HP2 Sport; the facts 2

[volo]

Max torque is brought down to 6000 rpm, that's going to improve ridability compared to the R12s, which is already great on this bike.

[EZ-RIDER]

It's about time Bmw stepped out of the box woohoo better looking then the standard R1200S!

[BMW Atlanta]

Originally Posted by throttlemeister

Well, that's all fine and dandy and everybody knows an excellent rider on a lesser bike can out-perform an ok rider on a better bike, but in the end power DOES matter. The performance of Nate and Brian says more about them then it says about the bike. If you have two riders of the same ability, one on the HP2 and one on the 1098, the HP2 will get its ass creamed. The 1098 is purpose built for the track and has the power and chassis to back it up. The HP2 pretends to be, but does not really, while it will cost the same or similar to the 1098S. If BMW would put the HP2 into WSBK, it would finish at the end of the pack. And they know so, or else they wouldn't develop another bike for that (not that it matters much, cause 190kg and 190hp is not gonna cut it in WSBK; Toseland's Ten Kate Honda CBR-RR has something in the order of 250hp(!) and weighs less). Whereas the 1098 stands a good chance of wrapping up next years championship.

Hmmm, ass cremed on what track under what conditions? And to think that the BMW R12S HP2 Sport finished multiple endurance races in way better ranking then the couple of 1098's that were in the same race with very good riders as well. But consistancy and ease of riding the R12S HP2 Sport in an endurance type scenario is it's strong point IMHO

[volo]

Originally Posted by EZ-RIDER

It's about time Bmw stepped out of the box woohoo better looking then the standard R1200S!

the paint scheme on the HP is a bit alrequin-like and the bike is more stocky, the R1200s still looks like the thoroughbred.

[Deans BMW]

Both Brian and Nate do a lot of racing against GSXR 600's, 750's and even 1000's lots of races against 1098's. Even the casual observer can see that R1200S's are very competitive. If you study the 24 hour Bol D Or, it is clear that the HP is extremely competitive. I would also suggest that the new HP version will be able to hold its own in the real world of aggressive mountain road riding.

I suspect strongly that riders like Dr Curve, who I have never met, and my self will not be intimidated by any bike other than an all out standing start drag race or an absolut top speed run.

[throttlemeister]

Originally Posted by BMW Atlanta

Hmmm, ass cremed on what track under what conditions? And to think that the BMW R12S HP2 Sport finished multiple endurance races in way better ranking then the couple of 1098's that were in the same race with very good riders as well. But consistancy and ease of riding the R12S HP2 Sport in an endurance type scenario is it's strong point IMHO

You really want to compare a full factory team with extremely experienced professional endurance riders to a few privateer teams? I don't think so. If you want to compare apples to apples, BMW would have to enter their team and the R12SP-HP2 into WSBK to compete with the factory Ducatis and the Japanese 4. And I doubt the picture there would be as pretty as it was in Endurance.

Let's be real people. It's a gorgious bike which will undoubtedly perform very well and will be very easy to drive fast by an average rider on the street. It will probably be the best sporty BMW ever made. But it is not a Ducati killer on the track and it never will be unless they find some more ponies.

We can all say hallelujah and get on our knees to thank the beemer gods for their gift to mankind or we can approach this with a bit of realism. And so far the realism seems to be lacking a bit.

[R111S]

The superior chassis design/dynamics of the R1200S/HP2 is a big advantage to riders like N8! and Brian who can exploit it's greatness, such that the slower, heavier, shaftdrive BMW stays ahead of ALL the other pilots on 2-cylinder bikes and many pilots on 600/750/1000 Fours.

If the Boxer could have 30 more HP and Chain instead of Shaft...you'd see all the UJMers converting to Tele-Lever A.S.A.P!

CHASSIS UBER ALLES!

[throttlemeister]

Originally Posted by Deans BMW

Both Brian and Nate do a lot of racing against GSXR 600's, 750's and even 1000's lots of races against 1098's. Even the casual observer can see that R1200S's are very competitive. If you study the 24 hour Bol D Or, it is clear that the HP is extremely competitive. I would also suggest that the new HP version will be able to hold its own in the real world of aggressive mountain road riding.

I suspect strongly that riders like Dr Curve, who I have never met, and my self will not be intimidated by any bike other than an all out standing start drag race or an absolut top speed run.

When it comes to the twisties I am not intimidated by any rider on any bike on my R11S. Some are faster, most are slower. As far as straight line speed, I don't even know how fast my R11S runs and I don't care. It's boring.

And as far as the Bol d'Or, it was very competative if you leave out the professional teams like SERT, Yamaha and Kawasaki. In other words, it was very competative in the privateer field. That in itself is a huge and commendable achievement for a new team and a new bike doing something they have never done. But that doesn't mean it can compete with the top dogs.

[Deans BMW]

I agree, that it can't compete in the world of WSB, after all it is an air cooled drive shaft twin.

That is what the new 190/190 is all about.

[R111S]

TM, don't forget 5th place overall at Oschersleben.

[throttlemeister]

Well, that's the only place where the Ducati 1098 with full factory support is being run.

