AC Redo – Some Questions

[Ramp]

I've read through many AC threads and decided to take the plunge. I Just want a working AC without replacing everything. Thought was to remove, inspect, clean/flush, reinstall. Anything defective would be replaced. At the end, I’ll bring it to a shop for vacuum and charging.

I took everything out other than the hoses. Pics below.


I'm in the middle of repairing, cleaning, flushing, etc.

Here are some questions with Pics:

Rear Condenser: I flushed it with AC Pro - really nasty black fluid came out. Cleaned the exterior. No noticeable signs of damage. One row of fins is flattened tight. It would be very tedious to straighten. Would this really have a noticeable impact ? Or should I just leave it alone and reinstall ?





Front Evaporator: Flushed and cleaned. Looks like it’s in good condition. Should I replace it with the new Kuehl Evap or reuse. I plan on redoing the Evap box with new foam insulation as per other pelican Threads. The blower fan is in good working condition and has been cleaned and oiled. I will obviously install a new Expansion Valve as well – not sure where to find new tar. Any suggestions?





Compressor: Nippondenso. I cleaned it – Did NOT flush. No noticeable signs of leaks, clutch works fine, turns smoothly. I don’t think the compressor was the problem but not sure if I should drop the $ on a new one. But if the other components had dirty fluid, I’m sure the compressor does as well. If I can’t flush, how do I clean it out without taking it apart ? (Don’t want to do a rebuild)




Front Condenser: Here’s the old one. Replacing it with a new Kuehl.




Bonus:




Front Blower Motor: Motor was fried and had a mouse nest. Will replace the motor and fan.

[Arne2]

I did my 84 about 3 years ago. If you are converting to r134a, you should really go ahead and replace the hoses too, despite the advice that you will shortly get from "he-who-pollutes-all-a/c-threads-on-Pelican".

I ended up with new front condenser, new evaporator and new hoses at my first go around. My compressor failed later (nose seal leak), so now it is all less than 3 years old. Used it last week for the first time since last October, works fine.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Ramp

Front Blower Motor: Motor was fried and had a mouse nest. Will replace the motor and fan.

How do you know it was a mouse nest? You have read some old AC threads. You must know this debris could simply be from fines caused by reversing the gasses.

Seriously, nice leg/grunt work. A couple of goodies from GT will make a world of difference.

I am in northern Ohio. If there is ONE thing I could/would buy from Charlie it would be the whup ass evap blower. Now I know it may not be a game changer but if the cool air moves plenty, it makes a difference.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Arne2

despite the advice that you will shortly get from "he-who-pollutes-all-a/c-threads-on-Pelican".

He has been throttled. Trust me. He has been a delight since the the ultimatum was delivered to him. Straight forward sensible posts outside the AC realm.

If I am wrong, we only have minutes....................

[Marc Bixen]

Recommend replacing the original hoses, yes this part stinks, with new barrier hoses, don't forget the receiver drier. The more Kuel/Griffiths parts you can budget, the happier you'll be. Great stuff.

[Ramp]

Just don't have the time to replace the hoses - barring a leak. Just going to flush them well. New Dryer is in sitting in the box.

The immediate need to know is, assuming the rear condenser and original Evap are cleaned and not leaking, is it worth the $ to change ? I'm in NY and the top stays down most of the time but there are definitely times I need some cold air. I'm not looking for the best system, just a satisfactory one.

The front blower is put back together and is blowing strong. I don't think airflow into the cabin will be a problem so no need for a new motor.

Here's a better shot of the cleaned Evap and the burnt our front blower motor.

[Bob Kontak]

Don't change a thing. If your system is functioning correctly, and that is a challenge when you think about the age, the system is quite acceptable.

It will never kick ass, it will kick knee caps. In New York/Ohio it is quite adequate. Wimpy, yep. Inadequate, no.

Deep south guys see it differently because it is different. Ronnies930 posted a pic where his interior headliner was 400+ degrees with his car in the sun in Texas. Deep heat soak, everything. We don't have that. We might have 140-160F if parts are left to bake.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Ramp

Just don't have the time to replace the hoses

Not saying your time is not short but don't be saying you don't have time to replace the hoses.

You don't have to replace them. Perfectly ok.

However, the car is 33 years old. You got some big meeting you have to drive the car to? Like, you have an appointment that prohibits the weekend's worth of work required to change the hoses?

Drive your driver. Don't bull**** bull****ters. We know the difference between fact and fiction.

Just saying. Not judging.

[Ramp]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

Don't change a thing. If your system is functioning correctly, and that is a challenge when you think about the age, the system is quite acceptable.

It will never kick ass, it will kick knee caps. In New York/Ohio it is quite adequate. Wimpy, yep. Inadequate, no.

Deep south guys see it differently because it is different. Ronnies930 posted a pic where his interior headliner was 400+ degrees with his car in the sun in Texas. Deep heat soak, everything. We don't have that. We might have 140-160F if parts are left to bake.

