Please confirm this is the factory manual

[spiff]

Hi Folks,
Just got a factory manual on CD for the SC. Not sure if it's the manual or other supplements. Seems a bit sparse, doesn't even contain engine removal instructions.... Can someone confirm? Thanks in advance.

[cmonref]

Yup, it is. That's the first page of the third volume. Vols 1-2 began in 1965 and carry thru 1971. That's where you will find "engine removal", for instance. Vols 3-6 cover model years 72-83 and provide only new information -- after all, removing the engine is basically the same.

Vols 1-2 are 2-3 inches thick. Vols 3-6 re about 1-1/4" thick.

Vols 1-2 are broken up into sections ("E" for engine, for example). Vols 3-6 are organized by "code number" that matches your page above.

[Grady Clay]

Those are supplements to Vol I and II which you need.

Porsche updated Vol I until they came out with Vol II (they included a decal “I” for Vol I.) Vol I and II were updated through 1971. For the ’72 model there was an update of four thin binders that covered everything new with the 2.4, 915, 925 and much more. I think there eventually were six binders in addition to Vol I and II. They were continually updated with supplements through ’83? My six binders were too full and I added several more to thin things out.

I am a firm believer that DIY Porsche people need all the different manuals; Factory, Bentley, Haynes, Clymer and more. Each presents the material slightly differently. Seeing it from different perspectives allows you to better understand when you have only seen the part or whatever once.

Clearly the PET parts CD from out host is the best bargain around. Not only does it have all the part numbers but the exploded diagrams are invaluable to understanding the car.

Even having all the manuals won’t answer all questions. That is where Pelican is so valuable.

I am a proponent of everyone making their own car-specific manual. It could include copies of the relevant pages from all the manuals and PET. It could include printouts from Pelican and other on-line resources. You can photo document everything you do. It can even be a scrapbook for invoices, timing sheets from DEs, copes of registrations, titles, etc. Whatever you want. This is not something to do all at once but a continuing project. It will increase the value of your car when it is time to hand it over to the next “caretaker.”

Best,
Grady

[cmonref]

There are six binders in total. Vols 1 and 2 were changed with the additional of "Supplements" that added pages to the end of the affected section (no pages were changed or added WITHIN the sections--they were simply added at the end.) Vols 3-6 were organized into the 10 code numbers, and new information was incorporated INTO the sections.

Vols 1-2 cover 911's thru 1971. As the page above shows, Vols 3-6 cover "from model 1972 on". They stopped updating Vols 3-6 after the 1983 model year, and 1984+ Carerras are covered by new Vols.

Grady is right -- you need more than just the factory manuals. But the factory manuals are the ones to start with.

[Grady Clay]

Brian,

I think you are correct, there were only six binders – Vol I&II
and the four ’72 supplements. I added more binders so each
wasn’t so full. I have a total of 12 and section 9 (wiring
diagrams) needs to be split.

Each supplement contained both new pages and replacement
pages. Yes the new pages were typically added at the end of
a section but not always. The replacement pages called for
the removal of a prior page and its substitution with the
replacement page. I have several binders full of replaced pages.
Many times when adding replacement pages, I left the original
page in place and put a diagonal line and the annotation that
there was a replacement page. The Supplement Number
(Roman numerals) are printed on each new and replacement
page.

Here is the index page for Supplement XXXII-USA dated December, 1974. "
"
(C) Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche A.G.
I suppose it would be useful to make a summery of all the
supplements and a list of all the pages in a complete manual.

Best,
Grady

Edit to fix typo

[cmonref]

Grady,

Good idea about splitting the electrical section (#9) into multiple binders. I think I will do that.

Supplements for Vols 1 and 2 were always simply tacked onto the end of the affected secton. There was a single hard-paper divider, then a list of contents (which was always replaced with the next Supplement that affected that section), then new pages. Pages in the regular section were E-1 (engine section). The pages in the engine Supplements were numbered SE-1 and so on.

Supplements for Vols 3-6 were as you show and describe them.

[5speed]

I have a question about the early factory manuals. How can I tell if they have been updated with the supplemental pages? I don't know enough about the way Porsche updated and arranged the manuals. All I know is that for an SC you need vols 1,2,3,4,5,6 for complete information. I would like to have both the original and the updated pages, much like Grady has done. Is there any place that still sells the updates? Or anybody willing to share just the updates?

[Grady Clay]

Lee,

Here is Supplement XII dated March 1968 (was unopened,
still wrapped in plastic.) It consists of 87 pages – 11 pages
are replacement pages for existing pages and each has a
revision date on it (all either 12/67 or 3/68). The remaining
pages are added to the Supplement sub-section of each
section in the manual. They are not dated or otherwise
indicated that they are part of Supplement XII.

Some are in color.

I think the only way for anyone to insure they have all the
pages is to make a list of page numbers and revision date
(when listed) and check page-by-page.

Chuck Stoddard once made such a list. I used to have a copy.
“
"
© Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche A.G.

Best,
Grady

[5speed]

So there was an unofficial list out there somewhere. Anybody have a copy of the list that Grady mentioned?

Are the updates still available? I have no idea if I have current or old pages.

