Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
jay71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Evergreen, CO
Posts: 170
Powerflow Intake- pos?

I bought a Powerflow Intake from performance recently and I've noticed that the diameter of the opening of the airbox is too small so it's not getting a good seal on the air flow meter. (see photo) It's going to take some sanding or work with the dremel to enlarge the opening on the powerflow box to make it fit correctly. Before I tear into this p.o.s. and make it unreturnable I was wondering if anyone out there that has one can tell me if it really does make a difference (20 claimed HP) in the performance of the car? If not I'm going to make one of those lawnmower-looking air filters like Rarlyl8's and get my $400 back!

__________________
Jay
'86 930
'60 Land Rover Series II SWB
Old 02-23-2008, 03:26 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,525
Garage
Why do you think I made that air cleaner?
ImagineAuto is forever pissed at me for publicly ditzing that $400 piece of sh.., I mean plastic. K&N lays claim to the biggest automotive marketing hoax of all time in my book.
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 02-23-2008, 05:03 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Bayside Wi
Posts: 2,535
I hope this does not stir up a hornets nest, however when on a dyno with a Powerflow on my 930, the race shop ( C.S.Motorsports ) suggested putting the stock one back on which had a K&N filter. In the next dyno run he was able to tune for a few more HP. This car has SC cams,was ported to 36 mm intake,38MM exhaust w enlarged billett injector blocks,euro fuel delivery components, K29 Turbo, Andial fuel enrichment, B&B headers and Straght thru Muffler exiting on passenger side, Tial waste gate, Garretson intercooler. boost at 8.5 bar with electromotive HP 30 management maxium advance at 29degrees. Maybe it was just his tuning process but he did say with using the stock 930 air intake system on a street car it was hard to get a better result.

Last edited by voitureltd; 02-23-2008 at 06:27 PM..
Old 02-23-2008, 05:35 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
rsrmike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL
Posts: 538
Flip your stock airbox over and look at the little cone made into the inside. I'm not sure what it does but I bet it's there for a reason. It may do more than we think.

It's easy to compare the two airboxes in question and convince yourself the powerflow would have to be better.

Unfortunately I'd have to agree with my old boss who once said the only performance advantage you gain from this part is the weight reduction in your wallet.

Of course you can always hear your bypass valve queef better with the powerflow...

I'd recommend you try to send it back, personally Good luck

Last edited by rsrmike; 02-23-2008 at 06:09 PM..
Old 02-23-2008, 06:05 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,525
Garage
Quote:
Of course you can always hear your bypass valve queef better with the powerflow...
HAAAA! I haven't heard that term in years, thanks for the laugh.

On a serious note, the Powerflow is a nice looking unit that helps clean up the engine bay. I just wish they wouldn't try to sell it as a performance part. A fancy air filter is about the last place I'd go looking for power on a turbocharged engine.
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 02-23-2008, 08:45 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
resident samsquamch
 
sand_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cooterville, Cackalacky
Posts: 6,754
Quote:
Originally Posted by RarlyL8 View Post
HAAAA! I haven't heard that term in years, thanks for the laugh.
No doubt...that golden oldy had me rolling! I need to add that one to my list of words that must be used when dealing with the executive level management at work.

I'll try to post pictures of what intake I'm running on my car these days...let's just say I've gone back to stock with a simple twist.
__________________
-jeff
back in the saddle: '95 993 - just another black C2
*SOLD*: '87 930 GP White - heroin would have been a cheaper addiction...
"Ladies and Gentlemen, from Boston Massachusetts, we are Morphine, at your service..." - Mark Sandman (RIP)
Old 02-24-2008, 02:46 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
 
sudo apt-get purge 930
 
equality72521's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Brandon, FL
Posts: 4,840
I've always wondered why a company like Porsche who is obsessed with light weight would put such a beast of an intake on these cars unless they served a definite purpose. There HAS to be a reason for the design.
__________________
Mark 1979 930 Euro ***GONE AND DON'T MISS IT AT ALL***

"Worrying about depreciation on your car and keeping mileage down is like not ****ing your girlfriend so her next boyfriend finds her more appealing"
--clutch-monkey
Old 02-24-2008, 05:20 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #7 (permalink)
resident samsquamch
 
sand_man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Cooterville, Cackalacky
Posts: 6,754
Quote:
Originally Posted by sand_man View Post
No doubt...that golden oldy had me rolling! I need to add that one to my list of words that must be used when dealing with the executive level management at work.

I'll try to post pictures of what intake I'm running on my car these days...let's just say I've gone back to stock with a simple twist.
Pics as promised. Removing parts is one thing, but I hate cutting up OEM factory parts, so instead of drilling holes or busting out the cutting wheel, I noticed that the filter cover is actually hinged. So I just tapped out the hinge pin and removed it. I then used the cover clasp to hold one end of the filter and a large binder clip to hold the other side...it stays very tight. I removed the small air cleaner (ala RarlyL8 style) that I was running, because it made the engine compartment look a little too unfinished. In addition, many folks asked me what sized Holley 4-barrel I was running whenever they saw my exposed engine! LOL! Granted my access isn't as good, but that's okay, I like this.


