Update: BB2 is rolling again!

[KTL]

This brute certainly will put the welded Lindsey wheels to the test with those monster BFG's mounted on them. Then come the Hoosiers........... wow.

BTW, i'm not saying the welded wheels are bound to fail. I don't know diddly about welding and building wheels. Just saying that if these wheels can withstand the work they're going to see, the welded Lindsey wheel is not as questionable as some profess it to be???

Time will tell I guess.

[john_colasante]

Don,
A '97-'98 Carrera S used a spacer in the rear if ordered with 17" wheels. The spacer that Porsche used is the type that has it's own studs and you use two sets of lug nuts, one to bolt the spacer to the hub and then another set for the wheel. This factory spacer is about 25mm. So, even the factory used this kind of spacer on a purely stock car. Would it be banned from track events?

I guess I'm just trying to point out that things are not always as simple as they seem. A PCA safety tech guy sometimes thinks he knows more than the Porsche engineers.

[pbs911]

WOW! Tyson, you da man!

I can't imagine how well BBII is going to run since Tyson can set up his 72' cab to run as well as it does with 110 HP. And you thought you got a lot of grief at the last years event with the 3.6. Wait till they see the new and improved version roll onto the track!

[Jack Olsen]

Originally posted by KTL
This brute certainly will put the welded Lindsey wheels to the test with those monster BFG's mounted on them. Then come the Hoosiers........... wow.

BTW, i'm not saying the welded wheels are bound to fail. I don't know diddly about welding and building wheels. Just saying that if these wheels can withstand the work they're going to see, the welded Lindsey wheel is not as questionable as some profess it to be???

I think there's a legitimate concern about the two-piece Lindseys. (They also make a three-piece version.) Lindey had been running a heavier race car (a 951) than mine for about six years on a wide set, and haven't had any problems.

Then again, two cars is not a really statistically significant test. Plenty of the old Japanese-made cast Fuchs didn't break, but that doesn't mean they were safe wheels. Some guys can smoke two packs a day, run a supercharger with no internal mods or intercooler and have unprotected sex with their wive's sisters every Christmas, and never have a bad day in their life.

I'm going to continue to inspect these wheels over their lifespan.

If someone is extremely concerned about wheel strength, then I'd say go with a three-piece, and bite the bullet on leakage and the visible hardware. In my case, I'm willing to be a little more diligent with inspections (and to increase my risk very slightly) to go with the less-tested design.

Although it's also statistically insignificant, I've never heard of a two-piece wheel failing.

[arcsine]

How much of Black Beauty 1 is actually in the new car?

How about the nut behind the wheel?

But seriously, BB2 is looking great. We are all waiting to hear how she drives.

[atlporsche]

because I can't resist...

Anti squat/anti-dive/anti-lift comes about when you change the angularity of a suspesion arm in relation to the ground or flat plate.

By lowering the front mount in the front suspension (or raising the rear mount, which, on a porsche can't be done easily) you reduce the inclination of the front arm. This is more of an anti-lift/dive procedure. the rear still squats the same, but the front is resisting lift.

adding: Basically what it does is promote greater weight transfer but also results in a harsher ride.

sjd

[KTL]

Originally posted by JackOlsen
I think there's a legitimate concern about the two-piece Lindseys. (They also make a three-piece version.) Lindey had been running a heavier race car (a 951) than mine for about six years on a wide set, and haven't had any problems.

Then again, two cars is not a really statistically significant test. Plenty of the old Japanese-made cast Fuchs didn't break, but that doesn't mean they were safe wheels. Some guys can smoke two packs a day, run a supercharger with no internal mods or intercooler and have unprotected sex with their wive's sisters every Christmas, and never have a bad day in their life.

I'm going to continue to inspect these wheels over their lifespan.

If someone is extremely concerned about wheel strength, then I'd say go with a three-piece, and bite the bullet on leakage and the visible hardware. In my case, I'm willing to be a little more diligent with inspections (and to increase my risk very slightly) to go with the less-tested design.

Although it's also statistically insignificant, I've never heard of a two-piece wheel failing.

The above non-bolded sentence is hilarious. Sounds like one scary-ass redneck!!

Anyway..............

