The Complete Engine Sealant Thread...

[304065]

Henry & Andrew, may I suggest that you guys find a way to work this out someplace besides this fine thread about engine sealants.

You both have passionate opinions, nothing wrong with that, but the tone of the thread has deteriorated.

Thread CLOSED.

[Wayne 962]

I have been asked to reopen this thread. I have done that, but deleted the annoying and non-useful posts. Let's keep this to a technical discussion, not a playground pissing match please.

-Wayne

[efhughes3]

Thank you Wayne

[WERK I]

Why not make it a "sticky" and close the thread? There's good information in here and will make it easy to find. Every conceivable question has been asked.

[CBRacerX]

Thanks Wayne! Now if you could figure out a way for me to edit the first post again I could keep it up to date

[911 tweaks]

someone please save me re readung 16 pgs here...I do not see a listing of what to use on the oil return tubes o-rings...my guess is to treat the o-ring material as it is = use dow corning 111 as used on case thru bolts o-rings...? is this correct...?
Also, any suggestions on what to use on valve cover gaskets to prevent them from leaking...? i realize many a valve cover is leaking due to it either being loose, or over torqued and/or the valve cover mating surface to the gasket is not flat...putting all of that aside, any insight into what may help the gasket NOT leak...? (I use the silicone bead lower gaskets which help but interested in what may be used = a goop, to add the the gasket to help prevent/minimize leaks)...
thx all & thx wayne for keeping this thread open...)) bob

[KTL]

I added my suggestions in bold below

Originally Posted by 911 tweaks

someone please save me re readung 16 pgs here...I do not see a listing of what to use on the oil return tubes o-rings...my guess is to treat the o-ring material as it is = use dow corning 111 as used on case thru bolts o-rings...? is this correct...?

Yep that stuff is just fine. I'll send you a small packet of it for free if you'd like. Or go to NAPA, AutoZone, etc. and get a tube of Sil-Glyde. Silicone paste works great.

Also, any suggestions on what to use on valve cover gaskets to prevent them from leaking...? i realize many a valve cover is leaking due to it either being loose, or over torqued and/or the valve cover mating surface to the gasket is not flat...putting all of that aside, any insight into what may help the gasket NOT leak...?

Try to clean up the cam housing surface with a fresh razor blade. Pull it across the surface vertically. Don't lay the blade down to scrape or it usually will gouge the surface.

Best thing to do honestly is install the gaskets dry. Have your valve covers surfaced by your local machine shop. They'll put them on the grinder table and make them flat again for you. Then with fresh valve cover surfaces you'll have no need to use any goop or the silicone bead gaskets.

[Henry Schmidt]

Originally Posted by 911 tweaks

someone please save me re readung 16 pgs here...I do not see a listing of what to use on the oil return tubes o-rings...my guess is to treat the o-ring material as it is = use dow corning 111 as used on case thru bolts o-rings...? is this correct...?
Also, any suggestions on what to use on valve cover gaskets to prevent them from leaking...? i realize many a valve cover is leaking due to it either being loose, or over torqued and/or the valve cover mating surface to the gasket is not flat...putting all of that aside, any insight into what may help the gasket NOT leak...? (I use the silicone bead lower gaskets which help but interested in what may be used = a goop, to add the the gasket to help prevent/minimize leaks)...
thx all & thx wayne for keeping this thread open...)) bob

The best product we (old dogs) have found so far for oil return tubes and joint ring o-rings is Dow 55 o-ring lubricant but Dow 111 should be a reasonable substitute..
It has special properties that enhance crush resistance and after installation and heat, swells the o-ring to enhance sealing. Petroleum products tend to create a issue called wicking that actually helps oil bypass the seal.

Valve covers are a different issue altogether. Flat sealing surfaces are key. Even turbo valve covers will get warped over time. Wrightwood racing offers a green lower cover that is treated with a sealant (unknown) that really works with problematic lower valve covers. One caveat: the glue that helps them seal makes removing the cover a tedious endeavor. For fresh rebuilds where a valve adjustment will be needed soon, I use the Wrightwood Racing lower valve cover gaskets with a silicon bead.

[911 tweaks]

perfect...!!
thx kevin & herny for the info... )))
all set kevin for the sample of goop...= I have these materials in the shop...
carry on...have a great day...
bob

[Lapkritis]

...or go with the Hargett billet covers that our host sells and never mess with sandwich gaskets, crush washers and warping covers ever again. Ever.

Pelican Parts - European Automotive Parts and Accessories - Porsche • BMW • Mercedes • Volkswagen • Audi • Saab • Volvo • MINI

[Henry Schmidt]

Hargett Precision makes a very nice product. The problem is that some Porsche owners are looking for authenticity and they don't look very original.
To combat some of this, we worked directly with Mark @ Hargett Precision to produce a slightly more period correct version. We are pleased with the overall results.

[ertech]

Hi guys
What's you take on rsr rocker shaft seals?
Some people say to put them on dry and torque a little more than speck.

What do you Guys do?
Thanks
Erick

[Lapkritis]

Light coating of krytox on far end receiving hole. Light coating of same grease on trailing o-ring in assembly process. This ensures the o-ring is lubed without contaminating the surface of the rocker that requires oil film.

Tighten following Bruce Anderson method.

[ertech]

What is Bruce Anderson's method?
Thanks

[safe]

Originally Posted by ertech

Hi guys
What's you take on rsr rocker shaft seals?
Some people say to put them on dry and torque a little more than speck.

What do you Guys do?
Thanks
Erick

Leave them out, crazy expensive and almost impossible to fit without damaging them.
You would need to slightly chamfer each shaft bore not to slice the seals.

[Jcslocum]

The seals themselves cost about $2.25 each. I'm installing them on my 3.4 build. I want to eliminate all possible leaks/weeps of oil on engine. When I disassembled the engine there was lots of caked up grime and oil on the outside of this area of the cam towers. We are trying to make sure these little mess makers are eliminated.

[Henry Schmidt]

Originally Posted by ertech

Hi guys
What's you take on rsr rocker shaft seals?
Some people say to put them on dry and torque a little more than speck.

What do you Guys do?
Thanks
Erick

If the cam towers are in good shape RSR seals are not necessary. That said, they don't hurt.
Lube the o-ring with your favorite lube (my preference is well documented and proven) and tighten to 180 inch pounds. It generally takes two allen tools for this (we have special tools for this). If the cam tower is still in good shape this should suffice. Once the 180 inch/lb mark is reach, try turning the shaft with just one wrench. If the shaft rotates there is a chance that the rocker shaft was overtightened by a previous "expert" so the bore is now enlarged. At this point you can tighten the shaft until it stops rotating or replace the cam tower.

[Lapkritis]

Originally Posted by ertech

What is Bruce Anderson's method?
Thanks

Tighten to spec, then turn with one wrench ensuring the opposite end is stationary.

[Henry Schmidt]

The rocker shafts at rest measure about 17.97mm.
Fully tightened they grow to just over 18.16 mm
The difference between conical ends can be as much as .09mm depending on manufacturer.
By tightening the bolt from 160 in/lb to 180 in/lb you get an increase of about .025 mm. It';s not a lot but sometimes it's enough.
I have seen cam housings expanded so far that no amount of torque would set the shaft.

[ertech]

Hi guys
Need a little clarification for what to do for
1-For Intermediate Shaft Cover WITH ORING
2-breather cover ( with or without gasket)
3-turbo injection blocks
Thanks