Why would the dealer weld, not replace, this part?

Emission · Emission's Garage

Last week I replaced the motor mounts on my '86 930. While removing one of the mounts, the engine support bracket snapped off while I was trying to unscrew the bolt from the mount. I assumed I had cranked on my wrench too hard... but then something caught my eye...

As I removed the engine support bracket, I noticed there was rust on the steel - and evidence of welding! After digging through the service records, I found the local dealer (Rusnak in Westlake Village) had TIG welded the bracket in July of 1998. There was no explanation of why it was broken - or why it was repaired.

I am confused. The replacement part was about $95. It was a PIA to remove and replace, but certainly safer than welding a broken engine support! What if their weld had broken while I was on the track?

P.S. - While I was replacing the engine mount, I found two nuts, a rubber gasket, and a rotor (as in cap and rotor) buried in the engine compartment. I dug them out with my grabber tool. Prior to me owning the car, it was 100% dealer serviced! Sloppy workmanship.

Sonic dB · Sonic dB's Garage

Consider yourself lucky it didnt break while driving it.

Did you own the car at the time it was serviced? If I were you Id go back there and ***** just to let them know that it was wrong...also Id send a letter to the service dept. Even though its been a few years since they did it, its a dangerous practice if the welds can break that easily. You may save the next guy.

Thats what DIY is for... we dont pay dumbasses a bunch of $$ to not do the work properly.

Emission · Emission's Garage

I've owned the car for twelve months (since 5/2002), and it hasn't seen the dealer since I drove it home and parked it in my garage (100% DIY - so far - I am proud to say).

Until recently, I was one of the many who was naive enough to think the best work was done by the dealer...

yelcab1 · 05-20-2003, 02:58 AM

Dealers don't touch any of my cars.

ChrisBennet · ChrisBennet's Garage

I think welding those brackets is fairly common though the break is usually right near the end. A good weld should be just as strong I'd think. Maybe a welder like Blown can weigh in on this.
-Chris

911nut · 911nut's Garage

When I was an inexperienced new owner I broke mine while trying to perform a partial engine drop.
The mounting bolt tends to seize in the threads over time. I installed the new one and used liberal amounts of anti-seize on the bolts.
A local wrench told me at the time that he disconnected the cross mount from the bracket on the back of the engine to avoid this issue.

dean · 05-20-2003, 04:23 AM

It is hard to tell but I don't think that was tig welded. It looks more like a bad gas weld. If that was welded properly it shouldn't of broken. And dealer mechanics are only human. And some humans suck. I would only go to a dealer for warrentee work and then very reluctantly

cab83_750 · 05-20-2003, 06:08 AM

Not experienced yet with welding but to quote my book:

"Welded parts should be as strong or STRONGER than the original."

cab83_750 · 05-20-2003, 06:11 AM

P.S.,

We are neighbors! I often see this guy with a brand new SUV from ?????? and painted on the mirrors: "????????? screwed me!

HawgRyder · HawgRyder's Garage

I agree with Blown....looks like someone welded it with gas and a coathanger wire!!
I have welded one of these before....with Mig....and it still is in the car (about 10 years now).
I also agree with the anti-seize....if you have qualms about it...use it and then lock wire the bolt.
Bob

john walker's workshop · 05-20-2003, 07:25 AM

there's no way to keep that end from turning when the threads seize, so they break occasionally. i just mig them back together. my welds sure look better than that one.

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

I busted mine when I did my first engine drop. I ordered a replacement crossmember from a used parts place, which shall remain nameless. Of course, as always happens to me, they sent me the wrong one for my '87 3.2. But the holes were not threaded. So I just bought longer bolts, washers and nuts and it works fine. Now there's no danger of the threads seizing and bending or snapping the welded joint there at the end.

Emission · Emission's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by cab83_750
P.S.,

We are neighbors! I often see this guy with a brand new SUV from ?????? and painted on the mirrors: "????????? screwed me!

Ah... That's not me...

Emission · Emission's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Richard LeSchander
"...the holes were not threaded. So I just bought longer bolts, washers and nuts and it works fine. Now there's no danger of the threads seizing and bending or snapping the welded joint there at the end."

This is actually a much better approach. You don't make the engine brace a stressed part of the assembly when you crank it back.

Mine now have liberal amounts of anti-seize, and I'll be "exercising" them every so often.

Randy Webb · 05-20-2003, 09:47 AM

If you had been injured by the break the dealer would be on the hook -- even if you didn't own the car when the work was done. I would write a letter to the dealer anyway, and see what they do. If nothing else, it will let them know what might have happened and maybe they will be more careful.

ruf-porsche · ruf-porsche's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Emission

As I removed the engine support bracket, I noticed there was rust on the steel - and evidence of welding! After digging through the service records, I found the local dealer (Rusnak in Westlake Village) had TIG welded the bracket in July of 1998. There was no explanation of why it was broken - or why it was repaired.

I am confused. The replacement part was about $95. It was a PIA to remove and replace, but certainly safer than welding a broken engine support! What if their weld had broken while I was on the track?

The dealer could have found the mount already broken and asked the PO what he wanted done. The PO could have asked the shop what could be done and the shop explain the options, fix by welding, or fix by replacing.

Obviously the PO chose fix by welding and that what the shop did and what they billed the PO for.

Emission · Emission's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Randy Webb
If you had been injured by the break the dealer would be on the hook -- even if you didn't own the car when the work was done. I would write a letter to the dealer anyway, and see what they do. If nothing else, it will let them know what might have happened and maybe they will be more careful.

I agree with you and "Sonic dB", a letter to the dealer makes sense. I will send them a pic and a note.

KTL · 05-20-2003, 10:11 AM

If you look closely at the picture (or your own part), you'll see that the mount is actually welded together where the cylinder meets the flat stock. But the bar doesn't break there. It breaks beyond the welds.

Hi, my name is Kevin and i've broken a seized mount too........

I had someone straighten and weld the old one. Now I use it instead of the new one for lifting the motor with our cherry picker.

Superman · 05-20-2003, 11:35 AM

Mine twisted like a candy cane when I first removed the engine. Apparently it had last been installed by Hercules. Good thing I'm Superman.

Sure, the dealer might have had that discussion with the PO, the PO chose welding, and the dealer charged them. Sure. I'd bet against steep odds that this is not what happened. If the damage were pre-existent, I think the dealer would have goven the PO just one option.

Welds should be WAY stronger than that.