guess i shoulda changed my cam chain pad

[Mukilteo911]

FRPorche, why, can you explain? I dont have it apart at the moment..
PShcaars951 is saying if the chain is broke (link removed) the it would slide right out, bam instant access to the variocam plates. If thats the case then remove the tensioner, replace plates put tensioner back in, thread new chain( thats had pin removed and link broke) connect ends with new pin, and done. What am i missing, seems pretty easy. check out this chain tool too. Posse Heavy Duty Chain Breaker

Ive worked hundreds of chains and never had one fail, seems like this process will work unless im missing something Im not seeing because ive never done it. Like some thing that prevents the chain from comming out once its seperated. But ive looked at all the images in the renlist thread and it looks like that chain should slide out, seems like the space is there.

and thanks everyone for this discussion, very helpful.

[bazar01]

Originally Posted by Mukilteo911

FRPorche, why, can you explain? I dont have it apart at the moment..
PShcaars951 is saying if the chain is broke (link removed) the it would slide right out, bam instant access to the variocam plates. If thats the case then remove the tensioner, replace plates put tensioner back in, thread new chain( thats had pin removed and link broke) connect ends with new pin, and done. What am i missing, seems pretty easy. check out this chain tool too. Posse Heavy Duty Chain Breaker

Ive worked hundreds of chains and never had one fail, seems like this process will work unless im missing something Im not seeing because ive never done it. Like some thing that prevents the chain from comming out once its seperated. But ive looked at all the images in the renlist thread and it looks like that chain should slide out, seems like the space is there.

and thanks everyone for this discussion, very helpful.

The chain is a simplex one (looks like a bicycle chain) and comes continuous and has no chain link connector. If you can find a connector of the same pitch, you can probably try to break it and use the connector to install it with the camshafts in place.
Personally, I wouldn't try it. The chain connector will be the weakest link with possibility of the sliding locks coming off. If it is a duplex or triplex chain, i would try the chain link connector, but for this simplex chain, I will not take the risk.

[ernie9944]

Originally Posted by FRporsche

Trust me, there is no way to change the chain without taking out the cams. If you ever look at the 16v head yourself, it would be clear. And there's no way to change the pads without taking the tensioner out from between the cams.

___+1

[QUOTE=bazar01;6150935]The chain is a simplex one (looks like a bicycle chain) and comes continuous and has no chain link connector.___ +1 thus the reason for removing the camshafts when changing the chain.PITA but thats the ways it is on a 16v head nothing simple.

[mhr]

Originally Posted by ernie9944

Rigth on John thats the one.Doing fine here had (Eric 951 -RL)spending a week vacation down here,after stuffing some lobster down is throat I took him for a spirit drive in the 968, lol didn't take long for that lobster to reach the lower parts even for a hard core 951 lover such has Eric.He even dare put both paws on my pristine dash going through some haipin curves.

Eric told me about the ride you gave him Sounds sick!!

Heading to the Maritimes later this week with the family. Sorry I won't be in your neck of the woods to say hello. Next time.

[Mukilteo911]

pins in chains push out and then back in again. its really not a big deal to push a pin 90% out then reconnect the link and push the pin back in. People do it all the time on timing chains, drive chains etc. The key is having the right tool and there are a lot of good ones out there. The method is that you push the pin out so that its still in one side and protruding inwards about 2mm. You then pull chain apart. Once your done and put chain back on, you use the tool (which clamps both sides of chain) and push the pin back in so that at each side you have equal amounts of pin on the outer part of the chain. Sometimes you have to push the pin back a few 100's to release tension. This is how they are made, friction fit, it wont come apart once that pins in the right place.

Since it seems like there is no obstruction in getting the chain of, looks like ill be the test pilot, maybe ill do a youtube video of it to show the process.

[pschaars951]

Mulilteo911: I would be interested in seeing that. I was under the impression the chain would have to be designed to have the links come apart and that it was a weaker design. I am well past that point now, but for educational purposes and future projects, please post your results!!

UPDATE ON CAM REMOVAL: I couldn't find good directions online for simply removing the cams. I started on the directions for the cam/head removal in the workshop manuals. And referring to pelican for very specific questions. Pulling everything apart has been 3 hours so far and I am a novice mechanic. Currently the air meter housing is still attached. The hex bolts head into the exhaust manifold are soaking in PB Blaster. But I have the injectors out and everything off the front down to the timing belt, which is pulled from the cam sprocket.

As for the injectors, one of them has a hairline crack. Never gave me problems, but I will replace it anyway. Is it a good idea to replace them all?

As for the cam sprocket, the workshop manual states, "Slacken central bolt while countering. Remove camshaft sprocket"

I take this to mean use a open end wrench on the hex nut to counter and use a cheesehead on the central bolt. Am I correct? Does anyone have sizes for the cheesehead or the hex nut. I am thinking 12 and 30, need to run to the auto parts store.

[FRporsche]

Correct. I think the cheesehead is 12. I use a crescent on the hex nut.

mukilteo911, go ahead, i'd love to see it.

[pschaars951]

the cheesehead turns out to be a 10. and it is stuck on there good. the bit I bought from NAPA is about 3 inches long, which then goes into a 13mm socket on my socket wrench. the whole system ends up having lots of play and it is hard to keep the bit in straight while applying a good amount of force. I was using an adjustable wrench on the hex nut which kept slipping off too. I am going to go buy a 30mm box end so that side will be as firm as I can get and I can try to focus on keeping the cheesehead bolt. I have applied PB blaster 3 times and the last time around I used a blow torch on the cam sprocket for 5 minutes before going for it. Still no luck, my assistant (dad) is losing interest in helping me. I guess I need to buy another six pack too.

Also, the workshop manuals say to take the cam belt off prior to all of this. I slid mine back on. In the process I have rotated the camshaft 15 degrees in either direction and would hate to bend valves on the exhaust side too. I had the foresight to put it back on before trying to remove the bolt.

for future posts, i made a journal thread you can find here: Broken Timing Chain - Repair Journal

[Mukilteo911]

Doing more research on the breaking and reconnecting of the chain, I emailed FIBI the maker and asked about this chain, to make sure reassembling it with the friction pin was ok. Ill let you know if they reply and what they have to say about breaking the chain. They ought to know and spare anyone any heartbreak about taking a shortcut on this procedure.