Should people be forced to take the vaccine?

[brainz01]

It is different. Kid's don't have natural immunity to those diseases.

In the case of those diseases, I agree that it makes sense for all kids to be vaccinated, and I had my kids vaccinated for the same (didn't care whether it was required or not).

But as the parent of vaccinated kids, I don't personally care if other parents don't want to vaccinate their kids.

Vaccines are not totally risk free. One should be given the freedom of choice. The odds of my kids dying or being injured from COVID is really low. Would I prefer my 74 year old mom be vaccinated? Yes, but it's her choice.

Forcing action on the population otherwise becomes a very slippery slope.

Masks forever?
Why even bother reopening bars and restaurants?
Ban alcohol consumption?
Ban [food of choice: sugar, bacon, cola...]

It's a risky world out there.

[cabmandone]

Nope.

[Tidybuoy]

I think "forced" is when you hold someone down and stick them with the needle.

In this case, I would say that an employer has a right to require someone to be vaccinated before hiring. In this case, she was already hired so too bad for the employer but any future hires could have that requirement.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by brainz01

Forcing action on the population otherwise becomes a very slippery slope.

Masks forever?
Why even bother reopening bars and restaurants?
Ban alcohol consumption?
Ban [food of choice: sugar, bacon, cola...]

It's a risky world out there.

Nobody's talking about forcing action on the population, it's an employer making a decision about running his business- so you can take your tinfoil helmet off.

[PorscheGAL]

In this case: I wonder if some of the issue is she informed her relatively new employer that she would not get the vaccine because she was trying to get pregnant? Maybe they saw this as a way to remove her from the payroll before she needed accommodations for being pregnant or maternity leave.

[red-beard]

How can an employer require this, when the vaccine is not available to anyone but over 65 and those with special medical conditions?

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by red-beard

How can an employer require this, when the vaccine is not available to anyone but over 65 and those with special medical conditions?

At the bottom of the linked article:

“Once New York state allowed restaurant workers to receive the Covid-19 vaccine, we thought this was the perfect opportunity to put a plan in place to keep our team and guests safe.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Non vaccinated people don't necessarily become super spreaders.

You gave a lengthy essay on what you think proper procedure is to lessen the spread of covid but I didn't see a response to the original question. Care to weigh in on the topic?

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by HardDrive

This boils down to property rights for me. If a business owner says you have to be vaccinated to work there, or to use the facility, end of story.

So a property owner can mandate that you must be a Christian, or non smoker, or abstain from alcohol on or off their property to work on their property? Don't property rights end with discrimination or civil liberties of the employees?

[Tervuren]

Originally Posted by Tidybuoy

I think "forced" is when you hold someone down and stick them with the needle.

In this case, I would say that an employer has a right to require someone to be vaccinated before hiring. In this case, she was already hired so too bad for the employer but any future hires could have that requirement.

The problem arises if this scales.
If all the major corporations "unionized" on this issue and also required all dealers and suppliers in their chain to also make the same rquirement than that is a lot of force.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by Tidybuoy

I think "forced" is when you hold someone down and stick them with the needle.

You are word-smithing.
Coersion, intimidation, discrimination... do not involve physical action but are still illegal.

[Sooner or later]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

So a property owner can mandate that you must be a Christian, or non smoker, or abstain from alcohol on or off their property to work on their property? Don't property rights end with discrimination or civil liberties of the employees?

It is unlawful to discriminate based on a religion. In some states you can refuse to hire a smoker, there are no national guidelines An employer must be careful in the wording during an interview.

It is already lawful to require vaccinations if you meet national standards set by EEOC.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by PorscheGAL

In this case: I wonder if some of the issue is she informed her relatively new employer that she would not get the vaccine because she was trying to get pregnant? Maybe they saw this as a way to remove her from the payroll before she needed accommodations for being pregnant or maternity leave.

Which is illegal.

[Sooner or later]

Many rights are out the window when you punch the clock.

Free speech? Hell, no. They can tell you what to say and when to say it while on the clock. You can be chit canned for statement made away from work. We are seeing a barrage of those terminations.

Can you carry a gun at work? Up to the employer.

Can you be discriminated because of tattoos? Yep. Tattoos are not a protected class. You can be forced to cover them up.