[LM3929]

sorry duplicate message

[LM3929]

Can you tell us where one could purchase a manual on CD?


Thanks

[Grady Clay]

I would like to know that also. I suspect this is a “bootleg” scan of the manuals. There are many with varying quality and completeness.

For many years we have lobbied Porsche to make the technical information widely available at a reasonable price. So far they only have offered the PET parts CD (about US$15) in compressed .pdf format to everyone. It is available from out host.

I would like to see Porsche have available on CD all the Workshop Manuals, the Service Information (Technik) booklets, the little Spec Books, the Owner’s Manuals, the Campaign and Service Bulletins, and much more. It should be in the editable .pdf format so individuals can copy & paste to their own car specific manuals. It should be able to be expanded and copied to your hard drive so it works fast. I think they should offer the PET program for about double the compressed .pdf version.

Why should Porsche AG and PCNA do this?

1) Good Will – they are spending the goodwill that Professor Porsche, Ferry Porsche and many others have earned over many years. This is an inexpensive way to recoup some of what has been lost.

2) Reputation in the industry – BMW has announced they will support every BMW motorcycle ever built. I understand they are headed to doing the same for every automobile. No manufacturer holds their customers hostage to technical information more than our beloved Porsche.

3) Good business sense – the more old Porsches that are successfully being driven, maintained, and exposed to potential buyers of Porsche automobiles, the more Porsche can sell cars. If they are looking to keep selling Cayennes and possibly 4-doors and more, the more they will need the “installed base” of Porsche enthusiasts.

4) Good business sense – with all the “old” 997s and earlier running about, the more parts can be sold. Porsche should free up the original specifications and license the re-manufacture of everything at reasonable prices. If they got 1’ on every part sold under license, they could greatly increase their net; income for no cost. If they were to continue their current greedy ways…guess what.

I think much of Porsche’s current philosophy is a direct result of having dug a big financial hole with the Cayenne. Many were predicting the demise of PAG when the development cost was known. I won’t fault Porsche for digging themselves out of that hole. Now it is time to earn back the lost goodwill.

Best,
Grady

[Grady Clay]

Who has 911 Workshop Manual Supplement cover pages?

I have a few, here are the pages included in them. From this we can reconstruct the sequence of additions to the ’65-‘’83 manual.

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual - XII,
March 1968
This supplement contains the following pages:
Index to Supplements for Group E
SE17 – SE26
Index to Supplements for Group R
SR17a
SR28a – SR28b
SR35 – SR138
SL1 – SL17
SM7
STD7 – STD12

Revised Pages:
E37 – E38
E97 – E98
SE3 – SE4
SF1 – SF3
S7 – S8
R75 – R76
R83 – R84
R87
SR21 – SR22
T17 – T22

Best,
Geady

[Grady Clay]

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual - XIII,
October 1968
This supplement contains the following pages:
E87 – E88
E93a – E93b
SE27 – SE31
SF7 – SF9
SS1 – SS9
SW1
ST7 – ST10
ST15 – ST20
STRA7 – STRA20
W13

Revised Pages:
SR33
STRA3 – STRA4

Best,
Grady

[Grady Clay]

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual - XIV,
October 1968
This supplement contains the following pages:
Index to Group B
B1 – B103
(Existing pages of Group B should be deleated.)

In addition:
2nd register for supplements to
Workshop Manual 911

Best,
Grady

[Grady Clay]

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual - XV,
April 1969
This supplement contains the following pages:
SS1 – SS42
SR17b
SR58a – SR58b
SR139 – SR158
SW3
ST21 – St27
S97a
Contents – Supplements to Group B
SB1 – SB28
Contents – Supplements to Group L
SL19 – SL33
SL37
SL45
SM9 – SM11
STD13 – STD30

Replacement sheets:
S13 – S14
S33 – S38
S47 – S48
Contents – Supplements to Group S
R53 – R56
R61 – R62
R83 – R87
Contents – Supplements to Group R
SR65 – SR68
SR81 – SR84
SR97 – SR98
SR101 – SR104
SR137 – SR138
Contents – Supplements to Group T
ST11 – ST14

Best,
Grady

[Grady Clay]

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual – XVI,
November 1969
This supplement contains the following pages:
SR28c – SR28k

Replacement sheets:
ST11

Best,
Grady

[Grady Clay]

Supplements to 911 Workshop Manual - XXX,
October 1974
Contents:
For volumes III and IV:
1 – 5.1-1/1 to 5.1-1/2
2 – 2.2-2/1 to 2.2-2/8
9 – 0.1-1/5 to 0.1-1/7
6.1-1/3
6.4-2/1

Revised Pages:
2 – 2.1-1/7 to 2.1-1/8
3 – 0.2-1/3 to 0.2-1/4
6 – 4.1-1/3 to 4.1-1/4
9 – 0.1-5/1


Best,
Grady

[rcecale]

Grady,

Sent you a PM but was told your mailbox was full.

Randy

[5speed]

Grady, thanks for putting together the info. I did not realize there were that many pages involved. I know that there is little if any logic to what order Porsche arranged these updates. It looks like you have updates 12-16 then jumps to 30. Did they just change the way they numbered the updates or were there actually 14 more updates?