F1 2020 Thread

[rfuerst911sc]

Originally Posted by jyl

You think that is career ending for Grosjean?

His F1 career ? Maybe because there are only two races left and the season ends and so does his stint with Haas . His driving career ? No I think you will see him in sports car or Indy . The caveat is has this crash gotten into his head ? A race driver that is timid or lost the mental edge can be dangerous to themselves and others . I wouldn't blame him if the crash affects him mentally , only time will tell .

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by legion

I think that Armcos that run parallel to the track are okay. But the one that Grosjean hit cuts diagonal and very close to the track. He hit it almost straight-on. I kind of wonder if just putting a Tecpro barrier in front of the Armco could have made the accident much less deadly.

The Sky F1 coverage after the race went to the scene of the accident. They showed the skid marks that lead into the barrier. It really was at a 45 degree angle or so, it was not a 90 degree wall. I bet next week they will have tires or some sort of softer impact absorbing barrier in front of the concrete wall that is there now.

There are three aluminum beams all bolted together and the impact smashed the front half of his F1 car through the beams.

No doubt the seat belts harness, the Hans Device, and the Halo saved his life. At 50 Gs his spine would have snapped like the much lighter Dale Earnhardt crash. The seat belt harness held him in place and he was able to GTFO of there in short order. If he had been knocked out he likely would have roasted to death. The visor on his helmet was partially melted. I hope he gets that helmet back as a keepsake of his F1 career.

They also said the FIA will do a full investigation with the remains of the car, and reconstruct it, just like the FAA does for aircraft. The will look at every component, and try to determine just what worked and what failed. Then they will make changes to the rules to make the cars safer.

[URY914]

You sure the guardrail beams were aluminum?

[rfuerst911sc]

Haas has announced reserve drive Pietro Fittipaldi will start his first F1 race this weekend in place of Romaine .

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by URY914

You sure the guardrail beams were aluminum?

That is a good point. Most of the ones I see around her are, but that does not mean those are. They are usually aluminum to prevent rusting for a life of being outdoors. Like most highway signs and other objects like street lights. Those are likely 20 years old like the rest of the track, but it is a dessert.

I am just guessing it is aluminum and the expect it to deform and bend under a normal impact. Steel would be too strong.

[jrj3rd]

sure look like galvanized steel to me. Have never seen an aluminum guardrail

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

The Sky F1 coverage after the race went to the scene of the accident. They showed the skid marks that lead into the barrier. It really was at a 45 degree angle or so, it was not a 90 degree wall. I bet next week they will have tires or some sort of softer impact absorbing barrier in front of the concrete wall that is there now.

There are three aluminum beams all bolted together and the impact smashed the front half of his F1 car through the beams.

No doubt the seat belts harness, the Hans Device, and the Halo saved his life. At 50 Gs his spine would have snapped like the much lighter Dale Earnhardt crash. The seat belt harness held him in place and he was able to GTFO of there in short order. If he had been knocked out he likely would have roasted to death. The visor on his helmet was partially melted. I hope he gets that helmet back as a keepsake of his F1 career.

They also said the FIA will do a full investigation with the remains of the car, and reconstruct it, just like the FAA does for aircraft. The will look at every component, and try to determine just what worked and what failed. Then they will make changes to the rules to make the cars safer.

Barely 20º but the violence was the same. 3 sections of Armco not being tied together vertically will be examined. Foam blocks would have helped a lot. Goes to show that every little thing doesn't get the same scrutiny until some bizarre event.

Greg Moore was mentioned and that wall was moved at CA Speedway after his death. Denny Hamlin hit a wall dead on over of the opposite side of the track near the pit entrance road and a long way from the racing surface and they covered it with 'soft wall' blocks. Every oval track has this same wall and every one has been tagged at one point.

[jrj3rd]

Originally Posted by Zeke

3 sections of Armco not being tied together vertically will be examined.

Some of the available photos clearly show the verticle support post about a foot to the side of the impact. 50g will make a lot of that moot

[URY914]

The videos after the race stopped showed the ground crew cutting the rails away and the sparks were flying. I'm thinking the rails were galvanized steel.

