buying a used car "reconditioning fee," WTF?

[red-beard]

buying a used car reconditioning fee = PROFIT!

Step 1 - Collect customers
Step 2 - ???
Step 3 - Profit

Get it?

[Scott Douglas]

On the point of monthly payments...When we traded in our Pontiac Transport (remember those?) on a CPO Honda Odyssey it was kind of funny how the negotiations went. I knew what I wanted for our van. I was willing to pay the advertised price of the Honda. The salesman, whom we'd bought our Accord from too, kept coming back from the manager's office and started talking with...Your monthly payment will be...
We finally got him on track when we threatened to walk out do to a pending dinner engagement.
All I wanted to know was how much were they going to give me for my van. We were paying for the Honda with a check so no payments involved.
Once he understood that, things went great.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by aschen

I needed a shower the last time I bought a used car from a dealership. I see why Carmax gers away with overcharging since they don't pull much of this crap.

It was one of those mega dealerships along i45 near clearlake. A couple year old forester with 25k miles on it advertised for 26k was about 32-33k new.

Walked in, drove it and said I would be happy to buy it for advertised price. Things went downhill fast. Guy comes out with an itemized invoice for literally more than the new price. So many absurd fees. Got a bit heated with the guy over how exactly they recondition a 25k mile single owner car. I should have just left but ended up in hours of arguments to come down to the price they had listed on the internet.

It was the only highly optioned forester in the right color and mileage that my wife wanted in Houston area. I felt bad about giving them any of my money.

few years later bought my focus st at planet ford. They had a big sale advertised when ford said they were no longer selling them. IN and out no problem, paid cash price they had listed which was 25% off MSRP.

I think dealers are fighting back in the age of internet info. Since I am trying to never finance another car in my lifetime i think I wll stick to cash purchases of private owner cars.

We did buy our minivan from carmax. Completely pain free and pleasant process. THough I am sure we paid 1500$ more than we should have.

Exactly. We purchased a car from Carmax about 20 years ago. It was quick and painless. No idea if I over paid or not, but it was a great car for what it was and I didn't feel like I'd been robbed or bent over. A few years ago, we helped my son buy a car (legwork, not financial) and because he was super strapped for time, we found a decent car at Carmax that he purchased. We probably paid a little more, but it was a good car at a decent price and we were in and out in a few hours.

Buying cars from dealers usually just sucks. I did get my Boxster from a dealer in Dallas. The process was, at least, smooth, and customer services was excellent. I probably paid a little premium, but then it is a special edition and was super low miles at 6 years old and CPO. Again, I didn't feel like I'd been robbed or screwed, so I think it worked out OK.

I actually think we ended up getting a good deal at this place, but I hate having to deal with the crap. Give me what I want at a fair price, and I'll be in and out with minimal fuss. That's what I really want.

I Over the years I/we've bought a few cars at much smaller lots, and those experiences have been better. Maybe the small guys are less slick or don't have time or can't get away with the same shenanigans as the big guys.

[Scott Douglas]

When we bought an '02 Accord way back in '02, I knew exactly what I wanted. V-6, EX-L four door, white over tan.
When the local dealer said he had just what I was looking for he was right. I actually drove it when it had 0.5 miles on it. Told him I wouldn't accept it if it had over 3 miles showing when I came to get it the next day. I knew they were going to drive it some to fill up the tank so I gave them that.
Traded it in on my present Accord, which is another story in and of itself.

[matthewb0051]

Originally Posted by masraum

Maybe the small guys are less slick or don't have time or can't get away with the same shenanigans as the big guys.

Probably right. When I was just out of the Army and going to law school in the late 90's we got a few cars from 'buy here, pay here' lots.

Traded a great '88 Mercedes 190e 2.6 plus $100 for a BMW 635Csi
then a few years later traded that 635Csi plus about $4k to get a BMW '88 M3

There didn't seem to be any tricks or scams. Just simple car trades.

Back to my 996 saga. I waited for about 2 weeks for the dealer to 'get it up to their standards' before I picked it up. The day I went it still wasn't ready AND they had done some things I specifically told them to not address like returning the side marker lights to US spec. But the real problem was they didn't check the hydraulic rams that operate the soft top. A few weeks later I found one leaking and luckily found a guy that makes replacements or reconditions them. Price was good, about $700, IIRC. But the programing cost was pretty painful.
All I wanted to do was break contact with the dealer. I didn't even bother to let them know or ask them to pay. That's just how painful the buying experience had been.