But if 190/190 really means 190kg and 190hp 4-banger they're not gonna make it with that bike there either. A stock CBR1000RR puts in 176kg and 170hp. The factory supported Ten Kate bike weighs the minimum weight per SBK regulations (167kg) and is rumored to deliver more than 220hp at the wheel(!). These are guided missiles and BMW would have make such a missile to compete.

[throttlemeister]

Originally Posted by R111S

TM, don't forget 5th place overall at Oschersleben.

Please don't think I am not very impressed with BMW's achievements; I am. But I don't think the rest of the world hide in fear for the coming of the HP2 either.

[Bob Hancock]

Originally Posted by throttlemeister

We can all say hallelujah and get on our knees to thank the beemer gods for their gift to mankind or we can approach this with a bit of realism. And so far the realism seems to be lacking a bit.

So Mr. Hubris, you think you are the only one with a reality candle? Maybe the members on this board who appreciate what BMW has done, and who, as fans of the marque want to celebrate a bit need tutoring by you on anything? I doubt it. We're havin' a party here, junior, so maybe you would feel more welcome over on the RealityCheck site where they view the world through a half empty glass. I for one don't need your dim view of reality, especially while the party is still in full swing. The "real" reality will show itself soon enough and with real clarity when the flag drops. Until then, go bother someone in your own house.

[throttlemeister]

Kiss.... I have the right to voice my opinion just as much as you do, without insults or attempts from you to shut me up. Free speech does not mean say whatever as long as Bob Hancock agrees. So if you don't agree or like what I say, tough ****.

[Bob Hancock]

Originally Posted by throttlemeister

Kiss.... I have the right to voice my opinion just as much as you do, without insults or attempts from you to shut me up. Free speech does not mean say whatever as long as Bob Hancock agrees. So if you don't agree or like what I say, tough ****.

You've just turned into a one voice act. Everyone who has read this thread has read your words....the first time...then the next...and so on. You really do annoy and I'm just using free speech to say so.

[Deans BMW]

Originally Posted by throttlemeister

Well, that's the only place where the Ducati 1098 with full factory support is being run.

But if 190/190 really means 190kg and 190hp 4-banger they're not gonna make it with that bike there either. A stock CBR1000RR puts in 176kg and 170hp. The factory supported Ten Kate bike weighs the minimum weight per SBK regulations (167kg) and is rumored to deliver more than 220hp at the wheel(!). These are guided missiles and BMW would have make such a missile to compete.

Just a hint, don't let stock, emissions and sound restrictions on a bike determine just what you will see in race trim as your example of the CBR1000 clearly points out. We all just might be in for a plesant suprise.

[Dr. Curve]

Ucking A! They can't seem to keep the 1098s running at full power long enough to run with the air cooled for any more than 2 or 3 hours. We are very happy with this new intro and want to enjoy the moment. Lets all talk about the good things like Bob says......

Throttlemeister..........do you actually have a R12S yet.........or are you basing your thoughts on your experience with a R11S? Bob and I have both R11S AND R12S and in Bobs case he has had Ducatis to boot........while I have had only a RSV Mille. We run hard in the tight mountains and simply KNOW that this new bike is going to be very hard to slip away from if another bike is leading and even more difficult to catch if it (new OHC) is leading. The Netherlands are as flat as your nonplussed comments TM so at least give us a few days to pop a few corks before you shut it down and start saying what the limitations of this new design are.

Old people like Dean O, (who has been around BMW twins for the past 30 years), myself, Bob H., and a slew of others do not fear anything when we currently take the R12S units out...........and like Dean said..........we sure as hell will not be slugs with this new bike. Bring um on............if it is real world.........we are ready. And the new engine is 20-mm narrower than (R12S) before, the bike weighs less, has more torque and HP, stops quicker, and has quicker handling. If the 1098s are out there we are sure willing to share the road...........but not give it up.

[ckcarr]

If only it was mandarin & silver...



Must I now go and join the half-empty negative club? ... there are so many members anymore, they all seem to be the same person too, or sing the same sad tune... They sound like Mickey the trainer talking to Rocky Balboa "He's gonna eat you alive!"

But wait! Out here in Utah is one of the few places a bike like this can be rode hard and put away wet! Once in a while I could scream up to 160 mph (can they do that in the Netherlands?) and no one would be the wiser (none of this 30 mph over take your bike BS). Or even go to Bonneville to test the mettle if I so desired.

I just don't know... Better call my psychiatrist

[throttlemeister]

Originally Posted by Bob Hancock

You've just turned into a one voice act. Everyone who has read this thread has read your words....the first time...then the next...and so on. You really do annoy and I'm just using free speech to say so.

Actually, you were being derogatory and that was totally unnecessary. But hey, I guess discussion forum doesn't actually mean there should be discussion. Whatever.

And Curve, I happen to do 90% of my miles in the Alps and surrounding areas. Maybe you've heard of em. It's that place that has more tight curves concentrated in a relatively small area than there are in the entire US of A. So you might be a little careful in dissing either my experience or ability as you or anyone on this forum has never ridden with me and simply have no idea.

But please, uncork the champagne. Mamma BMW brought us a new bike and it is gonna beat the ***** out of everything out there!

[Flatbutt1]

So if I sell my Tacoma for $10K and buy a beater for $4K, I only need to come up with about $19K for the scooter? Hmmm...maybe the houses's foundation repair can wait.
I sooooooo want a new S