124, !974 Porsche 911, 1976 Volkswagen Beetle, 1979 Porsche 911SC, Porsche 944, 1973.5T Porsche 911.

[whiterabbit]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

Rabbit.........their are several fine consignment shops around Atlanta; however, all do not just carry Porsche cars. So a prospective buyer walks into a showroom of consignment cars with his heart set on buying an older longhood but is presented with a lot of variety besides Porsche. Perhaps he decides to drive away with that restored Austin Healy 3000 he always considered? A small point, but at least showing it at a Porsche Dealership narrows the target audience and serious buyers. Commissions are almost the same for under 100K sales. Anyways, a PPI can be performed right at the dealer if need be. I am not defending the dealer here, but using the dealer does have its merits for a faster sale and targeted buyer. I have been to consignment shops and its like being a kid again in a toy store, especially if you grew up owning sports cars all your life! You might reconsider your choices then. Here is my ownership list: 1959 Bug Eyed Austin Healy Sprite, 1967 Triumph TR-4A IRS, 1972 Fiat 850, 1974 Fiat 124, !974 Porsche 911, 1976 Volkswagen Beetle, 1979 Porsche 911SC, Porsche 944, 1973.5T Porsche 911.

Good perspective that I have never thought of regarding attracting focused buyers at a Porsche dealership. I would normally not even consider personally going to Hennessey or Jim Ellis to look at an older 911 but sounds like I should reconsider. I also didn't know Hennessey is getting into classics.

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by Christien

As someone who just sold a longhood, I think the market has definitely peaked and has fallen somewhat. Real world numbers: I got $65K CAD for mine, which is just shy of $50k US. I think a year ago I could've gotten 60 US for it. Mine was a decent driver. Not without issues, but a couple grand and a paint job and it'd be really nice. FS ad is here: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cars-sale/910643-fs-1972-911t.html

Considering I paid $11000 back in 2004 for it, I'm pretty happy.

Congrats Christien! I'm glad the car sold for a decent price.
Nick

[Fubawu]

Prices haven't dropped well I guess they have but it's more to do with unrealistic asking prices. Things were growing quickly maybe too quickly and people got greedy with selling prices. I'm guilty of it, I'm sure most here are. It's the typical my cars better then yours so I should get an extra $5k. If we were to go back to 2014 prices cars would still be selling at a decent clip.