[matthewb0051]

Originally Posted by Scott Douglas

Told him I wouldn't accept it if it had over 3 miles showing when I came to get it the next day. I knew they were going to drive it some

I have a relative that owned a Ford dealership in a very small town. Somehow they got 2, yes 2, generation 2 Ford GTs for sale a few years ago when they were new. One car they got for being the best dealership in the market size. The other they literally won some Ford lottery for.

Anyway, the buyer of one of the GTs told my cousin not to start it at all. He was instructed to push it off the transport and into storage building. When the next transport arrived, he was instructed to not start it and push it onto the transport.

Pretty sure they got about $100k over MSRP each on those cars, so it was worth it.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by matthewb0051

I have a relative that owned a Ford dealership in a very small town. Somehow they got 2, yes 2, generation 2 Ford GTs for sale a few years ago when they were new. One car they got for being the best dealership in the market size. The other they literally won some Ford lottery for.

Anyway, the buyer of one of the GTs told my cousin not to start it at all. He was instructed to push it off the transport and into storage building. When the next transport arrived, he was instructed to not start it and push it onto the transport.

Pretty sure they got about $100k over MSRP each on those cars, so it was worth it.

Wow, obviously an "investor." Very, very sad. Those cars should be driven. I guess it's a way for them to be nicely preserved, and maybe someone down the road will drive it.

[RWebb]

a title fee with profit has been enshrined into law in Oregon - it's only $40 in profit but still a lobbyist's dream

but none of this is as damaging to the consumer as dealers running their own "mandatory" service items which greatly exceed the manf.s spec.

[berettafan]

Originally Posted by matthewb0051

Good luck with that. The dealerships have now taken over Craigslist, after having fully taken over Ebay too.

yep. been searching for a car for my son and private owner sales are almost impossible to find. scammers have just recently ruined FB marketplace as well.

[Scott Douglas]

Now days I think private owners just punt and take it to Car Max if they're available. They make it so easy and offer reasonable prices too IMO.
We've sold two cars to them in the past. First was our Honda Odyssey. I looked up Kelly Blue book and did some figuring based on the condition of the van. When my wife said she was done with driving a minivan I took it straight to Car Max. Before leaving she asked what I was going to accept for it. Told her my price and she's all 'You'll NEVER get that much for it'.
I called her from Car Max asking her to come get me. She was about to head to the movies with the kids and their cousin's. Should have seen her jaw drop when I handed her the check for my exact price.
The next car we sold to them was actually the car that replaced the Honda Ody, an '85 Mustang convertible that my wife said she really wanted. In the end it turned into the biggest POS I've ever owned as a familyman. She never once put the top down on her own and wouldn't ride with any windows up and the top down, like you'd do on a nice clear winter day with the heater on full.
Got a good price for it too, thankfully.
My daughter sold her Accord to them before leaving to move to Japan. I would have bought that car from her if it'd been a V-6. Son-in-law sold his Ford pickup too. No hassles, take the money and run.

[jcommin]

Added fees are a code word for profit. I'm ok if the dealer makes a profit but don't tank the price of a vehicle and then add on stuff to improve the profit.

I bought a new car last year and negotiated the sale price. I knew the DOC fee, taxes and title transfer costs. I had my own financing. I get the invoice and as I am reviewing the costs and I see a charge of $300 for nitrogen in the tires. I went in orbit. My first response was take it out and put air in tires. I almost walked - which is something you should always be prepared to do. After a discussion with the manager we agreed on the price. After that discussion, there was no talk of upsell, payment buying or anything else.

[asphaltgambler]

Fee's are known as 'packs' to the insider's.

[911 Rod]

I've been charged an administration fee before. Total BS.
I wanted to buy another 4Runner and my wife wanted me to give others a chance.
I went to dealers and asked them how their product compared to the Toyota.
They all came up with crazy stories about how bad the 4Runner was that made me want to cry

[Scott Douglas]

$300 for nitrogen, that's a rich one.

