A/C issues

[Sargepug]

I was wondering if any of the aftermarket refrigerant sealers / re-fillers, will work on my system. Also, what's a good way to test if the compressor is coming on, I think it is, but want to be sure.

i'm familiar w/ the fact, that even if my car was new, its A/C is a far cry from a modern system, but on those rare occasions where I have to have the top on and don't want wind noise, I'd like it to pump out cooler. I drove for 2 hrs other day on highway w/ windows open and had a dam headache after it! lol

[Discseven]

Sarge... I've not heard good things about refrigerant sealers. Believe premise is they inhibit efficient cooling---Kuehl should confirm or deny. To check compressor... turn key to ignition on and turn AC on and off... you should hear clutch engaging and disengaging---clicking.

[DRACO A5OG]

Don't use sealers on your system, it will clog up the condensers and evaporator. Locate the leaks and repair.

Open engine lid, set the temp setting to the lowest, turn on the car and ask a helper to turn the temp dial to the right slowly or highest while you what the clutch wheel, once it in engages, you will see the clutch engage.

I would take the time to get a temp reading at center vents while you are at it.

Are you using R12 or R134a? If R134a, try 80% of capacity to fill.

[Sargepug]

Thanks guys, I coincidentally had car into mechanic this am (not my Porsche specialist) for new set of BFG ZR Comp-2s. I had him go to rear and listen while I put it on, and sure enough compressor was working. He then checked the level under left fender and saw that the ball was low in the glass / needs to be filled up. Is that a good sign that ball was visable? Wouldn't leaks have evaporated it all and no ball can be seen? I believe it's charged w/ whatever came originally w/ the car, cause I have no records of it being changed over or recharged. The mechanic said he would have to look for that type of Freon, because it's basically illegal now and to get legal I have to convert system to the 134a. Again he's not my Porsche guy, just local Joe I go to for tires, and simple auto repairs. Does he sound correct, it's illegal, etc?

[DRACO A5OG]

R12, maybe in NYC, but it is not illegal, just need license to handle and dispose. Not cheap.

Note if OEM barrier hoses, they will leak. Apparentley was PAG intended design

[kuehl]

To test if the compressor clutch can engage you don't need to run the motor.

Open the engine lid, put down the windows:

Turn ignition key to the accessory position to the right, just before cranking position.

2 controls in your center console in front of the stick.
Turn right control (evap blwr mtr) to the right, to its first fan speed so things are not that noisy. Turn left control (thermostat) clockwise to the right until you hear a click of the compressor clutch pulley turning in. If you don't hear it leave the thermostat fully to the right. Turn off the ignition key. Locate the ac compressor pulley, there is a hub in front of the pulley closest to the rear bumper. It should turn somewhat freely. Now, go back on set ignition key in accessory position again. And, go back to the compressor's outer hub. If the clutch is engaging you won't be able to turn it easily because the clutch magnet pulled it into the hub.

As the boys said, stay away from leak sealants.

You can still use R12 however you gotta find someone whom has it and in the end it will be wasting your money until you fix ALL the leaks.

[Sargepug]

thanks all, but if I had serious leaks, would I still be able to see the ball in the sight glass? Maybe if I simply do a charge ever summer or so, i'll be fine. Top is off 90% of time in summer, so I really don't need too much from the system. Im hoping its a very slow leak or simply evaporation after so many years.

[kuehl]

I believe the way the old 'ball' site glass worked was the ball floated when the drier had a level of refrigerant that would raise the ball. If the ball is not floating, it is at the bottom of the circle, then you do not have adequate refrigerant.

Not having an adequate amount of refrigerant in the system while the compressor is operating can be detrimental to the compressor. The compressor gets its lubrication when a mixture of refrigerant gas and refrigerant oil flow through it.
If you don't have enough refrigerant you don't have enough oil flowing through the compressor and things wear down very quickly.

When compressor's 'wear down' they start tossing debris (metal particles) through out the system. The cost in time and material to fix the debris problem can add up to a substantial amount of money.

So, either fix the leak and properly charge the system or don't use it (unplug the compressor clutch wire).

[Sargepug]

Originally Posted by kuehl

I believe the way the old 'ball' site glass worked was the ball floated when the drier had a level of refrigerant that would raise the ball. If the ball is not floating, it is at the bottom of the circle, then you do not have adequate refrigerant.

Not having an adequate amount of refrigerant in the system while the compressor is operating can be detrimental to the compressor. The compressor gets its lubrication when a mixture of refrigerant gas and refrigerant oil flow through it.
If you don't have enough refrigerant you don't have enough oil flowing through the compressor and things wear down very quickly.

When compressor's 'wear down' they start tossing debris (metal particles) through out the system. The cost in time and material to fix the debris problem can add up to a substantial amount of money.

So, either fix the leak and properly charge the system or don't use it (unplug the compressor clutch wire).

Thanks for the great info!

[kuehl]

Originally Posted by Sargepug

Thanks for the great info!

Oh. I forgot.

We do not accept American Express.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Sargepug

The mechanic said he would have to look for that type of Freon, because it's basically illegal now and to get legal I have to convert system to the 134a.

There is one type of Freon. DuPont R12, Igloo. Freon is a generic term though.

It is not illegal by a long shot. It is a mild PITA to acquire and ONLY twice the price of individual cans at the local parts place if you buy through ebay. You will need to spend about $100 to re-juice your system. You also need to post here to find out how to do that.

If your system has ANY cooling power currently, you do not have a leak that is worth looking into.

If no cooling power. See kuehl's post.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by DRACO A5OG

Don't use sealers on your system, it will clog up the condensers and evaporator. Locate the leaks and repair.

+1

On a newer car that is worth $3,700, use an expensive sealer. The systems are more robust and can handle the degradation in performance and still keep you cool.

No on the older 911.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Sargepug

i'm familiar w/ the fact, that even if my car was new, its A/C is a far cry from a modern system

Where is wwest to bring up 1990's Lexus performance? They are awesome with a pound and a half of R-134A.

Yes, 84 911's are mediocre but if functioning properly in the NYC area they only kind of suck. You will not have sweat dripping off the tip of you nose.

I just wish there were more 911 peeps in my area. I could install kuehl equipment and be a hero. Two or three medium upgrades and a NYC driver would be golden.

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by Sargepug

i'm familiar w/ the fact, that even if my car was new, its A/C is a far cry from a modern system . . .

Just to add to the excellent observations from Brother Bobasaurous Kontak above, if one has the desire and determination to do so, the 911 a/c can be built to perform at or above modern car standards. I live in a hellish climate (super hot and humid for most of the year) and anyone that rides in my Mighty Meatlocker Turbo, sharts themselves at how high performance (read, ball freezingly colder than the coldest of cold) my home-built system is. And of course, if you don't want to take years of trial and error to become a semi-self-taught, mobile a/c tech, you can do the sensible thing and become Griff's (Kuehl) new bestest friend!

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

And of course, if you don't want to take years of trial and error to become a semi-self-taught, mobile a/c tech, you can do the sensible thing and become Griff's (Kuehl) new bestest friend!

Word, if I may steal a 1990's phrase.

Wayne, NJ is just a hop, skip and jump from NYC.