Agreed. May/June through September I only need the AC rainy days, when stuck in traffic and on long rides where the wife wants the top up.

When I got the car, the system barely got "less warm", not really cool. I've thrown some cans at it over the last 2 summers and got barely something out of her. Put the AC on this winter's project list.

[Arne2]

With the original hoses in my '84, a fresh charge would bleed through the 30 year old hoses in the course of 6 months. I think not doing hoses now while you already have it apart is false economy. You will likely be charging it yearly. Similar thoughts on the 30 year old compressor. I figured mine would be fine, ended up having to replace it after a year and a half anyway.

The condensers and evaporator? They don't really age. No reason to do them. But hoses get old, and the compressor has moving parts. I'd do both of those now.

[Ramp]

Arne2 - thanks and I hear you - At least two of the hoses (to the rear condenser) have been replaced. I'll take a look at the others.

Here's a pic of the rear condenser hose - the part numbers are 91157315305 and 91157315003 - Seems to be barrier hose - Maybe I'll get lucky and find they all have been replaced.

Edit: Add this to the list: 911-573-152-03:: I can't see the numbers to the remaining hoses but the fittings all look identical - my guess is I just got lucky.

[Tippy]

Admire your dedication to making everything sound. I'd imagine you'll be rewarded with a nice AC system. If anything goes wrong, knowing every detail prior to reinstalling will lend to quick diagnosing and repair.

[DaveMcKenz]

Hi Ramp,
I'm not sure if you said whether you are using r134. If you are, you need compatible o-rings, oil, (probably ester) and service fittings. It sounds like 2 of the 5 hoses are newer, so you only need to change 3 more to have a complete refurb of the hoses and other components. With the items you have already disconnected, it should only be 3-4 hours on hoses.
Best of luck,
Dave

[78-911SC]

While the consensus seems to be replace all hoses can someone suggest the best hoses and a approximate cost for a full set of hoses. I think I remember somewhere that the new hoses are a smaller diameter. Can anyone confirm?

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

Deep south guys see it differently because it is different. Ronnies930 posted a pic where his interior headliner was 400+ degrees with his car in the sun in Texas. Deep heat soak, everything. We don't have that. We might have 140-160F if parts are left to bake.

Correct Bob (though might have been 450 degrees - will have to check pic ), butt you neglected to mention the pics of the passenger's seat (about 45 degrees), the headliner (lower 50s), and the center vents (27.8 degrees), when parked & idling in my mid 90s temp garage, following errand running the the hot sun, with the Mighty Meatlocker Turbo's, T-Rex a/c hammering away, Bro!!!

PS - should I post the pic of my "smuggler's box" treatment? Some folks might be Jonesing for a review!

[Ramp]

Originally Posted by DaveMcKenz

Hi Ramp,
I'm not sure if you said whether you are using r134. If you are, you need compatible o-rings, oil, (probably ester) and service fittings. It sounds like 2 of the 5 hoses are newer, so you only need to change 3 more to have a complete refurb of the hoses and other components. With the items you have already disconnected, it should only be 3-4 hours on hoses.
Best of luck,
Dave

Yes, I'll be running r134. I bought a box of the green nitrile O-rings. I confirmed last night that three hoses are barrier - the fittings on the remaining 2 look identical so chances are they have been replaced as well - I'll clean and confirm part numbers in the next day or so.

Thoughts on "cleaning out the compressor" ?? Can I run clean oil through it ? If so, which oil ?

[wayne robson]

Thank you Ramp, for all those clear photos great,project.
This is a photo off oil ,i purchased while back, i have not used it yet
going to soon ,supposed to be the correct for this,has the proper tip for filling,regards.

[Ramp]

Originally Posted by 78-911SC

While the consensus seems to be replace all hoses can someone suggest the best hoses and a approximate cost for a full set of hoses. I think I remember somewhere that the new hoses are a smaller diameter. Can anyone confirm?

Griffiths sells individual hoses as well as kits. So does our host.

https://griffiths.com/porsche/air-conditioning/911-930/barrier-hoses/porsche-911-ac-barrier-hoses/

[Ramp]

Originally Posted by wayne robson

This is a photo off oil ,i purchased while back, i have not used it yet
going to soon ,supposed to be the correct for this,has the proper tip for filling,regards.

Thanks - so, just fill the compressor with PAG oil, turn it over a bunch by hand, drain the oil, repeat until the oil comes out clean - kinda like a manual flush ?

[GH85Carrera]

If your compressor is the original 30+ year old unit I suspect you will get a few months of use out of it before the nose seal blows or the entire compressor gives up. They are not cheap, so it is a tough choice.

As for the hoses, if they have not been replaced, you can just pull them and take them to a local AC specialist shop and they will re-use the old ends and replace the rubber hose. That only works if the threads are in good shape.

I bought the dual condenser, new evaporator and hoses for my AC improvement. That was 10 years ago and it is the best thing I ever did for my 911. I can drive it on any hot day and be comfortable.

Good luck with your rebuild. It is rewarding to have decent AC.