[legion]

Originally Posted by rfuerst911sc

His F1 career ? Maybe because there are only two races left and the season ends and so does his stint with Haas . His driving career ? No I think you will see him in sports car or Indy . The caveat is has this crash gotten into his head ? A race driver that is timid or lost the mental edge can be dangerous to themselves and others . I wouldn't blame him if the crash affects him mentally , only time will tell .

This. He doesn't have a ride for next year and he won't make the next two races. I expect to see him in another form of motorsport, just not F1. I was just commenting on the poor timing of his accident in regards to the end of his time with Haas.

[arcsine]

Grosjean was both incredibly stupid (It seemed to me that he thought he could cut right and go for a gap that was opening but failed to look or consider someone was there and ended up drilling himself into a metal barrier) and incredibly lucky (I'm going to ***** about halo's not being "F1", center punch a wall at speed, suffer a 50G load, suffer burns and stumble away to live/race another day). I'm glad he survived and sure he'll end up in some other series but I'm not going to say I'll miss him in F1.

What I cannot wrap my mind around is it was mentioned in the broadcast that the fire was a result of a 1-2L catch tank or reservoir rupturing. I guess it is fairly high-octane fuel but that seemed like much more fire than 1-2L of fuel.

And it is near criminal that Perez does not have a ride for 2021.

[GH85Carrera]

Pour just a cup of gasoline on a rag and light it and you will see a 10 foot flame if you survive the fire. It really does not take much fuel like gasoline to make a huge fire. 2 liters with a 50G impact will be flung in all directions and make a massive fire.

[Rtrorkt]

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a34814085/how-romain-grosjean-survived/?source=nl&utm_source=nl_rdt&utm_medium=email&date=113020&utm_campaign=nl22141925&utm_term=AAA%20--%20High%20Minus%20Dormant%20and%2090%20Day%20Non%2 0Openers

[Rikao4]

having stood amongst flames like that..
I just cringed and prayed..
he is beyond lucky..
burnt flesh..
the smell never leaves you..

Rika

[mocha07]

his is a significant shot - the Halo scraped and damaged after an extraordinary impact, and yet intact:https://pbs.twimg.com/media/En_-fO9XIAAux1c?format=jpg&name=small

[arcsine]

Word seems to be that the compression of the chassis during the deceleration caused pressure to build in the fuel cell and resulted in the filler-cap failing and releasing fuel from the tank itself. Not all of it thankfully but certainly more then a couple of liters from a catch tank.

[legion]

A self-sealing gas tank is just a bladder with multiple cells stacked on top of each other. If any one cell ruptures, the valves between the cells close. You can still lose all of the fuel in a single cell, just not the whole tank.

[rfuerst911sc]

An article I just read said the bladder fuel cell was deflated ( empty ) and all fuel lines had been ripped away , no surprise there . I don't think all the fuel available was released during the fire but I think more escaped than originally thought .

Steiner has stated the Haas team is leaving the carcass as is so F1 officials and engineers can study it . There is nothing to salvage so might as well use it as a learning tool .

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by jrj3rd

Some of the available photos clearly show the verticle support post about a foot to the side of the impact. 50g will make a lot of that moot

I wasn't thinking of the posts or their spacing. The thing needs to be stitched together to make one continuous and seamless barrier. Sort of a modular assembly of the sections overlapping and attached in a way that damaged sections can be R & R'd.

Actually the proximity of the post may have exacerbated the problem as the barrier wasn't able to deflect over a long span.

Sure, the layout needs to be altered but even if that barrier created for emergency vehicle access to the track is parallel to the track, someone will hit it. Just not as an acute angle. But 20º+ is still possible when cars start careening.

Phoenix Raceway had the same setup out of T4 up until several years ago when they closed the gap altogether. And it looks for all intents and purposes to be seamless with softwall in front. Lot of racers in various divisions hit the tail end of that wall when it was open. They still do but there's no abrupt change in the relationship to the direction of travel. so in many cases the just hit and slide along the wall rapidly losing speed.

A perfect example of what I'm talking about can be seen here:

[Reg]

How far apart are the main posts on the Armco? It looked like the impact was between two posts. Lucky again for him that it was.