Amazon plane crash

[Sunroof]

When I was in the Air Force (1966-1970) I was an Air Freight Specialist and loaded hundreds of aircraft mostly the ones referred to that Glen's father flew (C-124, C-123, C-54, C-47, C-130, etc) at Travis AFB and Vietnam. The Load Masters or Crew Chiefs were careful on freight balance as each pallet of freight that was bagged and netted varied. The locking systems were very stable and effective when installed (nothing on most C-47s or C-54's). I wondered if this 767 went down due to a sudden cargo shift.

Bob
73.5T

[rattlsnak]

Originally Posted by Sunroof

I wondered if this 767 went down due to a sudden cargo shift.

Bob
73.5T

Thats the least likely thing, but cant say it wasnt for sure, but I mentioned earlier, these planes are freighters and have a huge Rigid Forward Cargo wall in the front. There is no where for cargo to shift forward enough to cause that.

Let me rephrase that and say I would be very surprised if that whats caused it. It would have to be special circumstances, like it only had one huge pallet in the center and it broke free, and then the wall failed, etc, etc..

[unclebilly]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

How far does a 5 ton piece of equipment need to roll B4 the CG is so far off the elevators no longer can force the nose up?
I am thinking 5 tons moved 15 to 20 feet fwd would pretty much do the job? maybe less .?

Based on early reports of floating debris including woman’s clothing, amazon boxes, etc, I don’t think this plane was carrying a 5 ton piece of equipment.

[911_Dude]

The plane was most likely completely filled with "cans" of Amazon boxes.Load shift unlikely. The demand for air cargo is way over capacity world wide. Empties are rare.

[flipper35]

Elevator bell crank shear bolts. My guess.

The 747 that crashed in the video above, the cargo shifted aft. A CG too far aft does not allow the pilot to recover. I don't see how this is cargo shifting around, unless it caught fire, smoke in the cockpit or some other strange happening.

The Cessna 414 that just crashed came apart mid-air.

[rattlsnak]

They found the FDR today so hopefully we find out something soon.

[Jolly Amaranto]

I heard it was the voice recorder.

[rattlsnak]

Yes.. hope they find the FDR soon. Lot of people in the industry wondering what the heck happened..

[rattlsnak]

They found the FDR today..

[unclebilly]

Great news. I wonder how long before we find out what went wrong.

[flipper35]

I suspect a preliminary report could be soon, otherwise I would guess a year or two for the final report.

[red-beard]

https://www.click2houston.com/news/black-box-indicates-loss-of-control-before-trinity-bay-plane-crash-ntsb-says

WASHINGTON - An initial review of the black box recovered at the scene of last month’s plane crash into Trinity Bay indicates a loss of control of the aircraft just before the crash, officials at the National Transportation Safety Board said Tuesday.
Atlas Air Flight 3591, which was being operated on behalf of Amazon, crashed Feb. 23 into the waters off Anahuac, Texas.

NTSB investigators said both the cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder were recovered at the crash site over the weekend. An initial review of the data revealed the quality of the audio is poor, and there are times when it is difficult to make out what the crew is saying. However, crew communications indicate a loss of control of the plane about 18 seconds before the recording ends.

About 350 data points that were recorded by the black box detail the motion of the aircraft and the operation of its engines, flight controls and other systems, according to NTSB investigators.
An analysis of the devices continues and a summary of the data is expected to be provided in a few days, NTSB investigators said.

All three people aboard the twin-engine Boeing 767 were killed when the plane plunged into the water about 40 miles southeast of its destination at George Bush Intercontinental Airport.

[KNS]

I feel bad for the Mesa Airlines pilot (well, I feel terrible for all three). He was simply Jump-seating (hitching a ride).

[seafeye]

The Atlas jumpseater who lost his life on Flight 3591 had just been hired by and had already been assigned his class date with United.

UA left his seat vacant during his Indoc class and presented wings and epaulets to his widow. Hats off for an awesome gesture of kindness, respect, and utmost class"

#thepilotwifelife #respect #makekindnessviral

[red-beard]

Here is the Warehouse full of debris

https://www.click2houston.com/news/inside-look-debris-from-deadly-cargo-plane-crash-held-in-warehouse?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=snd&utm_content=kprc2&fbclid=IwAR1GP4BrclyGGV2LUQHLUmC5JTHAImr62_FajMaUp kpoJwfessfFDDpDSuo

[dafischer]

I saw a brief bit on ABC World News last night that said that the throttles were advanced to Full, and the controls were set to a 49 deg. down angle. They didn't speculate what happened, or what (or who) caused this.

[pavulon]

Other than attempted stall recovery or suicide, are there other reasons for a (crashed) aircraft on approach to land to be at full throttle?

[stevej37]

Not trying to downplay this tragedy....but some humor might be needed.

[Jolly Amaranto]

In the Houston Chronicle today:

Turbulence could be to blame in the deadly Atlas Air cargo plane crash last month near Anahuac, a new report finds.

An analysis of Atlas Air Flight 3591's flight data recorder by the National Transportation Safety Board shows that the Boeing 767 experienced "small vertical accelerations" similar to what planes experience during turbulence shortly before it began to plunge into Trinity Bay around noon on Feb. 23.

The plane was en route to Bush Intercontinental Airport when it diverted around a small storm system east of Houston, according to the NTSB. During that route, the plane gradually descended to 6,200 feet, similar to a plane's final descent to land, before shortly climbing up to 6,300 feet.
Seconds later, the plane's engines were turned up to maximum thrust. The plane pitched slightly upward before turning downward at a 49 degree angle, almost doubling its speed to 430 knots as it plummeted to the ground.

The plane pitched up during its descent, but it never fully recovered. Security video from a nearby Chambers County Sheriff's Office facility captured the plane's final moments as it crashed into Trinity Bay, sending a plume of water, mud and debris high into the air.

[Sooner or later]

US grounded them immediately