Are Bilstein struts better than Boge?

[kjb]

Hello,

Is there a large performance difference between Bilstein struts w/ Bilstein inserts and Boge struts with Bilstein inserts?

My 86 911 is in need of new shocks, and I was adviced to replace my Boge struts w/ Bilsteins to among other things get more suspension travel.

If struts are replaced, what other hardware needs to be replaced? Wheel bearings?

Thanks for any input,

Johan

[kjb]

No one there to clarify this?

/ J

[Victor]

Maybe. But adjustable Koni's are better than both and cost about the same as Bilsteins.

[ischmitz]

The strut does not make a difference if both have the same mounting spacing for the brales. Early Boge's have 3 inch spacing for M-calipers and later Boges and Bilsteins have 3.5 inch spacing for A- or S-calipers or other brakes. I don't see any reason why there would be a performance difference between a Boge 3.5 inch stut and a Bilstein 3.5 inch strut with their respective Bilstein inserts with the same valving.

IMHO You are best served with Boges because both Bilstein and Koni make inserts that fit in there. You have the ultimative choice between Boge, Bilstein, and Koni inserts that fit whilst Bilstein struts do only take Bilstein inserts and Koni struts only take Koni inserts.

Ingo

Lots of people here prefer Bilstein inserts.

[rzepko6194]

I just swapped out my soggy Boge gas shocks for Bilstein HD inserts. They gave me better handling with the same ride quality as before.

It took me about 2 hours to do both front sides. The cost was also a lot less than a complete strut swap and I didn't need to do an alignment afterward.

[masraum]

The only time that a Bilstein strut housing would be better than a Boge strut housing is if you have had your car lowered to the point of needing a bump steer kit and instead you get the spindle raised on the strut. Otherwise the strut itself shouldn't really make any difference. I don't think there will be any difference between normal Bilstein struts and Boge struts with Bilstein inserts.

[yelcab1]

I had Boge, Konis adjustables, and Bilsteens over the years. Here is what I think:

Boge don't last t a lifetime, and they are too soft
Konis adjustables are very stiff, and you don't end up adjusting them at all, especially the rears. Too much trouble.
Bilsteens give me the best handling.

My opinions, no need for debates.

[chrisp]

The Bilstein front shock design is stronger and stiffer laterally due to the design of the insert. The load bearing members are larger diameter in the Bilstein shock (with the roll pin mounting) than the others.

I believe both strut bodies are equal in strength/stiffness.

[Superman]

Koni's are excellent shocks. Nevertheless, I am a Bilstein man. There is no shock better. As good, maybe. Maybe.

[kjb]

First, thanks to all who chimed in!

Originally posted by masraum
The only time that a Bilstein strut housing would be better than a Boge strut housing is if you have had your car lowered to the point of needing a bump steer kit and instead you get the spindle raised on the strut.

Originally posted by chrisp
I believe both strut bodies are equal in strength/stiffness.

These were the answers I was looking for! Since I plan to keep my car within the autocross stock category, changing the spindle height is out of the question.

If no one can point to any other benefits of Bilstein struts (more suspension travel?), I'll keep my Boges and spend my money on something else.

/ Johan

[masraum]

It seem a bunch of people aren't getting the question. He's not asking which inserts are better. He's going to get Bilstein inserts. His question is does it matter if he gets Bilstein inserts and puts them in his Boge bodies or do the Bilstein bodies offer some improvement.

[kjb]

Thanks for the clarification, Steve!

Bodies might be a better word to use than struts.

/ Johan

[chrisp]

Yeah but the Bilstein inserts that go in the Boge body are different than the Bilstein inserts that go in the Bilstein body. The Bilstein/Bilstein set up is better (how much may be hard to notice...I have never measured the deflection) because the shock design gives a better overall system.

[kjb]

Originally posted by chrisp
The Bilstein/Bilstein set up is better

That's precisely what I was told when I took my car to one of the local places that works almost exclusively on race-prepped 911s.

So far I've heard the follwing advantages of bilstein bodies w/ bilstein inserts:

* stronger and stiffer laterally
* better shock design
* allows for changing of spindle height
* more travel?
* allows more internal modifications?

So if I stay with my Boge strut bodies, I save money. If I change to Bilstein struts, will it cut a second off my autocross lap times?

/ J

[chrisp]

No.

[911ctS]

I doubt you will. Just buy Bilsteins for Boge or Koni for Boge inserts and you'll be fine.

The green Bilstein strut bodies are way more expensive than Boges. You'd be lucky to find a very used pair under $400. Thats what I think anyway.

Adj. Koni's are sweet, especially the externally adj. ones. But if you know nothing about shock theory and adj. on them, then I would just get Bilsteins and let them put whatever valving those "experts" think your car should have.

[Bill Verburg]

The struts/bodies are a wear item and will eventually need replacement, especially on a tracked car. Might as well replace them w/ a Bilstein strut instead of buying an insert then having to buy a strut w/ an insert like I did

[kjb]

Originally posted by Bill Verburg
The struts/bodies are a wear item and will eventually need replacement, especially on a tracked car.

OK, that a good justification.

As for price, I was quoted $1200 for parts to get new Bilstein struts/bodies, new bilstein shocks w/ sports valving all around, and associated hardware necessary for the swap.

/ Johan