I hear ya Jack. I'm not disagreeing that the two piece wheel could be concern for track use. I don't want to seem like i'm singling you out. But, since yourself and Tyson are the only ones so far to use these Lindsey P2 wheels around here? You guys are the test mules!

I guess my question is where within the wheel will the failure appear?

The welds are not going to be the shortcoming are they? I would think the Corvette outer rim barrels would be the weakest link. I assume they are high-pressure cast rims. Still, the Fuchs centers are certainly not void of risk for failure:

Fuchs wheels cracking?

What gets me is what are weekend racers who don't have the luxury of forged Fuchs using? The serious and knowledgable racers that choose other makes of cars besides Porsche certainly aren't breaking wheels left and right. Forged wheels can't be the only "safe" wheel for racing. Certainly forged is better. But not the only answer.

Just as an aside for those who might not be aware, there are OEM/factory two piece wheels out there. Two piece wheels are not necessarily somebody's crazy idea. Examples that come to mind:



Don't get me wrong. Those Talon wheels are nothing out of the ordinary. Just a cast center welded into the cast outer rim. I whacked one of mine on a pothole at about 15-20 mph and dented it really good ( they were only a month old ). Still works though. But we're talking about a daily driver here.....

[Jack Olsen]

These are the tires that will test them.



But I'm months away from mounting these, still.

[Slider79SC]

HOLY CRAP!!!!!!! I want a set of those.......

[Eric Mckenna]

quote:
Somewhere right now, an Indycar crew member is scratching his head and saying "Where'd our tires go?"


__________________
Brian K.
'78 SC
ex '74 914 2.0 (and others)


HAHAHAAHAHAHA!HAHAHAAHHHAHAHAHA!
HAHAHA

That was great!!!

Eric

[k9handler]

Jack attempted to roll them down the brick walkway to take the picture, only to find them so sticky he could not roll them! Them babys are full of grip!!!

[speeder]

I saw Jack's new car on the ground today at TRE, still needs ride height/alignment set, but the overall look of the wheels/flares, proportion of both to coupe body, and just general 'attitude' of the car is among the best I have ever seen on a race or street car. It is just drop-dead beautiful. And an engineering marvel.

We will all be forgetting BB1 when this car fires up. Hate to say this because of the exalted place in Pelicanhood of BB1, but the new car is a major upgrade.

[Paul Thomas]

Jack,
I am curious if you ever considered cutting the entire front off of the old car and doing a 935 tube frame kinda thing in the front attatched to a cage extending to the rear?

Know that this question is solely based on pics and curiosity, not any kind of knowledge or experience with such an endevor.

Did you consider any options other than the obvious? ie: fix the old car or build a new car.

Paul

[Jack Olsen]

Originally posted by P-THOMAS
I am curious if you ever considered cutting the entire front off of the old car and doing a 935 tube frame kinda thing in the front attatched to a cage extending to the rear?

Not seriously. Schedule was one of the biggest considerations in coming up with a new scheme for a car. It had to be done in 12 weeks. So more than anything else, I wanted a plan that was straightforward in its execution -- no inventing on the fly, which has a way of bogging a project down. Even though there are a lot of guys making race cars, of one stripe or another, I've never heard of anyone banging them out in a timely and predictable manner.

So, the two seriously-considered plans were either to A) straighten the existing tub, but add a full welded cage that would tie into the major suspension points, or B) buy a straight, rust-free tub, and move the drivetrain into it, with just a bolt-in cage.

There were good arguments for each, but Plan B won out. Why? Well, we discovered evidence of previous collision repair on the existing tub, as well as some well-concealed rust that was discovered where the body was torn open. Also, the cost -- and time required -- for a full race cage was prohibitive.

Either path would have worked, but when I came upon a 72 tub in beautiful condition, it finally tipped me to that side of the fence.

[masraum]

Ktl/Kevin, the problem with the cast Fuchs isn't so much that they are cast, but that some of the companies who made them just copied the Fuchs exactly, so the center was the same thickness/shape/etc... as a Fuch rim. Since the repro wheels were cast not forged they should have had more metal added to compensate for the difference in strength.

Nothing (completely) against cast wheels since, basically, all of the wheels since the C2/C4 have been cast. The main thing that most of us have is that going from Fuchs to another wheel is generally a downgrade unless you pay tons for aftermarket forged.