3.6 crate motor kit or rebuild the 3.2?

Shuie · 12-23-2004, 01:04 PM

Just for grins I added up what I think I could sell the pile of parts that might make up my 3.2 short stroke. Low and behold, it would more than cover the cost of a prepped 3.6 crate motor and a front oil cooler setup.

My car is fairly sorted. I already have a good early mag 915. In order to finish my 3.2, I'm still looking at some machine work costs on my stacks & throttle bodies, some headwork, a cam modification, and a potential MFI pump R&R. Not to mention bearings, assembly kits, and the time to assemble the 3.2.

Hindsight is always 20/20. I'm looking for advice from the guys who have BTDT. Has anyone here built a hotrod 3.2, 3.4, or 3.5 instead of going the 3.6 route and later regretted it? Any of the 3.6 guys wish they have rebuilt their base engines instead of doing the swap? Is $15k enough of a budget for a DIY 3.6 swap and front oil cooler install on an otherwise sorted car these days?

TIA

Bill Verburg · Bill Verburg's Garage

A hot rod 3.6 is tough to beat no matter how you look at it.

ChrisBennet · ChrisBennet's Garage

A used 3.6 is more cost effective per HP.
Building your own hot rod motor is more satisfying.

Or you can do both: "Carrerasport" had a 3.6 with a bent valve(s) for sale for $3600 (w/DME and harness) the other day. I could have rebuilt that for $2-3K and had a rebuilt 3.6 for the price of a used 3.2. I get parts a little cheaper than you do but you get the idea.

-Chris

randywebb · 12-23-2004, 02:23 PM

Yes, I hotrodded a 3.2L motor, and regretted it when the local shop had two 3.6L motors for $2,500 for sale. Of course, I don't know how much damage was doen when they blew their pistons or whatever was shredded on them...
And the 3.6 is harder to put in an earlier car.

Shuie · 12-23-2004, 02:29 PM

Its not as straightforward of a swap as a 3.2 would be. Im looking at crate motors from Dr. Timmins so tht should make it easier.

Mike Feinstein · Mike Feinstein's Garage

I might suggest you find someone with at 3.6 (V-ram preferrably), even if it's in a heavy 993, and drive it. If the torque doesn't give you goose bumps then simply toss a coin. If it does, your decision is made.

One thing I like about the swap is that the engine was built by Porsche to their specs for reliability and performance. I'm sure there are good engine builders around, but for my money, factory reliability was a big draw. Your budget is close, especially if you have a motor, or motor parts to sell off.

Bill Verburg · Bill Verburg's Garage

Also please keep in mind as I alluded to earlier. Any stock 3.6 is in a very mild state of tune

Shuie · 12-23-2004, 02:36 PM

a mild 250hp is still twice what I have on tap right now

mede8er · mede8er's Garage

3.6...hands down....Timmens is a good dude.......

Craig 930 RS · 12-23-2004, 03:00 PM

3.6. They will transform your '72 Sepia into a BEAST.
The torque is astounding. Ya get the best of everything -

rdane · rdane's Garage

3.6 is awesome. I would not suggest putting one in unless you have plans for very good brakes and at the very least, 8" 225/ 9" 245 for tires.

Craig's car jumped 109 hp and 80 ft/# torque. You have to drive one off these cars at 2400lbs or less to appreciate it.

Shuie · 12-23-2004, 04:35 PM

It's a good thing someone figured out how to fit 8s under the rear of a narrow ass car

My brakes are from a '87 Carrera in the front, stock rear, with a fresh 19mm non boosted master cylinder and super blue. I wish they were boosted, but the car stops pretty good.

randywebb · 12-23-2004, 04:37 PM

I should point out that in stock form the 3.6 is somewhat heavier. If it is converted to carbs and etc. then it is about the same wt. as the early 911 engines.

My spreadsheet (Engine tab) at rennlight.com has detailed and acurate wt. data for modifying a 3.2L to use carbs, SSI, etc.

rdane · rdane's Garage

Buy the flairs dude...you'll need them..trust me

It'll be a lot cheaper in the long run. 225s won't make 5K miles in that car with a 3.6. But no question you would have a grin on your face and smoke in the cabin most of the time.

Kevin Stewart · 12-23-2004, 05:36 PM

I dont track my car, i have a 3.6 and my sc brakes work just fine, Kevin

Craig 930 RS · 12-26-2004, 06:20 PM

"Has anyone here built a hotrod 3.2, 3.4, or 3.5 instead of going the 3.6 route and later regretted it?"

Maybe not regretted it..........but definitely went for a 3.6 changeover shortly after -

anthony · 12-26-2004, 06:24 PM

What's the ballpark price on a 3.6L "crate" motor?

Shuie · 12-26-2004, 06:40 PM

From Dr. Timmins website:

~$13k for a '94 motor
~$14k for a '95 motor
~$16k for a '97 motor

I dont know how dated these prices are

rdane · rdane's Garage

I talked with Timmins last week. The prices listed are current.

~$13k for a '94 motor
~$14k for a '95 motor
~$16k for a '97 motor

"Has anyone here built a hotrod 3.2, 3.4, or 3.5 instead of going the 3.6 route and later regretted it?"

My rebuild was defined by the budget I was then willing to work with, $15K. The 3.6 was a 8/10K plus pop up front was a little heady for me going into a less than $10,000 car.

A year later and some time driving both my 3.4 and a light 3.6 from a 993 I am rethinking my build.

The prices can be a push. The level of performance from the later 3.6s isn't.

But there are so many good 911 engines available. That gets lost in the discussion at times I think.

frencjas · 12-26-2004, 07:11 PM

3.6 varioram for me, and no regrets. Oh, and it's supposedly lighter than the 3.2 according to some sources. My car lost 20-30lbs with the change from a 3.2 to 3.6, but is likely attributable to the lightened flywheel and no heat heaters (ssi's previously).

For the same money as the entire transplant, I could have had my 3.2 completely rebuilt, and not much better than new. It was an easy decision for me to go with the 3.6 once the 3.2 got tired. Timmins kit make it very cost effective!