There are protected classes. Race, color, religion, sex (including pregnancy, sexual orientation, or gender identity), national origin, age, disability and genetic information.

[Sooner or later]

it is perfectly legal to require employees to be vaccinated and has been that was for some time. You must be consistent throughout the organization and have exceptions allowed based on religious or medical reasons.

Nothing new.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Many rights are out the window when you punch the clock.

Free speech? Hell, no. They can tell you what to say and when to say it while on the clock. You can be chit canned for statement made away from work. We are seeing a barrage of those terminations.

Can you carry a gun at work? Up to the employer.

Can you be discriminated because of tattoos? Yep. Tattoos are not a protected class. You can be forced to cover them up.

There are protected classes. Race, color, religion, sex (including pregnancy, sexual orientation, or gender identity), national origin, age, disability and genetic information.

Agree to all of the above. Choosing whether to take medical treatment or to vaccinate has never been something an employer can dictate. People, politicians, and now companies are demanding all kinds of unreasonable things in the name of covid. I think this woman has a good case to sue.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

So a property owner can mandate that you must be a Christian, or non smoker, or abstain from alcohol on or off their property to work on their property?

Try getting a job at a Catholic school if you are an avowed Baptist. Or getting a job at a Baptist college if you are an avowed Muslim.

[Por_sha911]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Try getting a job at a Catholic school if you are an avowed Baptist. Or getting a job at a Baptist college if you are an avowed Muslim.

You will probably have a tough time but last I checked, they cannot legally refuse you employment exclusively on that.

[Sooner or later]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

Agree to all of the above. Choosing whether to take medical treatment or to vaccinate has never been something an employer can dictate. People, politicians, and now companies are demanding all kinds of unreasonable things in the name of covid. I think this woman has a good case to sue.

It has been something an employee can require.

Here is a hospital that fired 69 in 2017 that refused to comply with a flu mandate.
https://nurse.org/articles/nurses-fired-decline-flu-vaccine/

8 fired in 2013
https://abcnews.go.com/Health/indiana-hospital-fires-nurses-refusing-flu-shot/story?id=18116967

The EEOC Confirms You CAN Mandate a Vaccine, But SHOULD You?
Can employers mandate that employees receive a COVID-19 vaccine?

The answer is yes.

The EEOC’s updated guidance now addresses issues regarding “mandatory vaccinations” and makes clear that employers can mandate that employees get the COVID-19 vaccination. The justification for mandating vaccination, especially during the pandemic, is based on the premise that unvaccinated employees present a “direct threat” to others in the workplace. (K.5.).

Many employers are already stating that once the vaccine is widely available they may mandate a vaccine before employees can return to the office. However, as will be discussed below, even if a mandatory policy is enacted, employees may nonetheless be entitled to exemptions on the basis of disability or religious accommodation.

Do employers need a mandatory program?

The answer depends on your business.

If you run a business where your employees can safely work remotely or socially distance, you may not need it right away. On the other hand, if you run a retail business, school, a restaurant, or any similar business where employees circulate among each other or deal with the public, a mandatory vaccination program may beneficial to your operation. Many retail and customer facing industries believe that it will be a good advertisement if they can say that their employees are all vaccinated.

https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/the-eeoc-confirms-you-can-mandate-a-30818/

[Sooner or later]

Originally Posted by Por_sha911

You will probably have a tough time but last I checked, they cannot legally refuse you employment exclusively on that.

. Can I be denied employment by a religious organization on religious grounds?
Under certain circumstances, some religious institutions enjoy exemptions from federal laws covering religious discrimination. If the organization is a religious corporation, association, educational institution or society, then it is allowed under Title VII to hire only individuals of a particular religion to "perform work connected with the carrying on by such corporation, association, educational institution or society of its activities." For example, a Catholic school or university can require that all of the teachers it hires be Catholic.

While such exemptions may provide a defense to a discrimination claim based upon religion, religious institutions are not permitted to discriminate on grounds other than religion merely because of the institution's religious character. Therefore, a Baptist institution could hire only Baptists, but could not refuse to hire African-Americans or applicants with disabilities.

https://www.workplacefairness.org/religious-discrimination#16