My cousellor's name was Dr. Love. No kidding.

First meeting was with both of us, usual questions about expected outcomes.

Then he spent a half hour with just her.

She comes out in tears, and sits in waiting room while I go in for my half hour. Doc pulls out a bottle of scotch, pours both of us a stiff shot, and says, "How good is your insurance?" He said he could write a book on her. 6 months later we split up, and Dr. Love DID write a book, which included a chapter on her 'type', but could have been strict biography.

Now THAT is dark comedy.

A classic example of Karma. He was cheating, she was cheating, & the hammer came down.

Ian

As well the longer you wait, the more damage that is being done in her mind.

If you are going to call her, call her shortly. And hopefully when you are sure that the daughters are NOT around.

See if you can meet her for lunch and talk with each other, alone.

Nope, Karma would have both the ex wife and the gyny in the car with him riding the bus and witnessing the accident.

Sorry but this IS karma.

She knows what happened to the guy she screwed around with, and is now waiting for something to happen to her. She will be looking around her shoulder for a LONG time after this.

Non sequitor: ( i.e. hijack lol)

I worked in a failing state in the middle east in the late 1970's early 80's

There was a woman who worked on site with me.. she was in receiving lol

her name was (and I hope she is with us)

Brenda Goodnight....

Great friend and the life of any party...

<<That is all

After considering the sage advice here and doing much soul searching about what I want/need to do, I sent her flowers at work with a note that said "There is one question we need to answer: Do we want to save this marriage? I know what my answer is. Regardless of what your answer is we need to talk. Love, Jim"

The florist ( a mutual friend and a client) called me and said she though they were beautiful, read the note and said "We keep having the same problem over and over." He said she then picked up her cell phone and called someone but apparently didn't get an answer.

Can't read a whole lot into that. Or maybe you can.

At least she didn't throw them at him:D

The ball is in her court. Hope it works out well.

Yup. I can take comfort in the fact that no matter what the resolution, I will be fine.

No matter what, we'll be here for ya.

And there is always a Porsche run that can be made SmileWavy

If she feels that the problem is the same time after time, then you guys need to sit down and talk about it. Thus my comment about lunch.

If the problem is your anger, which you have admitted to, then YOU need to promise to her to get some help for it, but (and this is a big but) make sure she knows that if she was totally honest with you, that you would not be getting mad.

Personally I cannot deal with someone who is not honest with me. That said, you have put up with it for so long and only have a few months to go to hopefully get the girls out of the house, that it might be worth trying one last time to work it out.

Only if I can make my Porsche run:)

Not even a few months....school starts August 8.

The trial lawyer/chess player in makes me overly analytical. She is in a bit of a box. With all the drama over moving out with the girls she likely will feel she'll lose face with them if she attempts to work on it with me. Keep in mind there was no confrontation between me and the girls. I never demanded anybody move.

Plus think how disappointed the girls will be if mom upsets their playing house with bf's (that is where the girls are staying now) by telling them they can move back home with us. And it is clear these girls happiness is a top priority to my wife.

It will be interesting.

On a side note I just glanced at your sig, 1998 Buell S1W: Angriest motorcycle I've ever ridden.

So I googled it. One of the top hits is one for sale.

Nice Avatar the guy has

http://media.scout.com/media/forums/...cing-boobs.gif

Enjoy.

And I hope it all works out.

"angriest ...." comment was from a Ducuti monster owner who rode it one afternoon. My S1W is highly modded with cams, big bore yadadada....it spits and snarls like an angry bull.

I've been through this with my best friend multiple times, his wife is kinda psycho regarding her kids..
You might want to invite the wife back but not the girls... the big questions are;
Will she ever change?
Is all going to be good when the girls go to college ?
What about councelling ?

I was going to suggest flowers with your note . . .

Good luck, Jim.

Ian

Counseling is not something I would rule out. We actually have consulted the pastor that married us in a similar impasse before. Privately he told me the permissiveness was way beyond the norm (and he is a teen counsellor so he knows what parents are allowing). In our meeting together he basically said I needed to find a way to be involved in the girls' lives without being judgmental or emotional about their comings and goings. To wife he said she needed to understand how hurtful it was to exclude me from her life and the girls lives and realize I wwas much more important than she was demonstrating to me by the deception. That I needed to be more of a priority for her.

It was at that point we negotiated the rules of the house.

You say this based on your vast experience with relationships, counseling, knowing my situation? It took a 3rd party to help us realize that it was stupid to stay in an unhappy relationship "for the kids". That by doing so we were modeling the wrong behaviors to them, that we were both not happy and having unhappy parents together is worse than having happy parents apart. Best decision I've made in a long time. I'll always be grateful for that therapist being honest with the both of us and asking the right questions. For years I put my own happiness aside doing what I thought best for my family. I was an idiot and got taken for a long unhappy ride.

