Penetrating Fluid effectiveness

[ljowdy]

I know a lot of you swear by PB Blaster and this may not be the correct forum to post this information but, you may want to try this next time you have a rusted or seized nut/bolt. (Courtesy of a friend on another board)

The April/May edition of Machinist's Workshop did a test of penetrating oils where they measured the force required to loosen rusty test devices.

Buy the issue if you want to see how they did the test. The results reported were interesting. The lower the number of pounds the better.

Mighty interesting results for simple acetone and tranny fluid!


Product used..........Force required to loosen bolt.
None ................. 516 pounds ..
WD-40 .............. 238 pounds .. $0.25 Price per ounce
PB Blaster ......... 214 pounds .. $0.35
Liquid Wrench ... 127 pounds .. $0.21
Kano Kroil ......... 106 pounds .. $0.75
ATF-Acetone mix.. 53 pounds .. $0.10

The ATF-Acetone mix was a 50/50 mix (1 to 1 ratio).

[Shaun @ Tru6]

thanks for posting this. did they specify type of ATF? something like a basic Autozone brand or Dexron II?

I've got a PB Blaster trigger spray can and will try this on my extremely rusty 4Runner, a perfect test subject. I've taken out the entire front suspension except for the upper A-arms and torsion bars and need to get those out this week. So far, PB Blaster, a MAPP torch and a Sawzall have all worked great for taking it apart.

[ljowdy]

Just any old store brand ATF will do, I can' remember if my friend said it was Mercon II or Dexron II but according to the article, ANY ATF works

[Steve@Rennsport]

Interesting subject,...

The very first thing I would tell anyone wishing to play "chemist" is to be VERY careful when handling solvents such as acetone by wearing neoprene gloves and working in a very well ventilated adea. These are very toxic chemicals and the long-term effects of exposure are cumulative.

Without question, the vast majority of effective penetrants are only sold to the auto repair trades and aviation shops; the consumer lineup of such products are largely a placebo by comparison.

I would recommend (in no order):

Zep penetrating oil
Kroil
Wurth Rost-Off


I would strongly recommend the above products as that ATF-acetone DIY mix might wind up costing you FAR more than .10/oz.

[ljowdy]

Steve,
I don't believe anyone will be "playing chemist"
That has already been done by members of the Machinists Workshop publication.

I will agree, Acetone has the ability to remove everything from fingernail polish to automotive paint but, anyone with a real stubborn nut/bolt and using reasonable precautions may benefit from the magazines analyzation of the penetrating oil products and the purported results and effectiveness.

[rw7810]

I agree with Steve on The wurth Rust-off. Did they try any other penetrants like Gibbs ??

[Mike Andrew]

I've had very good luck with Kroil but the odor is not one of my favorites.

[Netspeed]

Originally Posted by Steve @ Rennsport Systems

Interesting subject,...

The very first thing I would tell anyone wishing to play "chemist" is to be VERY careful when handling solvents such as acetone by wearing neoprene gloves and working in a very well ventilated adea. These are very toxic chemicals and the long-term effects of exposure are cumulative....

So THAT'S why women are the way they are after they do their nails!

[88911coupe]

Just used PB Blaster on some very rusted exhaust studs and did not break even one. I have a question though on really rusted nuts...when using these products should you use a wire brush and remove as much rust as possible before spraying? I was thinking the rust may help the PB Blaster or whatever adhere so I did not remove it and they all came off unbroken.

[Noel]

I''ve been using Kano -Kroil for years and have found that it works great.

[ChrisBennet]

Wow, I'm surprise Liquid Wrench did better than PB Blaster. (But nothing beats PB Blaster's smell for keeping my sweetheart out of the man cave/garage...)
-Chris

[Danny_Ocean]

Originally Posted by Mike Andrew

I've had very good luck with Kroil but the odor is not one of my favorites.

Kroil smells great! I use it as cologne. However, Gibbs Brand smells bad!

+1 for AeroKroil, but I will give the acetone/atf a shot next time.

[calling911]

Originally Posted by Danny_Ocean

Kroil smells great! I use it as cologne. However, Gibbs Brand smells bad!

+1 for AeroKroil, but I will give the acetone/atf a shot next time.

I hate it when I run out of liquidwench... now I have a solution! Now where is that acetone?

[David E. Clark]

I'm actually glad to see that Liquid Wrench works as well, or better, than the others since it is cheap and very easy to find. Since I'm bored this morning I looked it up on the internet. Who knew they made so many types!

[scottb]

A friend of mine in the aviation industry turned me on to Mouse Milk. http://www.mousemilk.com. It's incredible stuff and works very well.

[HawgRyder]

It might interest you that the Canadian Military uses a product from Crown #6030.
It works...does not smell too bad and is approved for aircraft.
Like any solvent based chemical. it will burn if subjected to fire, but if used correctly, a little will do the job.
Bob

[84_Carrera]

Personal experience, LW is garbage. WD40 is useless. I have been using PB for years, and still continue to.

FYI Steve, I did a side-by-side test on the Zep you sent me (thank you!) and PB, and I didn't notice an improvement over the PB. Perhaps the results varied with longer sitting, etc., but for my stuff, I just didn't see it.

I've used Berryman's B-12 Chemtool for degreasing, but I've noticed that it also make a great clean-out agent also. Must be the Acetone / Toluene / Methanol mix.

Seriously though, PB, clean w/ B-12 (watch the paint it WILL attack it quickly), re-apply with PB (repeat as required over 1-2 nights) and it's usually no broken studs. However, what I HAVE found on non-pcars is at the point you need to leave it soaking over multiple nights, the threads are usually gone on stuff like exhaust studs, etc., and you're better off planning a replacement anyway.

As always, YMMV.

Thanks for the info!

[Gunter]

Wench Liquid is good for penetration but for rusty nuts/bolts I recommend Liquid Wrench.
Another one I like is "Moovit" here in Canada.

[calling911]

Originally Posted by Gunter

Wench Liquid is good for penetration but for rusty nuts/bolts I recommend Liquid Wrench.
Another one I like is "Moovit" here in Canada.

Well at least someone gets my humor. Just like every man should have a good tool... should also have a good wench in a pinch.. thats what my grandaddy always told me

[PatrickB]

+1 on Kano Aero Kroil. I used it for many years while operating my former aircraft restoration business. This stuff was pure magic!!! I would soak what ever seized bolt, screw, or nut overnight. Next day it would turn as if you had just put it on!