__________________
-jeff
back in the saddle: '95 993 - just another black C2
*SOLD*: '87 930 GP White - heroin would have been a cheaper addiction...
"Ladies and Gentlemen, from Boston Massachusetts, we are Morphine, at your service..." - Mark Sandman (RIP)
Old 02-24-2008, 06:36 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #8 (permalink)
Macht Schnell
 
les_garten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 861
Quote:
Originally Posted by sand_man View Post
Pics as promised. Removing parts is one thing, but I hate cutting up OEM factory parts, so instead of drilling holes or busting out the cutting wheel, I noticed that the filter cover is actually hinged. So I just tapped out the hinge pin and removed it. I then used the cover clasp to hold one end of the filter and a large binder clip to hold the other side...it stays very tight. I removed the small air cleaner (ala RarlyL8 style) that I was running, because it made the engine compartment look a little too unfinished. In addition, many folks asked me what sized Holley 4-barrel I was running whenever they saw my exposed engine! LOL! Granted my access isn't as good, but that's okay, I like this.


And the Bartender said, BRILLIANT!
__________________
---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 02-24-2008, 06:46 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #9 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,525
Garage
This is a picture of my engine just after the rebuild, before it was installed. The funky filter cover was cut out leaving just the frame to hold the filter in place. It helped a little with access to other things.

__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 02-24-2008, 06:52 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Burlington, Wisconsin
Posts: 9,281
I encourage all of my customers to shy away from K&N filters if possible. they simply do not filter properly.. Be very careful.. I have seen many engine fail because of dirt coming through airfilters and allot in light avaition all using K&N
__________________
Ben

Current project 73 914-6 Gt project rusteration 2.4
914-6werkshop.com ,heat exchangers, oil tanks, etc
Old 02-24-2008, 07:08 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #11 (permalink)
A fellow Pelacanite
 
NathanUK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 2,002
Garage
Ben, do you think there is any possibility that my stock AFM could be damaged by using a K&N element in my 3.2 carrera?

TIA
__________________
1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 02-24-2008, 10:17 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #12 (permalink)
 
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Burlington, Wisconsin
Posts: 9,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanUK View Post
Ben, do you think there is any possibility that my stock AFM could be damaged by using a K&N element in my 3.2 carrera?

TIA
I am sure. I have no choice on my set up for filters but for stock 930 guys there is no way I would use anything but a paper element if I could
__________________
Ben

Current project 73 914-6 Gt project rusteration 2.4
914-6werkshop.com ,heat exchangers, oil tanks, etc
Old 02-24-2008, 12:18 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jay71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Evergreen, CO
Posts: 170
Thanks for the responses guys- guess I'll be sending the powerflow back to Performance.
__________________
Jay
'86 930
'60 Land Rover Series II SWB
Old 02-24-2008, 02:08 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #14 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,525
Garage
It takes one drop of oil to fry a hot wire detector. I would not use any oil soaked filters on an EFI engine.
As Ben stated the ability of those filters to restrict fine particles is in question as well. Extra flow does not come free, with more air flow per square inch comes more dirt.
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 02-24-2008, 02:12 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #15 (permalink)
Me like track days
 
Craig 930 RS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Kirkland, WA
Posts: 10,196
20 HP?

I've got your 20hp right here:


__________________
- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 02-24-2008, 03:14 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Burlington, Wisconsin
Posts: 9,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
20 HP?

I've got your 20hp right here:


That is awesome LOL! just like adding a chip and a muffler and a K&N will net you 50-60 HP on a NA car good luck with that.
__________________
Ben

Current project 73 914-6 Gt project rusteration 2.4
914-6werkshop.com ,heat exchangers, oil tanks, etc
Old 02-24-2008, 04:08 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #17 (permalink)
OFF THE BOOST PIPE NOW...
 
A930Rocket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Mount Pleasant, South Carolina
Posts: 7,360
The Venturi effect in addition to the turbo? OMG that's incredible idea!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
20 HP?

I've got your 20hp right here:


Old 02-24-2008, 05:00 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #18 (permalink)
Wo ist die Rennstrecke?
 
DonE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Brooks, GA
Posts: 1,211
I've been running a KN filter on mine for the last seven years. I've had the engine apart three times and have not seen any damage due to dirt being sucked in past the filter (including the turbo compressor blades). On the other hand, I maintain my filter at each oil change. I also have an EFI motor with a wire air intake sensor and don't think twice about oil getting on it - it would have to travel through the turbo and intercooler first which is highly unlikely.

I have also seen "performance shops" fab EFI intakes that place a KN filter in the rear fender well (behind the tire!), subject to road dirt and rain water. Although I have not had a problem with a KN filter, I would never subject it to that kind of treatment.

The high HP general aviation aircraft I work on don't use filters, however they are still approved for grass strips. If we think we will be at a lot of grass strips (air show work), we will install a KN type filter - and this is on a two-stage supercharged $125,000 motor.

PS : I think the powerflow is crap too. Take the saved money and put it in your suspension.

Last edited by DonE; 02-24-2008 at 05:09 PM..
Old 02-24-2008, 05:06 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #19 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,525
Garage
Good point about the turbo burning up the oil Don. I was thinking in general N/A terms of the 996/7 cars here in town that have had to replace their $400 MAF units due to oiled aftermarket filters. Porsche will not warrant their use and knows of the problem.
Actually for no more miles than many 930s put on and for the frequency of rebuilds some folks see, they might just as well run no filter at all! Ha!
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 02-24-2008, 05:46 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #20 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:22 AM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.