From last year: http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/448730-ok-get-ready-hammer-me-my-latest-how-do-i-deal-mom-my-step-kids-wh.html

It is normal to get upset if you are not respected and lied to. Dueller's issue is that he is a pushover and will never get respect in this relationship. The fact that he sends flowers and makes contact is proof. And it looks like we have a whole crew of whipped guys on the board that applaud such a bonehead move ...

In all seriousness, Dueller, I would GTFO! AAMOF would have done so long time ago. Life is short. You can do better. These women will chew you up and spit you out when they are done with you. I hope she has made the decision for you.

All the best,

George

When you offer to take her to London for New Years and she say's no (I went anyway and glad I did), then find she's F***ing your buddy the mega millionaire, but also find out she's also been the mistress of a senior partner at Patton, Boggs L.L.P. for the last 10 years. That's OK. She took them both for a ton of $$$ and found out I was giving her the high hard one every chance she got. That was the best revenge. :D

Jim,

I suspect that anger is a root cause here...and getting help for that, for yourself is the best answer.. you are not doing it for her. Its for yourself.. if she likes the result.. great... if not you have an easier and happier life...a win win..

Go for it and suit yourself for a change...

Best

Wrong. It is merely a good political move. 'Know thine enemy' He is wise to approach with a peace offering. And to apologize for HIS part in this. If you know the female of the species at all, you know that you have to break the logjam BEFORE you can even have a meaningful conversation. His gesture doesn't signify capitulation at all, it just softens the tension.

Ian

The following is a downsized (cleaned up) statement from my wife:

That b*#%@!!!!! I'll bet she was calling her attorney! (Wife is fuming mad!!!)

She is lying to him, deceiving him, it is the same thing as if she were cheating on him!!! It destroys relationships, kills trust!! She left him, she moved out, he never asked her to move out! What is her d$&# signal to him???

Dump the b&$*@!! He can do better! I hate nice guys finishing last!!!



Oh, and my Wife almost never curses!!

Just a stupid question from me: How many marraiges for your wife? Why did it/they end?

One prior marriage...ended about 10-12 years ago. Reason? Various but primarily drugs and lying (him). I know its her version but it has been substantially corroborated as accurate.

Lying is a relationship killer.

However it turns out, Jim, best wishes for your long-term happiness.

Snow tires;)

thanks, Jim

+1

Dude,
Get help.

As noted above, I would be getting ready should she have already called a lawyer and be making a split.

If you have a joint account and there is a lot in there, might think about taking half. Same with other assets. Anything really expensive that is yours at home, move it to the storage locker that you are going to rent.

If she returns home, be careful of "spousal abuse" situations and if things get difficult call the police and tell them you want help moving out that you are afraid of a false claim against you.

Being ready for a difficult situation does not mean its going to happen. Hope it does not but if it does it puts you in a better position to land on your feet. She has played games with you for far too long now, its time to regain at least 50% control.

Easy for me to armchair quarterback the situation but here goes. Deal with your anger issues. Don't do it for her, do it for yourself. Nothing negative can come from that. Make an appointment and let her know. You're not apologizing for anything, you're being proactive with a self-admitted issue. If she doesn't want the marriage to continue, nothing will save it. End of story. But, you'll be helping yourself in the long run. Tough situation. The girls will always come first with her. Forever. Seems like the need to protect is only going to increase now that their dad is gone. Hang in there. Making the first step in alleviating--or trying to alleviate--personal issues you have that add to the problem is hard, but it's the right thing to do.

+1

My folks breathed a lot easier when I was done with college, but that's because I finished early and didn't ask them for money afterwards. My sister was the opposite and my folks were a LOT tougher on us than your wife sounds to be on her girls. I vividly remember my dad asking for his credit card back and telling me I was on my own right after graduation. I don't see that happening with those girls. They will be living with your wife again. Mark my words. And I still believe Ian's room monkeys will move back in with him too. Besides, if their being away really makes your life that much easier, then that's an issue in itself.

Your dad gave you his credit card!?

For emergencies only and with a $500 limit on it. I had to use it once too when a fuel pump died (his car) on the way home from Pittsburgh.

I missed a Rush concert in Phiily that night because of that!

If that's what it takes to make a relationship work call me P.W.

Any married man who claims to not be whipped is in denial.;)

My dad gave me a no limit card on his account. Now it is only used for fuel and the few times I have used it for other stuff I called and checked with him first.

When I was in college, and later graduate school, my parents gave me a credit card that they paid. I never saw the bills. I have no idea what the limit on it was, but I'm sure it was high.

They also gave me an ATM card linked to an account that always had plenty of money in it. I never saw the account statements for the account, I just know that no matter how much I withdrew, there was always plenty left!

I was free to spend it however I saw fit. They never once mentioned spending, or limits to me. Never had to. I spent as little of it as possible. I never viewed it as my money to waste.

You forgot the green font. For real? I knew kids like this in prep school. But it was unimagineable in my family.

Of course, I had keep it a secret that I worked during college because my folks thought they gave me enough money at the beginnng of each semester, which I had usually pissed away in the first two week on music equipment and booze.