Since the defrost ducts are significantly different between the large vent dash cars (87 and up IIRC) and the earlier cars, and there are so many holes to fill in the '87 dash face, I'm opting to replace both of them.

I'd rather not disturb the factory spot welds at the windshield (and keep structural integrity of the factory joint), so instead I'm cutting in the top dash panel at or near the horizontal break - as such, it shouldn't get too flimsy, but I want to be certain it hasn't moved with all the climbing around in the trunk I've been doing (and will do, to put the dash in.)

As for the roof, now when we do a sunroof deletion, we replace the entire panel to within an inch of the drip rails, from the top of the front windshield to the top of the rear windshield, taking apart the spot welds along the front and the back - everything looks factory when completed. Ironically, this car was the last one we did by just welding in the sunroof panel, and since the Mary Stuart has no headliner, we have to have clean metal up there from the interior side, so it gets a new roof now.

As I'm molesting both the top and the bottom of the windshield opening, the template is going to keep me from laying awake at night second guessing myself as to whether or not what I'm doing will contribute to windshield seal leaks.

I hope that makes sense?

EDIT: I'm building this tool on another 911 (a straight '77 that a friend of mine is about to rework) - it just occurred to me that this might be a bit confusing as I'm talking about the project car, but showing this one...

Ah yes, thank you for your detailed post clarifying the dash business. You had me a little concerned as I mocked up an early dash in my '83 tub (backdate). All seemed good and I moved on to the next thing.

I like your sunroof delete method. There is much more crown and good stiffness around the HAZ. It's good that the backside will not be visible but it's not as accessible either, of course. Looking forward to pics of the process!

I'm curious to see how the jig fits across a decade and thousands of production 911s. I don't believe there are many of the factory jigs floating around outside of the factory shop so I wonder who really knows what little quirks can be expected.

Tim K

I wouldn't sweat the dash too much, I've done several without any ill effect - I'm just getting to the point where I'd like to reduce my stress level by having the tools to verify things according to the manual, particularly with the rising value of these cars...

That being said, I have to say that I was surprised how far off a reasonably sound car can be when I started using the Celette. As you alluded to, these things have been flexed and used for 40 years! A lot of what we do ends up stiffening the body for better or worse, I like knowing that its for the better.

I've got plans for additional tooling for the Celette already in that regard.

Here we go again! Zuffenhaus MS RSR project...
 

Quick Saturday update; as Tim predicted, I tried the jig on several eras' worth of chassis in the shop, will need revisions...

So it comes back apart.

Since the same template is used through the 993 per factory manuals, I'm tweaking it on my early [1/94 build date!] car (which is getting a sunroof deletion per RS also):

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...b2baaa6513.jpg

I'm using that, an '87 Cab, a '72 Coupe and a '90 Coupe to finalize the shape of this thing.


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

Here we go again! Zuffenhaus MS RSR project...
 

So the tool came back apart and I reshaped the bottom side to fit better in the 993.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...32d0d28ee2.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...c8c51066bf.jpg

Just about to run out of gas again, and since I don't have the upper windshield reference on my car, I'll be reshaping and building the top side on a G50 cab in the shop tomorrow.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...ca90fbd22e.jpg


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

...and things get complicated; there seems to be 2 different windshield lower corner shapes?

I'm posting at length about this here.

For our uses, I'm moving ahead with the 993 corner shape for our tool; need to get back on the build at hand!

Quick update; we have a useable tool. Fits 993, fits '72 911:

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...40471570b9.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...385ecdaf6c.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...d95a03b540.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...40a072592a.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...8adadc37ed.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...ebafc1eca8.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...b7b3cb4ef6.jpg

!

Now I just need to finish this thing without breaking any tack welds and make another horizontal brace!


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

and back at it - finished the p852 enough to put it to use (it can use some sanding/smoothing and better paint) and started work on the dash today.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1433978673.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1433978695.jpg

Nice work! A valuable tool you have.

Where are the tell-tale gaps outside the fixture for the different eras?

Tim K

On the 993 and '72? Car to car deviations. On the 2 '87s, '69 and '90, I believe there is a different curve at the bottom of the windshield - they are all consistent, indicating the possibility of a different stamping in my mind.



keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

Started with minor rust repair and hole closures on the donor dash, then got to the fun stuff, mapping out the locations of the race car bits. 2 warning lights and 2 ignition kill switches per the original car:

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...d716d5220f.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...4e30c4df44.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...45330332f3.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...6ffd28ef6e.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...4dc4d90493.jpg

Now I'm test fitting the dash (roughed it in last month) and checking for other work that needs to occur prior to install.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...6dda6fcdf7.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...3d6dbb3496.jpg

As it turns out, there are front firewall closures that I need to make while I have the access, so the dash comes back out for that work.

Hopefully I can resolve those tomorrow and get the dash in this weekend.



keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

Did I say make hole closures?

Apparently I start that process by making holes:

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...760e103206.jpg

All the fun of fishing without the fish.


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

^ It took me a minute to see that, yikes!


Really enjoying this thread, i need to come up an see you guys in person.

thanks, glad you like it!

Closed the switch holes in the front firewall with the plug that gigged me yesterday (lot of contours on that piece!)

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...20ce4f6ebf.jpg

And on to dash face installation. Finally.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...e55a734aa3.jpg

Will be busy with the dash the rest of the day.


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

Keith, make sure your tetanus booster is up to date. John

OK, got the dash face in, and also a closing panel to block off the holes to the trunk (no dashboard on this car)

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...982a21b430.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...83b05da390.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...64760a60ae.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06...02741e06fc.jpg

I would have accomplished even more today, but my spot welder blew a cooling line on the next to last weld, and pumped coolant all over the place. Business as usual.

I'm on the dash top tomorrow!


keith.

(sent from my rotary dial phone.)

yup, last September in fact, thanks.

Looking good Keith (except for the flesh in your metal work). Thanks again for all the updates, I check them every day to see what you're up to.

Where's the cage in that dash reference picture you sent?