Traffic Tickets as Source of Revenue

[RWebb]

Six Hidden Government Revenue Streams Page 2 of 2 - Forbes.com

statistically, this looks pretty solid

[Porsche-O-Phile]

No, it's about safety. Everyone knows it is.

[Embraer]

they don't call them "armed revenue collectors" without cause...

[A930Rocket]

If I go from one side of our little town to the other, I can see 7 or 8 police cars in a 15 minute span. I'll see 2 police cars on the same small street pass each other. They are like ants on sugar here.

As of 2007, the town had an estimated population of 64,707

Almost three-quarters of the cases that went through Mount Pleasant's municipal court in 2009 involve driving-related offenses, with officers handing out more than 500 tickets for speeding less than 10 mph over the speed limit, a look at the town's records shows.

In 2009, Mount Pleasant's municipal court handled 15,956 cases, records show, of which 5,582 were for speeding. The court handled 297 driving under the influence cases and 1,594 careless driving tickets.

Almost 1 in 12 got a ticket here...

[fxeditor]

I just got dinged $347 for a simple 50 in a 35. This fee is ridiculous! You can bet I'm fighting this ticket!

Michael

[911Freak]

Originally Posted by fxeditor

I just got dinged $347 for a simple 50 in a 35. This fee is ridiculous! You can bet I'm fighting this ticket!

Michael

Hey Michael!

Whats your strategy for fighting it? I got picked out of a group of cars and hit with a 84/55! total BS.. the CHP officer even pulled the " i smell alcohol" comment, it was almost laughable how canned it sounded. This was at 1pm on a Thursday btw.. yeah, probable cause...(green)

He nearly ran into the back of our vehicle, looking at his cruiser through the rear view mirror I couldn't even see the hood of his cruiser. Way to close!

I figure I'll request the records of calibration for his radar and view the dash video? it should show i was mid pack in a group of cars...

i could use some suggestions

hope it works for you, pm me with details if you don't want to post

cheers, Jason

[GH85Carrera]

There is a little town that is totally surrounded by OKC called Forrest Park. It is notorious as town that is supported by traffic tickets. The judge is paid by the town and he is only there to rubber stamp the ticket.

They will give speeding tickets for 2 MPH over. If you don’t come to a complete stop, and wait a second or two you will get a rolling stop ticket. If you don’t use your turn signals properly you will get a ticket. I really don’t have a problem with that. No one ever speeds through town. They understand there is no float. I drive through Forrest Park twice a month. The speed limit is 35 and I go 32. I come to complete stops, shift into neutral, and then shift into 1st and proceed. I never have a problem because I don’t break their laws.

[The Gaijin]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

It is notorious as town that is supported by traffic tickets....

....No one ever speeds through town. They understand there is no float...

This makes no sense.

No speeders = no revenue.

I am sure it make for a ****ty little experience. And imagine the place is no safer. That is the ostensible reason behind these laws anyway..

I am sure the Founding Fathers would be proud!

[Jeff Higgins]

The key to ending all of this is to demand that our right to due process in traffic court be restored. In Washington state traffic courts you:

Have no right to representation.
Have no right to a jury trial.
Have no right to appeal.
Face a standard of evidence known as "preponderance", which has a precise legal meaning - 51% of the available evidence points one way or another. It's meant to be a standard used in civil cases, wherein a judge must decide a dispute between two citizens. It was never meant as an evidence standard to be used in a trial where the state brings charges against a citizen.

On top of that, neither the officer nor the prosecutor need be present. The judge serves as prosecutor, and the written report from the officer serves as evidence. 51%, by the way. It's a no-win situation. Our only hope in this state is to hire a lawyer specializing in traffic citations and have them seek a dismissal on some technicality. If it goes to trial based on "evidence", you lose.

The restoration of due process would go a long ways towards ending the abuse of this system. In America, the state is ostensibly not allowed to bring charges, try, and convict a citizen of anything, no matter how minor, without running its case past our fellow citizens - a jury. The state must make its case to us, not to itself. The profit motive has clearly corrupted this particular venue of our legal system. It's time we all write our representatives and demand a restoration of due process in traffic court.

[tcar]

In Denver a speeding ticket, they usually give it for a little less than actual, usually knocking it down a money/points bracket.

Then, automatically, if you sign the ticket and send in the fine within 21 days, the fine and points are further reduced by about half.

They get the money and don't have the courts all clogged up and officers losing a half day of ticket writing.

I'm OK with that. I WAS speeding, afterall.

[quaz]

This is a sore spot for me because myself, wife, father, best friend and a couple of coworkers have all been stopped on the interstate in my area in the last few weeks. There is a lot of construction and they use the fuzzy zones between the beginning and end of construction to trap people and write mass amounts of speeding tickets. It is also well known that the counties are short on budget and have already cut back law enforcement agencies. So to prevent further cutbacks these agencies are trying to become a profit center, but here is the problem.

There are not enough hours in the day for officers to write enough tickets to cover the cost of themselves and the system. The more tickets they write the more it costs the tax payers and if they would just cut back in the departments this wouldn't be a problem. However I get we don't want to lay anyone off, but this strategy is not helping.

So think about the cost of employing one officer and then the process of the ticket. Each officer gets a salary, pension and health care from the county/state. Then they need a car with all the stuff in it. The car needs gas, insurance, maintenance, and probably regular accident repair. In the car are computers, guns, laser and radar guns, as well as many other special tools officers need. Add to this the cost of dispatch, cell phone, wi-fi and probably some other services and the cost keeps going up. Last we have to account for the useless time the taxpayers have to cover when the officer is eating donuts, smoking cigarettes (which they can't do in the car anymore), and generally goofing off. This alone probably costs close to 2-300K per year per officer.

