Reconstructing Constant Velocity (CV) Joints

[JJ 911SC]

Originally Posted by Walt Fricke

... Of course, well done safety wiring looks impressive. And it is required for lots of aircraft applications, whether valuable or not. But a lot of extra work for no gain.

Yes, we don't do that on First Level Hull Valve on Submarines...

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by Walt Fricke

Someone - Smith? - also said safety wire just means the bolts won't fall off when they get loose. Might be valuable in some applications where the shear strength of the bolts is what matters (like, say, a seat belt mount), but not for repetitive stresses. Rod bolts, for instance, don't have their nuts safety wired. And properly tightened don't come loose, either.

Of course, well done safety wiring looks impressive. And it is required for lots of aircraft applications, whether valuable or not. But a lot of extra work for no gain.

Yes, I'm pretty sure that was in Screw to Win

The wire IS pretty - and keeps the bolt out of your turbofan...



and BTW - dig up the old threads on split-ring lock washers....

[David Inc.]

Yeah safety wire is more so loose bolts don't end up in places they shouldn't I understand.

[Walt Fricke]

JJ - you wore the dolphins? You are saying that despite all the terrific safety stuff (beefed up after disasters) there are critical fasteners, with procedures for tightening them to ensure they don't loosen, etc, which don't require safety wire? Does anything get safety wired on those boats?

[JJ 911SC]

Walt, yes but the were vertical (Ship Diver).

Wire are use on very few items (I'm going to look at the drawing package so I can sleep tonight...). Tab washer are more comment and a variety of Loctite.

[otto_kretschmer]

Originally Posted by JJ 911SC

Yes, we don't do that on First Level Hull Valve on Submarines...

I can confirm this

[montauk]

I just pulled the axles off my car last night. I'm dropping the engine and transmission and found the CV joints at the tranny were worn with almost no grease in them so rather than rebuild, I thought I'd just go with rebuilt axles. I ordered them from our host.

I didn't find any moon plates or lock washers. You can also see in the photos that there's no metal clips on the narrow side of the boots. I'm the second owner of my car. The prior owner had a shop in MD do a fair amount of work before I bought it in 2012. I guess they reassembled the axles without those clips.

I did notice, particularly on the tranny side, that there's enough gunk in the hex heads of the bolts to prevent getting good purchase with the allen wrench. I was picking away at each one with an ice pick but found spraying brake cleaner in each one worked faster and better.

[PeteKz]

IMO, you should find some replacement moon plates and lock washers. I've had CV joint bolts loosen up, so do everything the factory did to keep them tight. Plus blue Loctite.

[TxGerman]

I installed new moon washers, Schnorr lock washers and bolts. My SC was missing the moon washers as well. The best buy I was able to find was here: https://www.jbugs.com/product/87-5081.html

Good luck

[montauk]

I got my rebuilt axles from our host. One of them had clearly been sold before, poorly packaged back up and returned. The protective plastic cap and mesh boot weren't attached at one end. I guess our host doesn't inspect returns before shipping them back out. I hate wasting time returning things.

Keep it or return it?

[PeteKz]

People often have to return things after they unpackaged and discover that it doesn't fit right. BTDT.
If it doesn't look like it was actually used, I'd keep it. It's gonna be "used" soon enough, right?

[evan9eleven]

This amazing thread is absolutely overdue for a bump, and I need some help please. Following this thread and others, I decided to upgrade to the later Carrera axles on my '81SC.

To start, some info from the late, great Grady Clay from post #243:

Originally Posted by Grady Clay

The 108 mm Carrera set-up
Stub axles not needed
2 each Lock nuts 900.910.093.02
2 each Axle assemblies, 108 mm CV with friction welded stub axles 911.332.024.14 (Note: superseded to 911.332.024.16.)
2 each Transmission axle flanges 915.332.209.12
12 each M10 socket head cap screws M10x50 900.067.123.01
6 each Support plates 911.332.191.00
12 each Schnorr washers M10 999.523.103.01

Please don’t take these P/Ns as gospel; there are supersessions and these might not be the right parts for the conversion. Some research help would be appreciated.

Missing from that list are the washers under the big axle nuts, 928.331.591.02. The older washers standard on the SC will not fit.


In my case I decided to buy new billet transmission axle flanges from CMS, with their spacers since I have an LSD. And while I had everything apart, I installed new wheel bearings. All good there.

