Another MFG can go F-himself (Rant warning)

[MotoSook]

Please understand that the board is not a tool one uses to beat people into submission with. If you post something, take responsibility for it. No offense, Souk, but once you submit a post to the board, there it stays, until it becomes detrimental (usually in a legal way) to the community or Pelican Parts.

The purpose of my thread was not to beat anyone into submission. At the point of my first post I was already determined not to take anything from anyone. I wasn't out to screw anyone in my initial request for resolution. Things are the way they are because they happen to be.

I'll take responsiblity for it. (Not offense Skul, I know the rules)

Final post:

I will make it right my way. I'll see my friends on the Gruppe B board.

[motion]

I ordered a yellowbird fg bumper from a well known mfg a few years ago. It showed up with a large crack in it. I called the mfg and explained the situation. They were not willing to ship me a replacement, and suggested I contact UPS regarding an insurance claim. Once I considered all the grief involved with arguing with the mfg, filing a claim with UPS, waiting 2 months for a resolution, etc., I decided to just let things lie and have my body shop spend an hour patching it up for me. $37.. big deal. I seriously doubt the mfg would willingly ship me a cracked bumper. Businesses don't survive long with practices like that. Now, I am one to definitely stand up for what I believe is right, but in Souk's case, since no one knows the true story, its entirely possible that no one is at fault.

Sometimes in life, ya just gotta roll with things a little. And, there's always that nice feeling, sipping your beer, looking at your project in the garage, knowing that you diffused a war and were able to just let things go.

Peace, love and understanding... how about a big hug everybody

[911ctS]

Thanks for the heads up Souk. I currently work in an industry where quality upon arrival is imparitive, and guess who's problem it is when something arrives badly..... the vendors!!!

hey, the bottom line is..... HE'S making money off of YOU and the least he could do is put out an effort to resolve this problem. I now know who I wont contact for FG parts.

Do they by any chance supply Performance Products? Shun me for my sins but a few years back I bought a duck tail form PP and OMG
anyway.... nevermind

[greglepore]

KTL, when you say "no mat" do you mean no fabric of any sort? Or do you mean no chopped mat?

If its no fabric at all, its no wonder that it cracked.

[Scooter]

Originally posted by old_skul
I'll move this thread off-topic (since it basically is), but I'm not going to delete it.

Please understand that the board is not a tool one uses to beat people into submission with. If you post something, take responsibility for it. No offense, Souk, but once you submit a post to the board, there it stays, until it becomes detrimental (usually in a legal way) to the community or Pelican Parts.

There is a reason there is no Delete button on the threads one starts. Once you submit it, it becomes the property of the community (and PP).

If this is true, then why include the following language at the top of the edit page?

"Delete? To delete this post, check the box to the left and then click the button to the right.
Note: deleting this post will result in the deletion of the entire thread if this post is the first post in the thread."

Something does not seem right here. Furthermore, I did not like to tone of this post. Souk was merely informing the community of a bad experience...I see nothing wrong with his post. Souk appears to be an upstanding person, and I think implying that he was not taking responsibility for starting this thread is dead WRONG on your part. Souk, you should take offense!

[KTL]

That's right Greg. No mat in that location. You can shine a flashlight thru and see your thumb, finger or whatever quite clearly (no primer in that spot) on the other side.

Looks like an oversight on someone's part. Because the rest of the ducktail is nicely done from what I can see. It's a bolt-on tail. The nuts are molded into the lid in the hinge attachment points, which is good IMO.

I'm not trying to bash anyone here. Just trying to describe what happened. Should be able to fix it up without too much hassle.

Hope Souk doesn't take that the wrong way and hangs around.

[KTL]

Originally posted by motion
I ordered a yellowbird fg bumper from a well known mfg a few years ago. It showed up with a large crack in it. I called the mfg and explained the situation.................

I had an experience like Richard.

Got a Ruf front bumper cap from BW Motorsports that somehow got cracked in transit. Called up Brad and told him the story and offered to send him a picture of the damage. Called me back same day with his answer. Issued a call tag for Fed Ex, was picked up and he had it back to me really quickly and nicely repaired at no cost to me whatsoever.

My short dealings with Brad lead me to believe he is a standup guy who makes a concerted effort to make sure you're satisfied. I'd recommend him anytime.

[greglepore]

Kev- 'taint no composite engineer, but I've built a fair number of fg boats and some carbon bike parts, and I can tell you that polyester resin by itself has no strength at all. I don't know if these parts are hand laid w/ cloth in a mold, or shot with a chop gun, but its certainly not right, and likely not repairable in any way that's long term, unless you're willing to glass up the back, and then you might have fit issues. I'd seek a new duck.

Souk, I understand your anger, but in fairness, once you put it out there, its out there, and its not fair to ask that it get deleted, even if you're seeking to protect your intermediary. You're a valued voice/resource here, so please reconsider going elsewhere in a huff, really.

[expat]

BS Souk, dont disappear from here. Not all your friends hang on the B Board ya know

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by greglepore
. Your a valued voice/resource here,

yeah Souk..


got any jokes ?

[MotoSook]

OK. I’ll play some more.

