Rust on my faux "stainless" Danske !!!??

[chrisp]

Notice that I said, "I am not saying yours are well founded or not...".

[RickM]

[i]The catalog is apparently misleading on this issue, and I have instructed Eugene to add the following statement to the catalog: "Flanges are cast steel".

Should it read, "Flanges and inlet pipes are cast steel" ?

Originally posted by Danskman
Let's get this cleared up once and for all. All interior components of the Dansk polished stainless steel sport mufflers are made of stainless steel. The exterior of the mffler is also stainless steel.

Does this go for the painted version as well?

[rdane]

3.) Stainless would be called "rust proof" if it was such. Stainless will rust. It gets it's name from it's tendency to "stain" "less" than XXXXXX.

5.) Did you expect more from it than it could ever deliver? Don't make it sound like it's a P.O.S. and you are getting screwed by the man.

Chrisp,
Let me address some of what you have said. Read the entire thread, I am well aware of the properties of stainless steels. I have no unrealistic expectations of stainless steel.

Cast steel is not stainless steel which was my complaint. While the stainless on the actual muffler is discolored I have no complaint on that issue and why I refused a refund from Wayne.

No where did I say the Dansk is a POS. I am dissappointed in how they manufacture and represent their product. But as I noted GHL does exactly the same thing at twice the price. So it is certainly an accepted norm in the industry.

The Internet is a powerful tool both for the consumer, finding out about potential problems and their fixes quickly and easily. Direct access to the manufactures and retailers such as Mike and Wayne who both graciously stepped in and offered help. And for the retailer as a marketing and as a customer service tool. This thread should show both sides of that subject very clearly.

Given the fact that the Dansk was half the price of the Monty when I purchased it from Pelican I figure I still got a good deal. Would I buy it again? Maybe if I were looking for price point. But no, if I were looking for a stainless muffler. There is the rub.

Wayne's BBS and me asking the question allows us all to be better consumers on our own projects the next time we make a purchase.

Again a thanks to Mike at Dansk for taking my call this morning and helping me sort through the manufacturing process and for Wayne staying on top of his products and his generious offer.

[Craig 930 RS]

To me the bottom line in a "stainless muffler" better damn well be all stainless. There is no such thing either as being "a little pregnant" :-)

Eithe youze is or youze ain't

Craig
@RS

[Scooter]

Originally posted by chrisp
Notice that I said, "I am not saying yours are well founded or not...".

Correct you are!

[Danskman]

Originally posted by RickM
Does this go for the painted version as well?

I'm not 100% clear on what you are referring to, Rick. Dansk makes two painted mufflers. The original muffler is stainless steel, painted gray. We also make a sport muffler that is painted black. That muffler is aluminized steel, with a polished stainless tailpipe.

Should we all hug now?

[Craig 930 RS]

Back off muffler breath......

Craig
@RS

[dtw]

I've never expected that a muffler advertised as "stainless" would also have stainless flanges. What's the point? The flange and inlet are made of of heavy enough pig iron that they're not likely to rust out during the life of the car. The whole point of making a stainless muffler is to address the issue of the muffler eating itself from the inside out. Stainless construction greatly impedes this process (but doesn't stop it altogether).

Cosmetics of the flange can't reasonably be an issue (can they??). As far as the polished stainless body - - if you want it to stay that way, stock up on polish. I had a bypass resonator that was polished, and it looked great on the car that way from the driver side. But, I had to crawl under there and polish it literally weekly to maintain the shine. The payoff was you could see your reflection in the muffler from down the street.

I have read the thread, but I guess I just can't share your outrage.

[RickM]

Originally posted by Danskman
I'm not 100% clear on what you are referring to, Rick. Dansk makes two painted mufflers. The original muffler is stainless steel, painted gray. We also make a sport muffler that is painted black. That muffler is aluminized steel, with a polished stainless tailpipe.

I was asking about the painted sport muff. You answered my question. Thanks.

[Craig 930 RS]

Wow, 524 posts in one day on one topic......must be some sort of record.....

Craig
@RS

[tchanson]

Originally posted by rdane
Given the fact that the Dansk was half the price of the Monty when I purchased it from Pelican I figure I still got a good deal. Would I buy it again? Maybe if I were looking for price point. But no, if I were looking for a stainless muffler. There is the rub.

It appears to me that Mike stated that he believes (but will confirm) that on the single in, the inlet pipe is also stainless with only the flange itself being cast.

Thus, as far as I can tell, at least on the single in, anyway, the only substantive difference in construction (as both have internal and external 300 series stainless construction) between the single in Monty and single in Dansk is the flange?

At recent prices for each, (roughly $300 more for the Monty single in) that's one very expensive Aussie stainless flange.

Tim

[Steve W]

I fully understand rdane's point. However the reality of the future problems from the rusting inlet flanges are minimal. I've used 6 different mufflers from different manufacturers with SSIs, and they all have their issues. A Monty is the only one that has full stainless inlets, but they are not without their particular issues too. The factory Porsche Bischoff 2 in muffler inlets are cast iron too. That said, though another muffler may use better materials, or flow a little better, a Dansk 2 in muffler is a damn good muffler encompasing the minimum of overall compromises and would be one of my top choices. I choose sound quality, quality of construction, and lack of resonance over cosmetic surface rust, as long as it would outlast my car. And there are ways to modify the Dansk muffler for even better top end performace.

[930slant]

OR... buy a B&B. Mine has been on the car for 5+ years and there is no hint of anything other than clean, bright, stainless steel. I do drive mine when it rains and have used it at the beach with a lot of salt air to deal with. I agree that the seller needs to back up the product and then deal with the manufacturer. If it is a bad product, drop it from the line.

[Wayne 962]

Let me chime in again here.

- First of all, the issue of rusting pipes (inlets) is important. This is a common failure point on the older 911 heat exchangers, and especially the older 914-6 ones as well. They have a tendency to develop pockets of rust that can indeed eat all the way through the pipes. Sad, but true.

- I'm having Eugene look into the Monty mufflers again - this has been on my list for a while.

- On the issue of this BBS, I have learned that it is a very powerful tool. However, like a double-edged sword, it can be used for good, but it also can sting you. In a moments notice, I can advertise specials, ask people what they are interested in, and also gauge the overall market simply by polling people. Counter to that, people can voice complaints as well, both well-founded and unfounded too. I think it's a tribute to our organization that all the complaints I've seen so far on the BBS seen relatively minor (shipping mistakes, out-of-stocks, etc.).

-Wayne

[scottb]

Originally posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts
If you are unhappy with the muffler at this time, I will buy it back from you and give you a $439 credit at Pelican.

Now THAT'S customer service!

[Danskman]

Originally posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts
- First of all, the issue of rusting pipes (inlets) is important. This is a common failure point on the older 911 heat exchangers, and especially the older 914-6 ones as well. They have a tendency to develop pockets of rust that can indeed eat all the way through the pipes. Sad, but true.

I am reluctant to use the words "never" and "always", but in all my years with Dansk, I have never seen a Dansk product fail in this manner for any application.

[efhughes3]

Definitely 400 series in lieu of 300 series. 400 is used in "economically priced" food equipment as it has all of the safety aspects of S/S as far as NSF concerns. Typically, the 400 is used in places that don't have much if any welding. Right now S/S prices with HUGE surcharges are at record highs, rising monthly. I see factories trying all kinds of ways to skimp, switching to 400 is one.

[dickster]

i have to agree with rdane. if its advertised as "mostly" stainless then fair enough.

i'm holding out for a monty eventually - wayne, is eugene on the case??

[speeder]

FWIW, SSIs might "rust", but you can remove it w/ steel wool. I bought some used ones that were filthy and discolored for cheap, they cleaned up like new. It is not in any way comparable to what Rdane is experiencing on his inlet pipes. That said, the slight oxidation on those pipes is the same as found on any 2004 vehicle on the road w/ more than 200 miles on the odometer.

My SSIs: (you can see the spot on one pipe where I rubbed it w/ steel wool):