The worst news about my 3.0

[bigfishassasin]

It seems i need a complete rebuilt of both my engine and transmission. Total cost 13,000 dollars. Horsepower will remain the same but that price includes a stock clutch and a new alternator. Does this seem like a fair price? Should I try to add more power? and if so at what cost?

Thanks again
Rob

[lucittm]

We would need a bit more information:
Miles on the engine?
Reason for the rebuild?
Dealer or independent?
More power = 10 hp or 100 hp?

The price does not seem out of line if you use a quality shop and they really do a complete tear down, inspection, and rebuild using new factory parts for both the engine and transmission. On my engine rebuild, not including the transmission, I did my own labor except for the heads with a new clutch (and later) a rebuilt alternator and my cost was $6,000.

More power will cost, well, more. I have heard a rule of thumb - about $25 per hp up to 400 hp, then $50 per hp up to 500 hp, then $100 per hp after that.

Good Luck,
Mark

[bigfishassasin]

thanks for your reply the engine has 102,000 with one broken stud and a couple of oil leaks. The engine started to smoke and backfire badly. The carrera tensioner need to be replaced. The tranny grinds into 3rd gear. Also the exhaust is shot. It seems the guy I bought this car from didn't maintain it at all.

I'm fine with the engine remaining stock just want to make sure I'm spending the money wisely.

[Flat6pac]

Where are you located?
Bruce

[brads911sc]

you did a rebuild for 6k?

must not have done much to it as a set of P&C alone cost 4k. I just did mine. I spend about 13k and I did all the work myself except machine work. I didnt add anything except new cams and cnc machining/porting of the heads. the rest was all standard stuff... if I wouldnt have done the extras it would have cost 10k.. pretty far from 6k.

Originally Posted by lucittm

We would need a bit more information:
Miles on the engine?
Reason for the rebuild?
Dealer or independent?
More power = 10 hp or 100 hp?

The price does not seem out of line if you use a quality shop and they really do a complete tear down, inspection, and rebuild using new factory parts for both the engine and transmission. On my engine rebuild, not including the transmission, I did my own labor except for the heads with a new clutch (and later) a rebuilt alternator and my cost was $6,000.

More power will cost, well, more. I have heard a rule of thumb - about $25 per hp up to 400 hp, then $50 per hp up to 500 hp, then $100 per hp after that.

Good Luck,
Mark

[crashmy911]

Could be good could be bad. If your engine just need valve guides and head studs I don't think it should cost that much. You grinding into third could just be an adjustment on the shift coupler. Do you trust this person going to do the work? Where are you located. I was quoted something like this for the same amount of work. Did it myself and the engine just was broken head studs. Sure smoked like hell to.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Rob,

JMHO, so please accept my input with a grain of salt,...

A $13K engine & transmission "rebuild" isn't much of a rebuild at all, based on current parts prices and prevailing labor rates. Given the lion's share of any of these jobs lies with the parts bill, you aren't getting much (unless your engine and gearbox are both in extraordinary condition and need very little).

My best advice would be to both pray for good luck and boost your budget so the jobs are both done without cutting corners.

Naturally, these situations depend on how long you expect everything to last.

[88911coupe]

Can't see how they can price something with as many variables as a rebuild till they get in there. I did most of mine myself but still had independent shops evaluate parts and I sent the head to Competition Engineering for all that work. I'm too scared to look at all the reciepts at once. I do recall when I first started I was quoted 8-10k for a top end only by a very reputable local shop...ended up going all in and a total rebuild but did the majority of it myself which I'm sure saved a ton of money.

[930 slant nose]

theres a motor for sale completely rebuild for 3500 on here he put it on 2 days ago and a good transmition but the set up its a good deal

[brads911sc]

Be very careful with a shop that quotes 13k for both (unless that was a minimum). Could be easily 8-10k higher than that based on what he finds when he is in there... Scored Intermediate shaft, pitted cam lobes, the wrong kind of cylinders (not reusable)... and he could easily call you and add 7k to the bill... there are many people on here who have spend 15k and had nothing out of the ordinary and that didnt include the transmission...

[bigfishassasin]

Thanks for all the replies. I'm located in Queens New York but the guy who's doing the work is out in Huntington station. He built a 450 hp 944 turbo for my good friend cost was 12000. His work is very detailed...every bolt is marked and the car came back to us in showroom condition.

I wish I would have done a little more homework before buying this car as Porsche ownership has not been fun for me. I need a hug and to try to go and borrow more money.

Steve what should i expect from a complete rebuild? I thought that meant everything new.

If you see a guy dressed like a tow truck driver tap dancing for money at lunch today try not to laugh. It's just me rob trying to get that rebuild paid for.

[bigfishassasin]

I will not pay more than 10,000 dollars for him to rebuild the engine. I'm positive i could get a better engine for that 10,000 Remember brad we talked about replacing the 3.0 with a 3.6 everyone said to save the 18,000 and just rebuild the motor that i have. That to me seems like it would have been better option.