Yeah, when that Honda dealer said everyone who walks on the lot has $800 of your money, I thought to myself, I walk onto a lot of lots just to look at the cars. What the he!! kind of place is this?

I'm all for the dealer making a profit. They have to make a living too. But just so they do it in a more upfront manner. I always try to work from the invoice price, not the msrp, and yes, I know there are all kinds of paybacks after the sale for advertising etc. but those are between the dealer and Mfg'r, not me and the dealer.

[GH85Carrera]

One of the couple friends we know live out of state. The wife of the couple's mother died, and had a very nice low mileage Accord. The husband had no practical way to get it home to sell it, and they did not want the car. We went to AutoMAX and handed them the paperwork of the title with no lien, and the power of attorney letter he had. They offered a nice price, and it was processed and we were out the door in short order. I had zero interest in selling it for them and dealing with the hassle of selling a car. It was a great deal for everyone.

[onewhippedpuppy]

Sorry guys but if you sell your car to Carmax you got ripped off. If you buy a car from Carmax you got ripped off. They do the same BS, they just do it in a less smarmy way. Same auction cars for the most part, limited inspection or reconditioning. They just have less annoying sales people, better marketing, and a less annoying sales model. They are very convenient but don’t kid yourself into thinking they are fair.

One great approach when buying a later model new or used car is to figure out exactly what you want then call around the area to every dealership that has it. Ask for their no BS out the door price in writing, tell them you’ll buy from whomever offers you the best price. Probably half won’t respond because they are the really slimy ones, but you’ll get legitimate offers that will likely be competitive. I’ve had two very pleasant buying experiences following this model.

[Scott Douglas]

What is really nice about Car Max is their offer is good for a week.
So, if you're thinking of trading your car in, take it there first and get their offer.
When we bought our CR-V, the manager asked if we were trading in my Accord. My wife asked how much will you give us for it? Manager said $X, and my wife quickly says 'Sorry, he just got an offer from Car Max for $2k more than that.'
The manager was disheartened to say the least as she really wanted that car on her lot, not in my garage.

[Scott Douglas]

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy

Sorry guys but if you sell your car to Carmax you got ripped off. If you buy a car from Carmax you got ripped off. They do the same BS, they just do it in a less smarmy way. Same auction cars for the most part, limited inspection or reconditioning. They just have less annoying sales people, better marketing, and a less annoying sales model. They are very convenient but don’t kid yourself into thinking they are fair.

One great approach when buying a later model new or used car is to figure out exactly what you want then call around the area to every dealership that has it. Ask for their no BS out the door price in writing, tell them you’ll buy from whomever offers you the best price. Probably half won’t respond because they are the really slimy ones, but you’ll get legitimate offers that will likely be competitive. I’ve had two very pleasant buying experiences following this model.

Sorry Matt, I have to disagree.
If I can sit down with my knowledge of cars and figure out a price that they are going to offer me for my car, I don't think I got ripped off.
Same as when I traded in our Transport. I knew what I wanted and I told my wife how much they would ask for it once it was on their lot. I got what I wanted for it and was within $100 of their asking price when it hit their lot 2 days after we completed our deal.

[flipper35]

When we bought our used minivan back in June the dealership was almost 4 hours away but it was hard to find the one we wanted in an actual color.

It actually went pretty well and the had a couple things to fix so they delivered it to us. They even gave us better financing than our credit union would give us. Though the CU is now saying they can do .5% better. We told them what we were willing to pay though and we specified the loan length and told them what we had available to us.

A friend of mine went to a dealer when he was pretty young looking at some VW Golf GTI, Acura Integra and so on. The first one he went to they wouldn't even let him test drive a car. On his way home he stopped back at that dealership with his new Integra. It was a 5 speed and black with gold trim instead of chrome.

[red-beard]

In upstate New York, the Credit Union offered a service for buying a car. I think it was contracted out, but what ever.

I wanted a Honda Accord. LX level. Color not too important, but not RED.

I ended up with a "Sandlewood Brown", which looked like a slightly reddish tinted silver metallic. Price was very good and the loan was handled by the Credit Union. Drove the CRAP outta that car. I think it had 275K on the clock when I let it go.

Least hassle ever buying a car.

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