I haven't yet begun to scratch the surface of the drag on the legal system. Once the ticket is written and you go to protest it we have to pay a judge, assistant DA, bailiffs, cashiers, building costs and more civil overhead. One $200 speeding ticket probably costs the taxpayer $2-400 in real costs. I am sick and tired of this abuse of our system and wish there was a way to protest it, but there isn't.

If we had no crime, and everything else was perfect then using cops for the sole purpose of generating revenue could be used. However police officers are meant to keep civil peace, stop crimes and aid in emergencies. Revenue generation is not an intended use of them. I know several cops (friends and family) and all of them are frustrated that they have been instructed to perform this duty. It is a waste of our tax dollars and should stop! We already pay taxes so why do we have to pay more on the road.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by quaz

One $200 speeding ticket probably costs the taxpayer $2-400 in real costs. I am sick and tired of this abuse of our system and wish there was a way to protest it, but there isn't.

And that's why I fight every ticket I can get to the court for. I want them to lose more than they get from me. But I don't see how it's such a great loss, since all those employees are salaried and would be getting paid the same, regardless of what they did that day at work.

[Jeff Higgins]

Originally Posted by tcar

I'm OK with that. I WAS speeding, afterall.

What if you were not?

I got stopped last year by two less than honest and scrupulous deputies while on the same motorcycle in the same area. Lo and behold, for once in my life, I truly was not speeding on the darn thing. Didn't bother these two in the least. They wrote me for 16 over (conveniently one mph into the next higher fine bracket) and took the rather callous attitude of "tell it to the judge". I felt completely helpless. There is absolutely no way to fight something like this, and these two ass clowns knew it. Their chesshire cat grins made me want to knock their teeth out through the backs of their necks.

Some of you may remember my thread about that incident. I went ape-shyte ballistic on those two, heaping untold verbal abuse upon them. I wrote a nasty letter to both our County Sheriff and our County Executive. My letter resulted in two internal affairs deputies calling me, but otherwise nothing came of it. They know they are untouchable.

We have no defense if they decide to lie, or if one of them makes an honest mistake. There are no checks and balances. There needs to be some. Due process... they should have to prove their allegations. Not to themselves, but to the rest of us. Guaran-farking-teed they would find other ways to spend their time. Right now it's just too darn easy. Too darn profitable.

[trekkor]

Interesting subject.

The short answer is: Just don't speed.

It would be fun to know the ACTUAL percentage of cited drivers that were not speeding.
I'd say it's very low.

I've been cited a couple times in the last 26 years.
I was ALWAYS speeding.

In fact, I don't know anyone that has been falsely accused of speeding.
I think it's rare, given that speeding is so common.

The speed limit in front of my place, out here in the country, just dropped from 55 to 45.
They have hung bright colored streamers from the new signs to get driver's attention, starting about a month ago.
Yesterday they had one of those, "your speed is", radar trailers in place.

The CHPs are going to have a field day.
I'm OK with that, because people drive by at 100-135 mph all the time ( every day ).

I'll try to get a shot a CHP using my driveway as a speed trap.
( I gave them permission and encourage it )


KT

[9dreizig]

Originally Posted by trekkor

Interesting subject.

The short answer is: Just don't speed.

It would be fun to know the ACTUAL percentage of cited drivers that were not speeding.
I'd say it's very low.

I've been cited a couple times in the last 26 years.
I was ALWAYS speeding.

In fact, I don't know anyone that has been falsely accused of speeding.
I think it's rare, given that speeding is so common.

The speed limit in front of my place, out here in the country, just dropped from 55 to 45.
They have hung bright colored streamers from the new signs to get driver's attention, starting about a month ago.
Yesterday they had one of those, "your speed is", radar trailers in place.

The CHPs are going to have a field day.
I'm OK with that, because people drive by at 100-135 mph all the time ( every day ).

I'll try to get a shot a CHP using my driveway as a speed trap.
( I gave them permission and encourage it )


KT

Dude,, 100-135 in NAPA ?? I'm calling BS!!! I'm totally with you on residential areas where kids and dogs are around.. My issue is speed traps where the limit may be 55-65 but it could be safe to go 90 (like across the desert)..

What are you doing with all of the krispy cream wrappers those guys throw out their windows onto your lawn??

[RWebb]

Jeff - you got one thing out of it (besides the extra $$ Rick mentions):

those 2 have a file now - if they get several more complaints, then there will be some serious oversight on them

I know it isn't fair, or adequate.

[trekkor]

Dude,, 100-135 in NAPA ?

No doubt. Maybe faster...

I live on one of the longest roads in Napa with no stop signs.
The stretch I live on is along a section that will support flat footed driving for about 1.4 miles.
( Don't ask me how I know )

Two lane, solid double-yellow, with blind driveways.
It's pretty insane.

[trekkor]

Maybe I'll shoot some hidden video...


KT

[Langers]

I just got dinged $347 for a simple 50 in a 35. This fee is ridiculous! You can bet I'm fighting this ticket!



Michael

err that's kind of a lot over the limit - nearly 50%! I don't see how you could complain about that one.

[Brando]

I agree... The same system is here in CA pertaining "due process". CA has a whole class of "moving violations" and infractions that because they are classed less than misdemeanors, do not require a jury trial or indictment.

This needs to change. Too many just "pay the fine" instead of fighting it when they should. Too many meaning those who were wrongly cited.