[Carrerax]

Listen to these guys. Mine ended up over 20k...but I did do some slight upgrades

[brads911sc]

I hear you. I had hoped to do mine for 10k. Its the while you are in there needs. I had pitting on the intermediate shaft. I wouldnt put it back in after spending 10k. would you? Add $750. I had KS pistons/cylinders... so I couldnt reuse them with any guarantee of sucess. would you take the risk after paying him 10K? Add JE's/Plated 3.2 Cylinders from EBS, even at 1/2 the cost of Mahle's it was 2k. My 10k quickly became 13k. Would have been 15k had I used Mahle. I think most of us that DIY go through this. These werent goodies.
If you say, I wont go over 10k... when he finds a bad part that cost 1k... what are you gonna do? Stop midstream and put the thing in boxes? have him button it up with a known bad part in it? If my max was 12k, I would definitely do it myself, cut out the labor which can run you 3k+ which will give you more flexibility on parts. I am at 13k and I dont think I need anything else (Mahle's would have put me at 15k)... To be fair, my 13k included new cams ($800) that was $500 more than a regrind. Coating the bearings ($150). Adding little things like RSR seals (probably $250 in things I didnt need). Having my heads CNC Machined /Ported to large port, racing springs, titanium keepers by Steve Weiner (about $1250 more than a standard head job). So I could have done it for $10,500.. But I did it myself and didnt pay any labor... if I paid someone else it would easily have exceeded 16k.

If it were me, Id budget the 12.5k for the enging rebuild... You dont want him cutting any corners. this is a 1x in every 150k mile service under normal operating circumstances. you dont want to be doing it again at 75k miles because he saved you a couple thousand. If you get lucky and it costs 10k, you can always do the transmission. you are still 33% less at 12k than a 3.6 conversion (Both Rebuilt)... comparing a tired 3.6 to a rebuilt 3.0 is really not a comparison at all.

Let us know what you decide and what he finds.

Originally Posted by bigfishassasin

I will not pay more than 10,000 dollars for him to rebuild the engine. I'm positive i could get a better engine for that 10,000 Remember brad we talked about replacing the 3.0 with a 3.6 everyone said to save the 18,000 and just rebuild the motor that i have. That to me seems like it would have been better option.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Originally Posted by bigfishassasin

Steve what should i expect from a complete rebuild? I thought that meant everything new.

The word "rebuild" means many things to many people and frankly, its vague as hell in the automobile world.

The airplane industry has defined the terms, "rebuilt", "overhauled", and "remanufactured" much more clearly so aircraft owners know what they are getting when shelling out those hard-earned dollars.

To me, a "rebuilt" engine is just like brand new so it will last as long (or longer) than a Factory new engine. "Freshening" an engine means a valve job, rings, and perhaps bearings. A top-end rebuild simply means a valve job and perhaps some new parts in the cam drive system.

JMHO, but its VERY difficult (nigh impossible) to properly rebuild a stock engine for under $15K without cutting corners and performance enhancements add to to the cost. Naturally, labor rates vary all over the country (as do taxes) so that figure may be higher in your area.

Many people buy these cars without performing due diligence about the maintenance and repair costs so it can be a shock to find out the real costs of ownership. I will tell you that these cars are VERY reliable if they are properly repaired,....

My suggestion would be to reassess your budget and save some money to do the job right. This will assure a good experience and a lot of fun down the road.

[mca]

I came in around $7k doing the labor myself (sent out heads though) - I'll see if I can find my price sheet.

I didn't have to get new cylinders nor did I have to replace my head studs since they were already steal.

However, I did creep up to the $10k mark because I added SSIs, new muffler, new fuel injectors, new fan, rebuilt alternator, etc. But the base engine was around $7k.

My point ... it can be done for well under $10k. And I don't feel that I cut any corners.

[mca]

Maybe this helps some.

[bigfishassasin]

I promise i will not cut corners.

This rebuild puts me over 40,000 spend in the last 8 months and the car is still not correct. I have had a love affair with the slant nose since 12 years old. I can still remember the first one to hit the streets of new orleans,LA which is where I grew up.
I have chased factory slant parts all over the country since buying the car down to the last bolt. So no way will i put a half ass rebuilt engine in the car.

[brads911sc]

MCA posts show that it is clearly possible to have a well sorted engine that doesnt need alot. I hope when you get it open you have no unpleasant surprises. Good luck with it.

Originally Posted by bigfishassasin

I promise i will not cut corners.

This rebuild puts me over 40,000 spend in the last 8 months and the car is still not correct. I have had a love affair with the slant nose since 12 years old. I can still remember the first one to hit the streets of new orleans,LA which is where I grew up.
I have chased factory slant parts all over the country since buying the car down to the last bolt. So no way will i put a half ass rebuilt engine in the car.

[Jesse16]

I'm doing mine myself, a 87, 3.2 with 190K miles. Complete Engine Rebuild. Mine has looked "fantastic" inside except for normal bearing wear. Was burning lots of oil and I had 3 months of garage time and an interest in not watching TV all winter. Looks to come in at less than $6000 and that includes the all special tools, engine stand, jacks, engine yoke, etc. Two highest cost items are heads for 1250 (new valves) at Anchor and me chickening out and having a local shop tear down the bottom end and put in new rod, crank, intermed. bearings, hone cyl., piston rings, all seals, gaskets, cam chains, ramps, etc. and re-seal. (less than $2,000 which includes parts) Everything inside looked really nice. This shop seals everything with Dow 730 BTW. No change to the cams for me. Really not alot of parts in my opinion. While I'm in there changes are Cat ByPass and new engine sound pad. No clutch needed, tranny oil change only. I believe you can do it for a somewhat reasonable cost.