I won’t disappear completely, but I’ll be spending more energy on the GruppeB forum (http://gruppeb.org/forum2/ ). It’s not just for bastards (not really), so you are all welcome to come over and join the fun. I’ve been crowned a Master Moderator, so I’ll hold all posters to the honest sword of GruppeB…even the supporting venders and sponsors! No one is exempt there. You fuch up, you fix it, without being beat into submission as some would put it. Truth shall rule the land at GruppeB and anything else will “get my size 12’s!”

So, I’m not pissed anymore, and I’m not going to stir things up anymore here. I’ll leave that up to Tabs. What I had to say has already been read by those that wanted to know, and the response has been satisfying enough. The message has been heard! We’ll let this thread die…

Come over to the B Board and join us….go to the "Courtyard" for the general discussion of P-cars.

Sorry Ronnie, no jokes today

[Zeke]

Guess what? I mentioned I was painting a duck tail for a fellow Pelican very early on here. Well, today I discovered the same damn crack along the side. This tail came from a shop in SoCal that may very well source their parts from Rennspeed, but there's no way to establish that for sure. It was picked up as a new part at GAF in Ventura last fall.

I can tell you all now what the problem is with the tails now that I have one right here. It was sanded too thin at the edge and they went right through the side leaving it paper thin. It would have cracked at some point, good thing it happened before painting.

Greg, these are hand laid parts and the underside web support is bonded to the skin, edges ground and sanded and the gell coat touched up. I noticed a lot of pinholes along that edge when I first took in the part. It also had some voids behing the gelcoat that I had to break open and fill back up. Par for the course for FG parts. You have to go over them carefully or they're not worth painting.

[MotoSook]

Geez..here I thought the thread would die...

It should be expected that most f-glass parts will be imperfect. I always maintained that, even when we were doing the CTR bumper buy.

That was one of the reasons I was not making a big stink initially about the cracked bumper I received. But..you guys know the story...not a quality of the part issue.

I think the shops/venders that sell better parts than other are closer to the production process and can better the products they sell. But even then some parts are better than others.

Milt, don't the molds make a big difference, as well as the matrix selection and quantity?

I made a f-glass intake manifold for variable runners for a turbocharges SAE car back in college, and we were careful to apply extra layers to the more stress area and the edges that we would cut. That thing turned out beautifully, and it was strong as hell. But we took great care to make it so.

A production part such as the tails and the bumpers made in large quantities is not likely to receive the care that my manifold received. That should be expected. It still doesn't make a whole lot of sense that a part costing hundreds of dollars to the consumer can be made with little care sometimes...

So the cheaper (less quality) parts make the market competitive by trying to under cut the better parts as been known to have been "purchased" from shops like BW, Getty and MA Shaw. That makes the better parts seem a little expensive. The cheaper parts ride on the consumer's readiness to get a lower cost part, and the better parts try to sell at a price closer to that of the cheaper parts..you see where this is going?

There is likely a large margin on the f-glass parts that I can't quantify, as cheap (and sometimes quality) labor can be had and the material when bought for production level work shouldn't be so expensive.

I don't know what all that means, but I thought I'd share my thoughts to should make the potential buyer think a bit before buying from any store.

[724doorE]

Dude, its the guy laying up the glass that f's up the mat and causes thin spots or voids on edges. If its a chopper glass part, like my piece of ***** duck, well then its that much worse to begin with.

So, we havin lunch tomorrow, if your busy, I'll be in LA for two weeks and will see ya'll when I get back

Must not be anything at all to do there since no one really answered my post about stuff goin on down there.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by Souk
Geez..here I thought the thread would die...

I don't know what all that means,

me either !

but to resopond to section 3c .. as per cost of our market prices..

it's simple cost benefit stuff.
in my simple glass world if I have any product issue ?
I then need epoxy resin and 10oz glass cloth.
I'm very happy that something is out there that will allow me to reform that bad boy.
I think Zeke will give you a more senior answer to section 3c

[MotoSook]

Dennis, you know I would love to, but I have some tools being trucked delivered tomorrow at noon, for which I have to be home for (it's a terrible story of another damaged item with a vender/MFR...such is my life..I'll tell you all about it later). So we'll have to wait. Maybe by the time we can make lunch, "Bastard" will be mobile with a nice new paint job. Have fun in Cali...rent a car and go canyon carving...

Ron, I was thinking the same..just go to the marina shop and get me some resin and glass

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by Souk
..just go to the marina shop and get me some resin and glass

yep..
Polyster resin is doable; but,
Epoxy resin is a home run and there's less chance of screwing up the job.

Even if you have to gut sections and create stiffening ribs.. it's no big deal..
and you have nothing else to do anyway

[Zeke]

Originally posted by 724doorE
Dude, its the guy laying up the glass that f's up the mat and causes thin spots or voids on edges. If its a chopper glass part, like my piece of ***** duck, well then its that much worse to begin with.

It's not chopper gun s I said. It is mismatch between the skin and the frame. Apparently a whole series of these have been made. To finish the joining of the two pieces, the edges at the sides must be ground and sanded. The skin (top) lays over too far on the frame, so they grind it back and voila, daylight. I backfilled it with mat and resin, v'd out the front and filled that too. That's how it's done. I'm not getting paid much for this so I don't need a week's hastles to finish this up.

[Joe Bob]

Zeke...if'n yer bored ya can come up and help me blend in the flares on the 356.....

[Kevin Stewart]

still cant log in to Groupb