HELP: New bearings are done, wheel hubs pressed back in, new transmission flanges installed, and 911.332.024.16 axles procured from our host (rebuilt GKN/Lobro, GKN part 300758.) Except... the axles are too short. Verified with Pelican that I received the correct axles, and that the GKN part numbers are correct for the application. These are not the Turbo axles. Obviously, I'm missing something. All input welcome!


Pics of the new vs. old axles:

[Locker537]

Do you need to update the outboard hub for this conversation as well?

Maybe not the most helpful question, but I don't see it mentioned in your post and I do see it mentioned in Grady's old posts.

[evan9eleven]

Originally Posted by Locker537

Do you need to update the outboard hub for this conversation as well?

Maybe not the most helpful question, but I don't see it mentioned in your post and I do see it mentioned in Grady's old posts.

That is an excellent question. I just checked PET now, both for SC's up to '83, and Carreras from '84-, both show 911.331.065.33 as the wheel hub for the non-turbo cars.

EDIT: PET from '87- shows the same part number for the wheel hub as well on non-turbo cars.

[safe]

Originally Posted by Locker537

Do you need to update the outboard hub for this conversation as well?

Maybe not the most helpful question, but I don't see it mentioned in your post and I do see it mentioned in Grady's old posts.

I have the hubs from a SC (so for 6 bolt M8 100mm) on my car and I have used CVs (with stubaxles) from a both a 69 and a later G50 car. They just bolt in. I think they are basically the same from the late 60's to the late 80's 3.2. A 964 didn't fit if I remember correctly....

[evan9eleven]

Originally Posted by safe

I have the hubs from a SC (so for 6 bolt M8 100mm) on my car and I have used CVs (with stubaxles) from a both a 69 and a later G50 car. They just bolt in. I think they are basically the same from the late 60's to the late 80's 3.2. A 964 didn't fit if I remember correctly....

At issue here, is that I'm upgrading to the later 108mm versions that have the stub axle permanently welded to the outboard end of the half shaft. So there is no separate stub axle with flange. And it appears that my new axles are 20mm too short.

I'm not sure I see how you could have used a G50 axle, as it wouldn't mate to the 100mm 6xM8 transmission flanges.

There were changes around '76 (by memory, it's all in this thread) to the 100mm CVs and flanges, and a change again to the 108mm with integrated stub axle sometime in 1986.

[safe]

Originally Posted by evan9eleven

At issue here, is that I'm upgrading to the later 108mm versions that have the stub axle permanently welded to the outboard end of the half shaft. So there is no separate stub axle with flange. And it appears that my new axles are 20mm too short.

I'm not sure I see how you could have used a G50 axle, as it wouldn't mate to the 100mm 6xM8 transmission flanges.

There were changes around '76 (by memory, it's all in this thread) to the 100mm CVs and flanges, and a change again to the 108mm with integrated stub axle sometime in 1986.

Exactly, the 3.2 half shaft is a one piece with the stub axle.

Yeah, I have a G50 transmission. Originally I had a 901 and that was about the same width as the G50. A 915, if you have that, might be narrower.

20 mm too short sounds like a lot! Are you sure about that??

Have you looked here: https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/596183-cv-axle-cross-reference.html
The length of the late 108mm and the 100mm axles should almost the same.

[Otter74]

I'm going to piggyback a quick question onto this thread. My SC has a torn inner boot that I'm going to replace soon. I have a new boot. Does any of the hardware need to be replaced when R&Ring axles/CVs?

[safe]

Originally Posted by Otter74

I'm going to piggyback a quick question onto this thread. My SC has a torn inner boot that I'm going to replace soon. I have a new boot. Does any of the hardware need to be replaced when R&Ring axles/CVs?

No, not really. But if the bolt are allen heads they might get a little sloppy and then it can be worth replacing them before they get rounded.
New schnorr washers might be prudent, but even new arent that great. If you want some lock washers thats really good, nord lock is the choice, but you need longer bolts for them.

[evan9eleven]

UPDATE: I would like to formally announce that I am a doofus!

A friend asked me if I'd pulled on each end of the axle to see if it needed to be expanded a little. The thought had crossed my mind, but I had no idea that these things expand like an accordion! The CV's were a bit compressed from the factory, and with a little pull they stretched right out. In they went, all torqued up, ready for a test drive!

So it was my turn to be an idiot so someone else won't have to. Thanks for the input everyone

With moon plates and Schnorr washers, just as Grady would want to see it: